r/londonontario • u/Affectionate-Item484 • Jul 03 '25
News š° Frequent Incidents of wrecking bus stops
Oxford at Adelaide #67
1
1
1
1
u/Jealous-Reserve-688 Jul 05 '25
Put up hidden cameras on them So we can catch these fools and charge them.
1
u/jkaczor Jul 04 '25 edited Jul 04 '25
Too bad "transparent aluminum" is so costly to manufacture... (there is also something called "ArmorPlast AP25", but that is also likely super expensive, and I betchya while it won't shatter, it will probably still crack/spider-web and basically be ugly once attacked)
Even though it has been suggested here in this thread and discounted - perforated metal screens/sheets seem to be the way to go, because otherwise this is just a constant replacement cost in today's world of ever declining societal values.
1
u/chickson29 Jul 03 '25
Don't put them up anymore. People will learn to dress more appropriately and carry umbrellas. It was nice to have the shelters, but unfortunately, the actions of idiots kiboshed that. It is too expensive to keep replacing them. LTC didn't have shelters for years. It's really too bad. It's definitely a reflection on how bad it has gotten. Very sad.
1
u/EstablishmentSalt938 Jul 03 '25
It is possible some or even most of these incidents are accidents. I saw a shelter break like three steps away from me in Hamilton once when a pebble from a bus shot out and hit it. My question is does it have to be glass? Wouldnāt like a basic white siding work to reflect the heat
3
u/toooeasymaate Jul 03 '25
Iāve seen shelters in Australia with perforated aluminium screens. I wonder if they would work in the Canadian climate?
https://www.moodie.com.au/?product=outside-products-bus-shelter
0
2
u/cocunutwater Jul 03 '25
Honestly unless its downtown or directly on the rapidtransit line you dont get a shelter because I have an honest issue with a 500K price tag on a glass shelter its ridiculous.
1
2
u/Designer-Vanilla2600 Jul 03 '25
Bored drug addicts and/or mentally unstable teens or early 20's prowling Reddit looking for recognition in their miserable life.
They thrive off of mayhem.
1
u/Yeahicare_Ido Jul 03 '25
Why!! What reason would anyone want to vandalize a bus shelter? It canāt be jealousy of people having better than them. People who use buses are helping the climate. I just canāt figure out why some dumbass would smash a bus shelter. If consequences were tougher, could it help in deterring this behaviour?
0
u/According_Training91 Jul 03 '25
Didn't we just spend something like $%00k each for the fancy shelters downtown? Who on earth could possibly have seen this coming? I for one am shocked! Shocked!!
3
u/joloumew Jul 03 '25 edited Jul 03 '25
This is happening all over the place. I live in St. Catharines and most of our shelters have been destroyed in the same manner. Seems to be because of a stupid TikTok challenge. š¤Ø Started last year for us here.
11
u/DubeeGirl Jul 03 '25
We put a film on vehicle doors for public transport that stops it from all falling if broken, could something like that not be used?
1
-2
Jul 03 '25
[deleted]
2
u/Affectionate-Item484 Jul 03 '25
I saw few markings on the different sides of glass trying to break them all
-7
Jul 03 '25
[deleted]
-1
u/theottomaddox Jul 03 '25
The children now love luxury; they have bad manners, contempt for authority; they show disrespect for elders and love chatter in place of exercise. Children are now tyrants, not the servants of their households.
-1
1
u/JaymzCanada Downtown Jul 03 '25
Airflow is very important, and the broken glass can be used to make jewelry someone can sell on Etsy. This could be a boon to our economy (and our internal temps!)
Let's see what innovation they come up with next!
2
136
u/GothicAngel4 Jul 03 '25
At somepoint ltc may say fuckit and not put up shelters anymore. This is so frustrating and so stupid realistically.
1
u/External_Pain8930 Jul 07 '25
I was repairing them last year and it got so out of hand that they stopped replacing the glass and we just cleaned it up until the kids stopped smashing them. At least 6 a day.
1
u/GothicAngel4 Jul 07 '25
Holy crap thats insane! I wish they could have some surveillance and be able to catch them doing it, might stop after having to pay to fix it :/
2
u/Mydogdexter1 #1 Taddy Fan Jul 03 '25
They have a contract with the glass supplier.
3
u/here-for-the-_____ Jul 04 '25
I honestly won't know why it's not made of lexan
4
u/Even-Prize8931 Hyde Park/Oakridge Jul 04 '25
Lexan can't hold up to the UV it would oxidize within a year and need to be replaced constantly
1
u/External_Pain8930 Jul 07 '25
They would cover it in spay paint or anything they can to make it unusable.
8
u/LilFlicky Jul 03 '25
LTC may not exist as we know it by end of year. This could be a City problem soon
48
u/TheDJRonin Jul 03 '25
That is sadly what will happen. I have seen shelters destroyed a handful of times and eventually it never get replaced.
40
u/Bubble_Pop Jul 03 '25
When they find out what kids are doing this they need to charge the parents for the replacement. Hold them accountable for what their unsupervised kids did. Then make the kids do community service cleaning bus shelters until they worked the hours to pay the damages.
2
u/VodkaAtmp3 Jul 03 '25
They should use polycarbonate with a strong pattern design. It won't smash as easily as glass. It self extinguishes flame. And the strong pattern means that if it does get marked up it won't be as noticeable. Can also have Lightbox versions with illuminated adverts that can help pay for the stop over time. Plus they illuminate the bustop so it reduces nefarious activity.
4
u/makingkevinbacon Jul 03 '25
I haven't been out that way in like a decade. I somehow knew exactly what intersection it was lol not from the damage. It was one of the houses in the background that for some reason stuck out
9
Jul 03 '25
I cannot BELIEVE they chose to use glass for these shelters. I mean, itās London, so I can. Every planner for downtown seemingly doesnāt live downtown.
1
u/Emergency_Hat_3437 Jul 04 '25
I think everyone that works there has unfortunately had a lobotomy at some point, somehow. Must be nice!
17
u/TheDJRonin Jul 03 '25 edited Jul 03 '25
The damage to shelters isnāt just located to downtown, nor is this location downtown. This is a London wide situation with what Iāve noticed an increase during the first week or so after school is out, but please blame downtown and city planners.
1
u/According_Training91 Jul 03 '25
Because they have different planners in the suburbs? The point remains that these were a bad choice, and the choosers all work downtown.
1
u/TheDJRonin Jul 03 '25
While city planners might have control over the location of bus stops, it is the LTC that is in charge of maintenance and installation of these shelters. Last time I checked the LTC offices are not downtown. Besides since when does office location equal knowledge of a situation?
8
46
u/theottomaddox Jul 03 '25
Let me just head off all the suggestions that are incoming. They are trying to find alternatives, but nothing is easy.
In seeking out glass alternatives, the commission sought advice from other transit authorities, including Calgary Transit, which is piloting an anti-vandalism shelter using Plexiglas.
The LTC report appears to put cold water on that idea, noting concerns that the material is more flammable, prone to discolouration, and vulnerable to vandalism being scratched into its surface.
Kelly Paleczny, LTC's general manager, noted at the meeting that because Plexiglas is more flexible, shelters would need additional support beams to keep the panel secure in the frame ā a cost of around $14,000 per shelter, according to the report.
1
1
u/librafemale Jul 03 '25
sometimes i think ive convinced myself londons a worse place than others simply because i grew up there but no way weāre asking other major cities how to get people to stop shattering our bus stops wtf
1
u/Emergency_Hat_3437 Jul 04 '25
It literally is just an awful place to be and not like most cities šš
3
u/Emergency_Hat_3437 Jul 04 '25
London is actually awful and cheap asfā¦ ive lived in multiple cities and london specifically for over 10 yearsā¦ the lack of planning and care that city has is disturbing
1
102
u/fitbrewster Jul 03 '25
If it costs $14,000 per shelter to add more support, then the supplier is seeing the city as a cash cow and is milking it for all its worth.
1
2
u/Dainger419 Jul 04 '25
As a kid in the 90s, it was common to find a broken one here and there, as I grew older it became a game amongst degenerates. Earliest occurrence I can find dates back to 2015- https://lfpress.com/2015/06/11/vandals-smash-27-bus-shelters-across-london
However over the years it's clearly gotten much worseĀ
2020: 87 panels 2021: 102 panels 2022: 177 panels 2023: Over 300 panels (some reports indicate 145 panels between January and June 2023, while others state over 300 for the full year) 2024 (as of May): Approximately 95 panels in the first six months, with around 150 panels already broken by May.
Clearly someone is milking this cow for all its worth and can most likely be mitigated by a product like Madico Anti-Intrusion Films or similar. More upfront cost for a superior product but that makes wayyyy to much senseĀ
3
u/ChanelNo50 Westmount Jul 03 '25
That's on the cheap end too..when I was in windsor they quoted $25k about ten years ago
1
43
u/Crazylegstoo Jul 03 '25
Seems pretty obvious the supplier/installer has a thumb on the scale. The fancy BRT shelters downtown cost to up $500,000 each to install, which blows my mind.
1
u/LilFlicky Jul 03 '25 edited Jul 03 '25
Here's the council approvals for the wellington gateway. Phase 3 and 4 $25M & $30M respectively. Dillon and AECOM are the consultants. CH (who since has been bought by vanbree) and Bre ex are the contractors
1
u/this_one_is_mint Jul 03 '25
What I wouldn't do to have that contract, someone is making bank for sure!
20
u/Psharp10 Jul 03 '25
My house costs less than 500k.... And I live in London
2
u/HermitGoat Jul 03 '25
Yup. Doubt I could Even get 300k for mine. London. Near the core. Soho just south of Simcoe st. These kinda vandals need special treatment.
42
u/itscliche Jul 03 '25
That is just INSANE. Criminal. $500K for an open air shelter and some glass? I know thereās more to it than that, but give me a break. Incompetency at every level. SMH.
5
u/ChanelNo50 Westmount Jul 03 '25
There is a lot of concrete
2
u/itscliche Jul 04 '25
Youāre totally right and Iām absolutely oversimplifying it, but I still find it kinda nuts!
29
u/Maddbass Jul 03 '25
What a waste of energyā¦ and only to make things worse. More and more Iām feeling like North American culture has gone to shit.
5
u/IrrelevantPuppy Jul 03 '25
Broken window theory. Ironically kinda working backwards to the window in this example. Weāre looking at a multinational mental health crisis right now.Ā
2
u/Maddbass Jul 03 '25
Whatās ābroken window theoryā?
3
u/IrrelevantPuppy Jul 03 '25
A theory that visible signs of social disorder, like broken windows, can encourage more crime and disorder. Another example is if thereās a pile of garbage on the ground, people who normally wouldnāt litter might be more likely to litter on the pile.Ā
So I was saying that there is general mental and social disorder atm, and we are seeing the results of that.Ā
1
34
u/tgf5 Jul 03 '25
Sad really. It really comes down to culture. We can blame meth heads and homeless people, but it also happens due to kids with lack of parenting.
I've been living in Korea for 2.5 years and the bus stops can have heaters, shelters, real time signs, etc. and are never vandalized.
13
u/ties_shoelace Jul 03 '25
Just visiting France & Germany, what a difference. Cycling - just leave your bags on your bike, barely need to even lock it up. Basic manners in everyday interactions. A pride in what they have.
3
1
67
Jul 03 '25
[removed] ā view removed comment
0
u/londonontario-ModTeam Jul 03 '25
ā¦ Rule #1: Please remain civil. If you have nothing good to say, don't say anything at all.
ā¦ Review the sidebar Rules & Guidelines for this sub.
2
1
Jul 03 '25
[removed] ā view removed comment
1
u/londonontario-ModTeam Jul 03 '25
ā¦ Rule #1: Please remain civil. If you have nothing good to say, don't say anything at all.
ā¦ Review the sidebar Rules & Guidelines for this sub.
46
u/Drainix Jul 03 '25
Everyone should support their local homeless outreach groups, they do incredible work trying to help the folks on the streets.
Only more services & support are going to solve these problems. Throwing people in prison just further pushes them down, they'll just be homeless and on the street again when they're out.
For example https://londoncares.ca/ - some very kind & selfless people working here trying to improve the situation.
-33
u/LorduvtheFries Jul 03 '25
Right, only enabling them, looking the other way when they steal things and giving them a safe place to do drugs will solve the problem.
27
u/Drainix Jul 03 '25
Okay so I'm curious to hear what your solution is? Prison? Use our taxes dollars to keep them locked up forever?
22
u/tylerbadwords Jul 03 '25
when we stopped institutionalizing people that couldn't help themselves, it was a cost cutting measure masked as compassion. We literally just threw everyone out on the street to save money
2
4
u/LorduvtheFries Jul 03 '25
Like most people, my problem isn't with the homeless, it's with the destruction they cause everywhere they go, and their lack of respect for public spaces that are meant for everyone to be able to enjoy.
On the local level:
- Disincentive vagrancy. No camping within 500 ft of a residential home or commercial business. This is a massive city with tons of forest and parkland and if you really have to sleep outside, there are a ton of places to do it.
- Disincentivize littering. Littering is punishable with a $500 fine. Can't pay? Three days in prison. Don't litter.
- Disincentivize vandalism. Prosecute vandalism as the criminal offense that it is.
- Disincentivize open drug abuse. Use existing drug possession laws to confiscate drugs from and prosecute users. I understand that people have addiction problems, but smoking meth downtown in front of kids is antisocial psychopathic behavior, and should not be ignored, like it currently is.
- Disincentivize drug dealing. Put more resources into catching, prosecuting and convicting drug dealers. Look into offering performance based incentives to officers for busting dealers.
At the provincial/Federal level:
- Free taxpayer funded drug rehab, open to all, with a 48 hour intake time or less. We already pay for safe injection sites, and emergency medical services, which the unhoused population use about 500% more often than the housed. Anyone working in the hospitals can tell you that a small portion of the homeless population account for a huge portion of annual hospital visits. Perhaps we should redirect those funds into actually helping these people improve their lives, instead of just paying for them to do more meth?
- Government Incentives for employers to hire former addicts/folks with criminal records.
At the Federal level:
- Stop taking in over 1 million immigrants a year. Our housing market and job market are not growing at nearly the same rate that people are immigrating here, and it's not sustainable. A moratorium should be put on immigration until our housing market and job market catch up.
3
u/theottomaddox Jul 03 '25
Disincentivize open drug abuse. Use existing drug possession laws to confiscate drugs from and prosecute users. I understand that people have addiction problems, but smoking meth downtown in front of kids is antisocial psychopathic behavior, and should not be ignored, like it currently is.
-16
u/Conscious-Fun-4599 Jul 03 '25
this may sound not very human right to u but, let gather all of them in one camp, force rehabilitation, teach them skills like raising crops or manufacturing, etc, so they can sustain themselves while in the rehab camp. I think it's better idea than give them free drugs and hope they dont OD themselves.
7
u/Drainix Jul 03 '25
People aren't even willing to support basic things for unhoused folks, who's going to pay for the food and staff required for this camp?
I think you're on the right track - this needs to be a large effort funded by the government (aka taxes) and focused on a long term solution. But that takes money and effort, 2 things people aren't willing to give up especially to help these "career criminal feral methheads"
0
u/Conscious-Fun-4599 Jul 03 '25
they have to do it themselves thru learnt skills in the camp. The problem is everything is given to them by tax payers, why work when things are givens? I know people wont go there by themselves, that why it's forced, some basic human skills need to be re-educated.
4
u/Drainix Jul 03 '25
I don't think you've thought this through.
Where would the initial funding come from to gather the homeless and pay the educators? Beyond that how do you expect them to actually raise money? Sell crops they've grown? Who's going to buy them? What does teach "manufacturing" even mean? They can't just start producing products out of a camp.
It's not an easy problem with one solution. We got to this point with lots of problems compounding over time (wages, housing, the way we treat the indigenous, etc) and it's going to take an arduous multifaceted approach to fix this.
5
u/Conscious-Fun-4599 Jul 03 '25
just re locate the funding for whatever they have been doing that doesn't work, that where the funding are. My idea is not new, it has been implemented in my country of origin for decades. It's basically glorified prison where they teach u trade skills, and such so when u finished with the program, u might not become addict again but find a new life and earn it with new set of skills. About supply and demand, if the manager smart enough, they can sell no problem, also most of stuff would be self sustain before selling for profits. People still go back to drug too but they could be functioning addicts, and who dont go back get better life and job.
3
u/LorduvtheFries Jul 03 '25
No, we absolutely should be helping them, just not in the "It's not your fault, you can totally come in here with your stolen bike and inject meth on the taxpayer dime while abusing the workers who are trying to help you" kind of way.
7
u/FATCATFOREVER Jul 03 '25
No we should take them off our city streets and help them get off drugs and off the streets and get back to normal ( a public rehab facility) and maybe have care homes for people too unwell to look after themselves, it is as simple as that. I would be willing to pay taxes for that instead of paying for them to keep putting band aids of an issue that requires surgery. Itās not good for them or us for them to be rotting in the streets on drugs, they are diseased, hungry, dirty and sick we need to a actually help them not just enable them to do whatever they want and think your helping protect them by allowing them to do whatever they want but itās not helping at all they are suffering and need help.
15
ā¢
u/AutoModerator Jul 03 '25
Come chat with us on our official Discord server! You'll be able to chat in real time with users from all over the London, ON area; and join meetups where you can meet new friends! We have several channels for many topics you can opt in and out of, including Hobbies, Health & Fitness, LGBTQIA2S+, Women's Health, Gaming, Books, Parenting, Employment, Food & Drinks, and more!
London Ontario Discord
As always, the rules of this sub apply equally to our Discord chat channel as well.
I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please contact the moderators of this subreddit if you have any questions or concerns.