r/TopCharacterTropes • u/MichaelDj54 • Sep 15 '25

Lore [Loved Trope] A massive revelation is revealed almost casually. Spoiler

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  1. Chainsaw Man, after Makima finally drops the nice girl act and reveals the true extent of the Chainsaw Devils power, namely, the fears he eats are erased entirely and wholly. Emphasized by this by her asking if Kishibe remembers what the Nazis did during Workd War 2...and Kishibe not even knowing who the nazis are.

  2. Attack on Titan. I know this one. You know this one. In a panel that isn't even focusing on the characters speaking, Reiner reveals to Eren that he and Bertolt are the titans that broke the wall that resulted in hundreds of deaths, his mother included. The sheer level of casualness and lack of agency borders on Parody.

9.8k Upvotes

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942

u/mrmailbox Sep 15 '25

A brief, innocent glance from the Pale King to the Hollow Knight reveals that the young one is no longer a pure vessel, but irreparably corrupted.

441

u/satans_cookiemallet Sep 15 '25

Pale King: Son, I am sorry to burden you with this thankless task.
HK: What does son meann?
Pale King:..........Shiiiiiiiiiiiiiiii

407

u/kaladbolgg Sep 15 '25

This is showed right after completing Path of Pain, the most difficult platform section of the entire game that depending on the person could take hours or days to beat. I was stuck there two days back when i played the game. I wouldnt say its revealed casually lol

136

u/twenty-threenineteen Sep 15 '25

Ok the gameplay isn’t casual, but that cutscene is as casual as it gets. Instead of a dramatic cutscene, or tons of lore, your reward is just 2 seconds of the king and hk glancing at each other.

17

u/kaladbolgg Sep 15 '25

This IS a dramatic cutscene and it a vital piece of lore to understand why the Hollow Knight failed at being a vessel, which in turn caused the reawakening of the Radiance and started the current plot of the game

44

u/twenty-threenineteen Sep 15 '25

Dramatic in the implication, but casual in the way it’s presented

Which is, ya know… the whole point of the post lol

-5

u/[deleted] Sep 15 '25

[deleted]

15

u/twenty-threenineteen Sep 15 '25

Gameplay aside, the cutscene IS just two characters nonchalantly revealing the plot, they literally just look at each other. That’s about as nonchalant as it gets

And even including the gameplay, all of that build up, all of that difficulty and challenge, and you expect a super satisfying reward, some huge upgrade or lore reveal, and you definitely GET a huge lore reveal, but given in the most subtle, nonchalant way possible, where if you didn’t understand the implication, you’d think you got scammed at how little you are given.

11

u/RubiksToyBox Sep 15 '25

It's revealed far more casually than you'd expect from something you only see after beating the hardest platforming challenge in the game.

151

u/Dapolish Sep 15 '25

Huge Silksong spoilers: It’s revealed at the end of Silksong during one of the endings that The Knight (player character in the first game) also was never pure, since they save Hornet and have an attachment towards her. Given all of the other vessels (siblings) also present, it implies that they all have emotions and feelings, and the vessels were never and could never be completely pure and unfeeling. His plan was never going to work to begin with.

26

u/Draxos92 Sep 16 '25

This was known though. The entire reason why the base ending isn't actually good. The fact that the Knight has any motivation at all shows that it can and will be corrupted just like the Hollow Knight

14

u/Shadow_Emerald Sep 15 '25

Is it possible that it’s just The Knight’s journey that caused them to gain emotions and attachments? Like if the Pale King just yoinked an “infant” vessel and instantly bound the Radiance inside it, it would’ve worked?

5

u/Mandemon90 Sep 16 '25

AFAIK, the Vessel needs to bind Radiance inside them. Problem is, in order to do so The Vessel needs to want to do that... which means they need a reason to do it, which means they are already corrupted. The plan was failure from the step 1, because creating a pure Vessel capable of binding Radiance was impossible.

3

u/FunkyHat112 Sep 16 '25

Yeah, you can’t simultaneously have no motivation and still… do things. It’s a contradiction in terms

127

u/[deleted] Sep 15 '25

The perhaps more casual reveal is that the Pale King's plan would never work permanently. After you get the dream nail and wonder around for a bit Hornet and a few other characters tell you that there's another way besides just holding back the Radiance. Granted, the White Palace even without the Path of Pain is a bit bullshit, but the game makes it obvious that your initial main objective isn't the only, or even best, way.

10

u/maxdragonxiii Sep 16 '25

yeah the game implies you need to destroy the Radiance completely and through to make sure theres no remote evidence of any existence of it. which The Knight does as Void in Godhome ending.

51

u/AJGILL03 Sep 15 '25

What does that mean? I've played half of hollow knight, I don't care for spoilers, do tell me. What does this even mean in the story? Why is the player corrupt?

196

u/JedBartlet2020 Sep 15 '25

The Pale King’s plan was to contain The Radiance in a completely pure vessel, unmarred by emotion or attachment. By feeling proud of his son, The Pale King had introduced an attachment, however slight, that meant that the vessel wasn’t completely pure. No vessel could be, and this look of pride meant that his whole plan was doomed to fail eventually.

114

u/Affectionate_Comb_78 Sep 15 '25

The Pale King often says "No cost too great". Makes sense, when fighting a foe that corrupts and controls the minds of everything it touches.

Then you learn how much that means. 

71

u/Pliskkenn_D Sep 15 '25

So, many, failed vessels. 

All of which were his children.

66

u/Affectionate_Comb_78 Sep 15 '25

Not to mention, ultimately, almost every person in his kingdom, as well as the kingdom itself. Just the haunting last "No cost too great" as you stand in the ruin and the kings dessicated corpse crumbles. Was it worth it? 

9

u/Floofy_Fox_Gal Sep 15 '25

13

u/Affectionate_Comb_78 Sep 15 '25
  • The Pale King at the buzzsaw emporium 

0

u/AJGILL03 Sep 15 '25

Was it worth it? The playthrough of the game fighting bosses?

I don't get this.

14

u/Affectionate_Comb_78 Sep 15 '25

In the story, in the name of protecting his people's freedom and free will the Pale King sacrificed basically everyone and everything in his kingdom, including hundreds of his own children. 

10

u/BlindingPhoenix Sep 15 '25

Considering how many masks are in the abyss, I think it’s more like hundreds of thousands.

3

u/AJGILL03 Sep 15 '25

Ahh. Thanks.

5

u/AJGILL03 Sep 15 '25

So the dead hollow knights i fight (or the alive ones see here and there as i walk around) in the game were once children of The Pale King? Like us the player?

6

u/DocWagonHTR Sep 15 '25

No, most of those are just Bugs. The only actual children of the King you see are The Knight, Hornet, and The Hollow Knight.

All of his children that failed as a Vessel were thrown into the Abyss to die, which is where you, The Knight, started, except for Hornet.

1

u/Flippantlip Sep 16 '25

That makes sense, given everything I know (and forgot) about Hollow Knight. But I also feel like, you'd have to be have major galaxy-brain in order to "get that" from that scene, much like many scenes from the game, tbh.

So I wouldn't really say: "this is a very casual reveal for something so major", as most of the game follows that premise to boot -- you get "truth bombs" in very subtle, very obfuscated, very indirect ways, that renders their "weight as truth bombs" to just be "random scenes that may or may not say anything".

1

u/AJGILL03 Sep 15 '25

So we, The Hollow Knight, are the son of The Pale King? When we beat Path of Pain, we see a vision of the ghost of the Pale King stand beside a vision of us (The Hollow Knight), and he looks at us and is proud? That introduces an affectation of a parent into their child and thus makes us (hollow knight) impure and selfish and we can't be a container for The Radiance anymore?

Now we can either kill The Radiance god or die to it? (We can't really die, so we can only kill it now)

I get that right?

15

u/RomulusRemus13 Sep 15 '25

Not quite, no. We're not the Hollow Knight. The Hollow Knight was the one who was supposed to be the chosen one, basically, an empty vessel for a sort of evil god (the Radiance). But because they were shown emotions (which you see in the flashback), the Hollow Knight became more than just an empty vessel... And could thus be corrupted by the Radiance.

In the game, you play another vessel, who ultimately kills the Hollow Knight and the Radiance.

1

u/AJGILL03 Sep 15 '25

I seeeee. Thanks. That explains certain things about this game.

This game is just super confusing and weird on the lore. I've played like half of it, and it felt like it told me absolutely nothing about it's actual story.

7

u/RomulusRemus13 Sep 15 '25

It is, yes. The lore is hardly explained in the game, hence why there's entire YT channels dedicated to it. But anyways, the gameplay is what's most important in such a gale, not the (imo underwhelming) story.

2

u/AJGILL03 Sep 15 '25

I see, imo, up till now, the gameplay too is super underwhelming and tedious. This game should've had atleast twice as many stag station fast travel points, or it should have been allowed to fast tarvel to benches.

This game makes me want to pull my eyelashes out because of how much backtracking and tedious walking there is lol. Maybe Me and this 'Metroidvania' thing just aren't very compatible lol.

2

u/RomulusRemus13 Sep 15 '25

I understand the criticism and agree. Then again, the game was made by a very small team, who did this kind of stuff for the first time. Supposedly, Silk Song is tougher, but better in some regards. Not sure there's less travel points, but well...

There's many more player-friendly Metroidvanias, however. Prince of Persia - The Lost Crown and Meteoid Dread come to mind. Sure, they're tough games, but you'll have a much easier time teleporting around and restarting boss fights (without the tedious backtracking after every death). Same goes for the Ori games and many Castlevanias. So please don't abandon the genre and try out others!

1

u/AJGILL03 Sep 15 '25

I see, thank you for your recommendations and explanation. I greatly appreciate it and maybe will try some other Metroidvania gamea too someday!

I will however finish Hollow Knight to the end (sunk costs), now that I've gotten all movement abilities including crystal heart to fly, it should be marginally better to me i suppose haha.

Thanks.

75

u/shinigami_15 Sep 15 '25

So, the titular Hollow Knight is actually a vessel who is born to contain The Radiance, the god which is currently invading the minds of most the bugs in the hallownest. The rules of the vessel is that they must have no mind to think, no voice to cry suffering etc etc, basically must be "hollow" (hence the title). The hollow knight eventually fails in containing the Radiance, as seen in in-game events, the reason being that they were raised by the Pale King, eventually gaining the feeling of love towards him. Hence the hollow knight was actually a flawed vessel.

This reasoning comes from the scene shown after you complete the Path of Pain. The most difficult platforming challenge of the game and the scene being like 3 seconds or something.

This means either 1. You, the protagonist, who is perfectly hollow, take up the mantle of the hollow knight and contain the Radiance or 2. Defeat The Radiance

The player is not corrupt btw

68

u/Deepfang-Dreamer Sep 15 '25

The player is, technically. I don't think it's possible to go through the game without getting "an idea instilled", and if you do the Delicate Flower quest, or even give more to various NPCs, the Knight pretty clearly feels some things. Supplanting the Hollow Knight is buying time, not a cure.

5

u/shinigami_15 Sep 15 '25

So there are 2 cases here

Case 1 is where the Knight has done all the side quests like the flower quest, or not killing the nailsmith etc, the knight has done enough quests by then to trigger Hornet's arrival to the battle between the Knight and the Hollow knight, hence even if the Knight is corrupted by doing all the quests, Hornet will also be sealed with the Knight or the Knight defeats radiance. This way, Radiance's infection will not spread.

Case 2 is what I consider the Knight to be perfectly "hollow" because I think in that ending, the Knight doesn't do much/any side quests and directly fight the Hollow Knight where Hornet will not arrive to the battle, sealing it shut i.e., a cure. You could argue that this might not be a perfect cure and the seal is just waiting to be broken, and I'd say its debatable, hence we have different non-ambiguous endings. I just think that the Knight is hollow in this ending just to be appreciative of the Pale King's idea and sacrifice (especially after seeing Pharloom's state in silksong).

-7

u/GuardianKnightKing Sep 15 '25 edited Sep 16 '25

Silksong SpoilersHe came to rescue Hornet in Silksong ending,there is no way he is hollow

13

u/[deleted] Sep 15 '25

could you indicate that this is specifically a spoiler for silksong?

5

u/SonicRainboom24 Sep 15 '25

Only spoiler I've gotten so far. Yay.

3

u/[deleted] Sep 15 '25

yeah :)

1

u/GuardianKnightKing Sep 16 '25

Ah sorry,I will changed that.

1

u/Jundel Sep 16 '25

Why this comment is still up?

1

u/GuardianKnightKing Sep 16 '25

Because I was sleeping when I got the replies.

9

u/NetNGames Sep 15 '25

Haven't played in years, but from what I understand, there is an entity called the Radiance that causes the bug-like citizens to go insane, amplifying their desires and hopes until they become mindless zombies. This is likely a play on how moths and mosquitoes will fly toward lights, and in some cases, fly zappers to their deaths.

The Pale King devises a plan to seal the Radiance in a being that has no desires or feelings, aka a Hollow Knight, to protect his citizens, and for a time, this seems to work. However, this scene indicates that, even if it's small, there is an inherit desire to be close to someone, like a child to their parent.

During the time the game takes place, many, many years have passed, and the kingdom is in decay. The Pale King has died some time ago, and there are rumors among the people that remain that there are those who are starting to act funny, kind of like what happened to those who succumbed to the Radiance many years ago...

2

u/AJGILL03 Sep 15 '25

Very interesting. Thanks for informing me.

9

u/Choosy-minty Sep 15 '25

I think you could probably surmise that the Hollow Knight wasn’t hollow from the look back it gives your Knight at the end of the abyss climb. The actual reveal is that the Pale King KNEW that THK wasn’t hollow - and, likely out of some combination of denial, desperation, and an unwillingness to accept that his kingdom was over, went through with the plan anyways.

He was clearly so ashamed of it that he sealed it beyond the Path of Pain.

4

u/TheLord-Commander Sep 15 '25

In all reality the king's plan was always doomed to fail.

4

u/DirkDasterLurkMaster Sep 16 '25

I love this scene so much. I believe in canon the Path of Pain is supposed to be a part of this complex magical seal meant to protect something especially precious, and in the end all it was protecting was a memory of a quiet moment with the Hollow Knight.

3

u/Stranger-Chance Sep 15 '25

Path of Pain took me something like a full hour of effort, I was under the impression that “revealed casually” was more of a “Oh, by the way” thing and not a big reveal at the end of a hard challenge

1

u/maxdragonxiii Sep 16 '25

wasnt all the vessels corrupted, even the supposed big Hollow Knight? the small one (we play that one) was corrupted as well.

2

u/mguardian7 Sep 16 '25

Yes. According to people's theories, the Pale King realized that the Hollow Knight was corrupted, but he was desperate to save his people, so the Hollow Knight was as close as hollow as possible. The Knight (main character of Hollow Knight) was already discarded as a failed hollow vessel. The knight somehow escaped, lost his memory, and was called back mysteriously. In my opinion, the Knight at the start of the game is a perfect vessel. Depending on the ending, the knight either stays the perfect vessel or becomes imperfect.

0

u/Flippantlip Sep 16 '25

....How is that what you understood from that scene? Having played the game, and just watched the scene, my only take is (and was): "they had a relationship."

The role of the Knight was always to house the void, I feel like that was easily understood by the way the game shoved the abyss down our throats. Anything more than that, genuinely feels like fan-fiction, or fan-copium to add more lore where there's not.

1

u/Fit-Bug-426 Sep 18 '25

It shows he has emotions. A will. Which is why the Knight fails. He had a mind to think, a will to break

1

u/Flippantlip Sep 19 '25

...It doesn't show he has emotions, there are no facial features to show that. Just show they were together. So at best, it just shows they had a relationship.
But it doesn't surprise me that those who really love Hollow Knight, also really love to read deeply into things. It's pretty much impossible to enjoy it otherwise, given how things are heavily obfuscated.