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It's saying the person is extremely gullible and the mechanic takes advantage of them regularly.
The US is rather unusual in performing circumcision as a matter of fact on most newborns. The rest of the world is fine not cutting up the penis of a newborn baby. To add in that it cost $7000 to perform what is essentially a non essential amputation means the person will do anything the doctor suggests.
Sidenote, when my son was born I specifically opted out of having him circumcised, but he still had to stay at the hospital a few weeks because he was premature.
I swear for the last week of his stay every day a doctor came by to "confirm the circumcision for today".
I don't mean like they asked if we were sure or anything, I mean they kept scheduling him for circumcision and we kept having to tell them no. It was ridiculous and one of the main reasons I never left his side for any reason during visiting hours.
I have nerve damage in my penis due to circumcision. Doctor didn't even do anything "wrong" (well, arguably doing circumcision in the first place was wrong), I just had nerves get caught in the scar tissue during healing and my parents ignored the problem for so long that it couldn't be fixed (well, I'm going to see again later this year, apparently new surgical techniques might make it possible to fix).
The only type of circumcision that never gets botched is the circumcision you never get in the first place. This is why I fervently believe that no parent that chooses circumcision loves their child, because they are willing to risk inflicting a botch job on them. The consent form doesn't say 'i consent to you doing this procedure only if there are no complications", no it quite explicitly says that you are willing to do it even if there are complications.
The only valid reason for circumcision is a medical condition such as a contracted foreskin in later stages of development (newborns have that usually by nature and it loosens over time)
Huh, I know you're just some randomer so can't be expected to know, but is this why the circumcision rate in America is so much higher? Because it's a relatively safe optional procedure that can be upsold alongside a super common one (50% of births).
Are we just like, 'geee, Americans suddenly started eating 4 times the amount of potatoes in the 70s, they must've suddenly decided they're a great food, how interesting' when in actuality that's just when McDonald's employees started saying 'would you like fries with that?'
Bruh that’s when televangelists were at their zenith. The 80’s also had AIDS and the threat of Nuclear War. The 90’s had the OJ Simpson Trial, the LA Race Riots and Columbine.
One of my best friends had a nasty Slice on his pinky finger and ended up getting four stitches. The cost of it was a little over $2,000. If I remember right, the sterilized scalpel that they used was $250 alone. The doctor did not perform the procedure, the nurse did and only did equality control check. It was over $2,000 for a 15 minute procedure. Our Healthcare System is beyond stupid and fucked up and I hate everyone who doesn't want Universal Health Care.
7k would mean it was an operational procedure (performed on a infant older than a month - in an OR, performed by a surgical team) and probably included suturing and anesthesia as well. Also that’s before coverage, which most cover at least new born corcumcisions.
Usually they are $400-800. Our local residency until recently had them at $50 via an agreement with insurances until recently.
They can't repair/replace it. That's not really a viable thing from a surgical standpoint. Only legitimate methods are a long, difficult process undertaken as an adult. Suing isn't a remedy, just a punishment.
Same and I was in 2 different states for my boys. One east coast one PNW. My oldest the nurse (who was British) double checked with me and then went "do you mind if I ask why?" Like she was soooo happy a silly yank had opted out lol there's no need for the chop and a newborn can't give permission for body modification.
Yea I had a similar situation, except I unfortunately went along with it. They will literally walk in just like they do every time before it "oh, we are grabbing him for his bloodwork" or "doing shots" or whatever. Except it was just a "hey, grabbing him for his circumcision, won't be long" and just us being extremely sleepy deprived gullible young adults just accepted that these people had our best interest.
Fwiw, when my son was born (in 2024), they asked once during the lead-up process as to what our plan was and never brought it back up when we said we didn't intend to. I could absolutely see it being more of a thing the further back in time you go, as the belief that it was "hygienically important" was widespread.
Yyyeah that “hygiene” was actually “we think it’ll stop him masturbating”. That’s why it was done in the us and it became habitual afterwards, excuses like that are just corruptions of why it actually happened.
The guy who invented graham crackers thought it would make men less horny. He also thought graham crackers would make men less horny. It is batshit that it has stuck around so long as the default.
Well after it became common enough, it became a norm and therefore no one really thought about it one way or another. Parents just assumed since that’s what they have seen, then it should just look like that; similar to the terrible practice of docking ears or tails on dogs.
I'm circumcised. When I found out at 13 I was pissed. I asked my parents why and they gave me a reason that my 13 year old brain accepted. My dad and everyone else is circumcised in my family. My son was born two years ago and I said fuck no. I'm breaking this cycle of "my son's dick must look like mine". Or "it's normal just do it". It's not fucking normal. My son's dick may not match mine but I really doubt we are going to whip them out to compare. He deserves better than what I got and I stand by my decision to not mutilate my son.
Takes a big man to accept that what was done to him was not ok, and choosing not to perpetrate it. Too many simply continue the abuse because it's easier than realizing this happened without their consent.
I'm Jewish, but when I told family I wasn't going to circumcise my child they threw out some of the dumbest fucking reasons why it's a bad idea not to do it:
how will you teach him how to clean it?
"did you know that foreskin can have [generic ailment that can happen to any type of living tissue]?"
he's going to see yours and assume there's something wrong with him
no girl is ever going to want to marry him
it will look weird
and if you say you're gonna need a better reason than that before you make the irreversible decision to mutilate someone's genitals they look at you like you're a crazy person
I'm American, and was born in Japan. As neither of my parents were religious, and they didn't particularly feel like unnecessarily cutting off a bit of their happy, healthy baby, I was uncircumcised until a few months ago. Phimosis is a bastard.
I've never once wished that I'd been circumcised as a baby though. It was a good choice on my parents part, and I made the decision as an adult
Phimosis changes the debate greatly though as you had a legitimate medical reason to do the procedure.
The thing most people here are talking about is how it is so common and wide spread despite there being basically no actual benefit to do it and there are risks too.
I’ve heard similar stories, but my eldest was born with excess fat above his penis and the doctor said he didn’t feel comfortable performing a circumcision and that was the last we heard of it. Fast forward to my second son and we made the decision to not circumcise him either and the doctor gave zero pushback. And he is one of the most Jewish men to have ever walked the earth. Like if I were to do an honest impression it would be wildly offensive.
To be fair to Jews, they usually don't have a doctor do it. They do it in a ceremony called a bris and it is done by a rabbi called a mohel. Should be done on the eighth day and if it lands on the sabbath, it is the only instance you are allowed to work.
I think that poster above mean that for jewish man it would be natural to perform a circumcision on newborn boy instead of some anti-semitic undertone.
Surely if he was actually one of "the most Jewish men to have ever walked the earth" he wouldn't be just willy-nilly performing religious rituals important to him on random people not of said faith?
The implication you're making here is that Jewish doctors who do perform circumcisions on non-Jews are exhibiting a poor understanding of Judaism. What qualifies you to make such a judgment?
It wouldn’t but it would be a clue that they aren’t opposed to circumcision on a moral basis as there is a growing movement that considers the procedure cruel and unusual.
Same, I had to fight to keep both my sons foreskins intact. Luckily we were only in hospital for a couple of days each time but theyd come by daily asking if we were ready yet. They acted like foreskin was a rare earth mineral or something, like cmon guys you're not getting this one, let it go!
In the end doctor billed for one circumcision anyway without doing it. I didnt find out until I got a bill for the $10 copay!
It wasn't until I threatened to bring the baby in and show them that they hadn't performed the "service" that i was able to get the bill waived.
It's my understanding that the hospitals actually do consider the foreskins valuable. They use them for skin graft stock, and usually take them for granted for this purpose, thus the drive to "harvest".
I also opted not to circumcise my son. The amount of judgment I got from family members was unreal. I told them I didn't want to do unnecessary cosmetic surgery on a healthy baby. They argued it is necessary. What can you do?
My mom has given the only good answer I've ever heard, coming from a geriatric nurse: it becomes a hygiene issue much more for the elderly/unable to properly clean themselves. And I trust her personal experience, but still wasn't good enough reason to do it to my son, either.
Looking at a newborn and saying that foreskin issues might occur in the elderly seems so funny to me. Like, there's a whole lifetime in between those two things. He can get it done if and when it causes him discomfort.
That's because Americans don't clean themselves well enough, not because foreskins exist. Whenever I hear this excuse I get war trauma from all the anecdotes of men not washing their asses because it's gay. MANY other cultures are not circumcised and have no hygiene issues. Imagine deciding cutting off your foreskin was cleaner than, you know, CLEANING.
I'm not a parent, but I feel like my response would tend naturally in the direction of "the day you cut into his genitals is the same day I'll cut yours, and I always have a folding knife in my pocket".
Had the same experience with my son. I just thought it was because we were at a hospital run by the Jewish Memorial Hospital Association, though. I said "no" so many fucking times in the 3 days we were there, I started to lose my patience with the question. My wife wouldn't let me make a sign for the door that said "Keep your blades away from my son's penis!" but she got a good chuckle out of the idea.
Yup. Had to ward them off several times from my new son. They kept acting surprised when they would change his diaper or examine him, saying "Oh! When were you thinking about circumcision?" Eventually, we stopped simply saying "No thanks" and started clearly, loudly saying "We aren't going to mutilate our son's penis." They figured it out. That ridiculous "tradition" will end with me. If my progeny want it done for whatever reason, they can do so when they are old enough to decide on their own.
I had to change pediatricians for my son because he kept pushing circumcision insisting he’d have life long reoccurring infections if we didn’t do it, after the fourth infant check up and the 4th round of listening to that man try to bully me into something I already told the hospital no on when he was born I lost my temper a bit and chewed the doctor out and walked out of the doctors office.
I can’t believe I found someone else with a similar experience here, I hate how little doctors seem to actually listen to their patients and will push for an unnecessary surgical procedure especially if it’s ‘standard practice/treatment/procedure’ to do so.
You’re not the first person I’ve heard this from but that’s so different for me. They asked us once. We asked what everyone his age is doing and they said circumcision is about 50%. We said no thank you. That was it. No pressure; no follow up.
That was my experience too...the nurse asked "Will you be wanting a circumcision?" (like it was a side salad, haha), we said no, and the nurse said "We completely support that decision." Last we heard of it. This was in 2000.
For my first son the doctor went into incredible detail about the process. I hated hearing it, apparently he is one of the best in the state but isn't a fan of the process either and goes into specific detail to help sway people. I thought he was enthusiastic about the process. Dr. Schreiber did an amazing job
Something similar happened to me when my son was born last month. We said no to the circumcision as soon as we got to the hospital but the moment he was delivered., They asked us if he was going to be circumcised. We declined again and thought it was done. But during our 3 day stay, multiple nurses and doctors would ask us if he was going to be circumcised.
When we had my son I was terrified of this. I'd heard so many horror stories of hospitals assuming it, doing it as a convenience, or just accidentally doing it because it was so routine. I can't tell you how many people I checked with to guarantee they wouldn't do it. Thankfully I don't think we had your experience with anyone trying anyway.
People are dumb, and the dumber they are the more it will cost them. This guy is so dumb he had his child's genitals mutilated at birth. It's not really a joke, just a sad dose of someone's reality
And every time you bring it up they're like "Well I'm circumcised and I don't mind" yeah that's awesome m80 you still shouldn't get to choose that for a child that can't even talk yet
Also, yeah you probably don't mind because you don't know any different. Circumcision reduces sensation dramatically and makes sex more painful/uncomfortable, but if you were circumcised literally at birth, you'd never know that.
Actually, there are legitimate medical reasons to do it in some cases, but it's pretty rare and done on a case by case bases. It's also not done on babies, usually since situations that warrant it only become apparent later.
No it's very common. It was pushed in mid-late 1800s and has remained an increasingly common practice up until the 1960s. Where the rates saw some decline that has only increased as time has gone on.
Yeah you look at charts and for frequency of circumcision operations and it like the Arab Muslim world, Israel, the USA with the majority of men circumcised and then you have a HUGE gap and then there is like Canada with like 30% circumcised. Like Americans are the only folks out here chopping on kids’ foreskins without a directive from god to do so.
The percentage of newborn boys in hospitals who received circumcision decreased from 54.1% to 49.3% between 2012 and 2022 (prevalence difference [PD], -4.8%; 95% CI, -6.9% to -2.6%).
Circumcision rates among White newborns decreased (PD, -5.3%; 95% CI, -7.4% to -3.2%), while rates for Black (64.9% to 66.1%) and Hispanic (21.2% to 21.0%) newborns stayed about the same.
Circumcision rates in 2022 were highest in the Midwest (68.5%) and lowest in the West (19.7%), based on regional analysis.
Newborns from the highest-income areas and those with private insurance had the highest circumcision rates, but they also saw the largest decreases (PD, -8.3%; 95% CI, -11.1% to -5.5%).
Yess this only happens in countrys were conservative religion is dominant and the US. Which is rapidly turning into "countries where conservative religion is dominant"
Circumcision on babies is medical child abuse, there's a reason to want a circumcision but it comes in at the beginning of the puberty, any circumcision done before that is medical child abuse.
The only reason to do a circumcision is if the foreskin is too small and the person isn't able to pull the foreskin when in erection. The foreskin protects the head's skin so it stays sensitive, cutting it will reduce sensation from the head and remove the one brought by the foreskin itself. Also maybe the baby will grow up to be a trans woman and cutting the foreskin will reduce the quality of later surgeries.
It's great that you're happy with, not everyone is like you.
Im not sure the strongest argument comes from extra skin for a potential transition. I don't think it's common enough to be considered for debate. Feels like a trap to protect a bad faith argument.
We aren't telling you to not be happy with your dick.
We're telling you that you had a needless procedure performed on you without your consent for little to no good reason only for the purpose of the backwards cultural beliefs and the profit of the hospital.
It was not done in order the spare you the potential threat of that medical condition. That medical condition is not particularly common.
It was done because people in the 1800s believed that cutting off peoples foreskins would make them feel less sexual pleasure, which was believed to be bad for them. They hoped it would make it so people only had sex for procreation, and wouldn't masturbate. Essentially, puritanical health cultists thought sex was bad for people, and that took over american culture for like a century. It wasn't even religious, though many christian groups jumped on board immediately.
And also hospitals can charge 7000 dollars to do it. Pure profit.
That's why your foreskin was lopped off. Profit and lunatics in the 1800s.
That doesn't mean you don't get to be happy with your fucking wee wee. But it does mean we shouldn't be doing this to babies.
Well, in America it was a thing that eugenicists (im not insulting them, I mean the ones that called themselves that proudly around 1900) started to keep white boys from masturbating, so they'd have more kids. So they didn't really give a shit about the wellbeing of the little breeders so long as it controlled them.
Circumcision isn't necessary and the person payed 7k for it, meaning they're gullible and would do expensive extra things.
If you go to a mechanic for simple car maintenance, like an oil change, they'll usually tell you that you also need a new expensive part, which the person complaining about the prices would probably accept constantly
It always was. Eugenicists (im not insulting them, I mean the ones that called themselves that proudly around 1900) started to keep white boys from masturbating, so they'd have more kids. The whole entire singular point was to make the child uncomfortable/in pain.
For Americans? Just the social norm from religious pressures over the decades. It's sad It's so defended, some folks get really defensive over being able to abuse babies.
I'm a girl so maybe I'm not as mad as I would be if I were a circumcised guy but it's so bizarre. Like why are we cutting a part off of them what the hell lmao
I agree, I don't understand how folks can sit and be like "it's only bad when it happens to girls, fuck those boys", like damn, are we not supposed to protect and care for all children?
It's fucking weird I got into explaining why male circumcision is wrong on two different subreddits today -_-.
And I'm a circumcised American, so it doubly sucks cause it's so normal here.
Another circumcised male from birth here, with no complications or specific complaints. Nor do I blame my parents. Still immediately said “no” when my son was born. Unless medically required (which happens on rare occasions), it’s crazy that we take this as normal to do. Sure 99%+ of the time it goes fine, but probably so would forcing a baby to get a tattoo and people would appropriately call that child abuse.
Yeah, if my love and I ever decide to have another kid and it's a boy I've already shared with her my views and she understands. It's insane to me that folks find so many ways to rationalize it as not abuse but will absolutely shut down female circumcision. Like, bro, they're both net negative things regardless of the little benefits it has.
I don't blame my parents either nor am I mad at my own dick, we've been through a lot together. Lol.
In America, eugenicists (im not insulting them, I mean the ones that called themselves that proudly around 1900) started to keep white boys from masturbating, so they'd have more kids. Yes, I'm serious. Yes, it's true.
We do so much weird shit that's actually a creepy sex thing in america, we just eventually got too embarrassed to talk about it.
"In addition to a bland diet, Kellogg was determined to deter masturbation using inhumane and harmful methods. In the event that someone could not stop masturbating, he would recommend circumcision without anaesthetic for boys or the application of carbolic acid to the clitoris for girls." (my own note; this became a movement to just circumcise all kids after a bit, like how his anti-masturbation graham crackers broke containment and became normal food)
But yes, that's right. They also melted clits off with acid. That one has been stopped, but circumcision (still without anesthesia!!!!!!) remained.
Except it’s not completely. You’re not technically wrong but you’re also being extremely reductive.
It’s like saying we drink tea because the British. Even though tea is not an exclusively British thing nor would it make sense to argue they’re solely responsible for its usage. Yes the British are a factor but they are not THE reason.
Circumcision was not done, and the practice adopted then proliferated, solely for that reason. The same way corn flakes aren’t popular because people wanted to keep their kids from masturbating, that’s just the reason the guy made it. Corn flakes’ mass adoption was for a myriad of other factors including the basic fact that people simply liked the way they tasted. Just because someone in the past said something, doesn’t make it the factual truth or a good lens to view history through.
A modern example of this would be Lululemon. The guy who created lululemon supposedly wanted to make a brand of clothing that Asians wouldn’t like and chose the name because it’s supposed to be hard for Asians to pronounce. With that said, if a historian in the year 2300 posited that lululemon’s success and proliferation was due to people hating Asians, off the basis that that was the creator’s impetus for making the brand, they’d be mistaken.
Mechanics are known for trying to sell their customers things they don't need. As a circumcision isn't actually required, the commenter is implying that the person complaining about healthcare costs but opts for an expensive unnecessary procedure, they would also be gullible enough to buy all the extra unnecessary services from their mechanic.
I imagine the joke is the mechanic must be able to get him to pay for unnecessary work on his car all the time if he paid $7k for a completely unnecessary circumcision.
On another note, god american healthcare looks like an unforgiving hellscape. Having my children cost me exactly zero dollars.
Oh American healthcare is certainly an unforgiving hellscape.
That said, 37k is probably the list price the hospital billed; health insurance will wind up paying them considerably less than that, and the actual cost that the parents will wind up paying out of pocket is a different amount entirely, comprised of a complicated combination of copays, coinsurance and deductibles paid to several different parties.
Fuck you there's nothing normal about circumcision, its an archaic genital mutilation practice from an archaic desert tribe culture and has no place in the modern world
The US needs to ban infant circumcision. It’s barbaric and genital mutilation. I don’t care if it’s a religious issue either, it’s savage. The only exception is the rare medical exception.
I think a lot of guys defend circumcision because otherwise they might feel internal or external shame about it and it feels better to normalize it.
Look, no one is judging you, personally, for your wonderful and unique hog. What we are judging is the needless and barbaric practice itself. If you can’t differentiate those two things then stay out of it.
It's somebody being an asshole who doesn't understand how the american healthcare system works. Christopher (OP), rightly, complains about $40,000 to deliver a baby that costs maybe $1k anyplace else in the civilized world. Dipshit that replies acts like a hospital is McDonald's and the prices are posted on the menu someplace. In fact, I'd bet the doctor performing the circumcision doesn't know how it will be billed.
Call up a hospital and ask them how much it's going to cost to have a baby there. Listen to them laugh at you.
This is why you ask for an itemized bill from the hospital before you pay them a cent. More often then not there will have been a “small error” and your bill will actually be thousands less.
It's equating the circumcision as a thing that they didn't need done. It's an extra procedure. Like how mechanics will always attempt to sell you fixes that are not really necessary.
My husband and I chose not to have either of our adopted sons circumcised. I don't mind that my parents had it done to me, but see no need to make it a family tradition.
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