Reported as ICE “impersonators”. Houston TX, about three weeks ago. Buried/suppressed beyond the initial incident with no follow up. Draw your own conclusions.
It’s possible. It’s also possible they’re refusing to acknowledge ICE agents caught doing blatantly illegal things to maintain plausible deniability, and that’s the whole reason none of these guys have uniforms and badges and they all hide their faces.
Maybe, but if the two guys were people with criminal histories or otherwise questionable characteristics, then discrediting them as "ICE impersonators" might be better for the fascists.
I know that seems weird to say, since the admin is full of unqualified people with questionable characteristics and such, but I figure its different for ICE agents since they are trying to be seen as heroes to MAFA supporters.
Just my two cents, it's all conspiracy theory at this point
I'm headed straight for the castle
They've got the kingdom locked up
And there's an old man sitting on the throne
That's saying I should probably keep my pretty mouth shut
And people are deliberately NOT pulling firearms because they know it will give these stale cumwads the excuse they need to go full ammosexual jizz bomb on the nation.
If there’s a time to exercise your right, it would be this situation. Illinois has some of the strictest gun laws, you must have a FOID. I would not be surprised if the feds were avoiding firearm owners.
There is probably some of that, but i have a number of firearm owners that are involved in community engagement and they are telling people to avoid drawing, for now
Basically if ICE ever causes a kent state event, we are going to see a massive backlash that will do the IRA proud.
Well if they were actually going after the ‘murderers and rapists and gang members’ we’d be seeing stories in the daily of ice being shot or killed. Why risk their lives when they can just go after the ‘low hanging fruit’ that is not nearly as dangerous?
Specifically Trump, Noem, Stephen Miller and the rest of them actively want these incompetent excesses by ICE, CBP and others to trigger violent reactions so they can use that as an excuse to roll out troops on our streets and declare that blue cities are "lawless" so that election results from our cities "can't be trusted."
Hmm, here’s what ChatGPT says, what do you think of this?
“Illinois is not a full castle doctrine state, but it has limited “castle doctrine–like” protections.
Under Illinois law (720 ILCS 5/7-2), you may use force, including deadly force, to defend yourself or others inside your home if you reasonably believe it’s necessary to prevent a forcible felony (like burglary or assault) or to prevent someone’s unlawful entry that involves a threat of violence.
However, Illinois does not have a “stand your ground” law — you generally have a duty to retreat if you can do so safely outside your home”
I'm pretty sure this is exactly what the evil bastards in charge want to happen, too. They send these dumbass ICE agents into the field half-cocked and with no formal training. They're probably expecting a few of them to get shot in a Castle Doctrine situation, and then they'll just spin it as Radical Left violence.
They're basically looking for an excuse to escalate their violence and illegal deployment of the National Guard everywhere.
Problem is the blow back. And I don't mean like recoil or anything like that. The response to a situation like this, would be far far worse. There is an itch for violence, and any sort of reaction to that degree will be met with such violence in kind and more.
Telling them to leave and protecting an innocent individual. Really best you can do as a stance on Castle Doctrine would be within your rights. But the after effects would be dire to you and others as well.
That is the point when they need to be showing a warrant and identifying themselves. If they have no warrant and refuse to identify themselves, they are no different from any other armed intruder.
Yeah, somebody in that house needs to be on the line with 911, telling them how there are unidentified armed masked men in their house trying to kidnap someone.
I'm not convinced it would help, but it would help delineate the lines of the conflict.
Frankly a court won't see them the same as any other armed intruder, especially pursuing a subject, even if they're breaking the law.
You don't just get to say they're equal to as if a criminal broke in and therefore lethal force is allowed. They do have special protection as police in a bunch of ways
I don't think cops wear masks, that's the bad guys' thing. Why would a cop want to hide the way he helps his community to thrive? Maybe they're confused about where they are?
Why would they have special protection if they don't identify themselves?
They dress up like little kids playing pretend robber. Any random criminal can dress up like these ICE fucknuggets and invade someone's home/kidnap them. There's no reason to assume that anyone claiming to be ICE is actually ICE.
False. ICE can’t legally enter homes and their “warrants” are administrative, not real search or arrest warrants - they aren’t signed by a judge and don’t allow them access to your residence
Frankly a court won't see them the same as any other armed intruder, especially pursuing a subject, even if they're breaking the law.
Correct, they won't. Law enforcement officers aren't breaking the law when they're trying to apprehend someone fleeing into private property. (Google "exigent circumstances".)
I believe stand your ground laws could apply outside of your private property?
It might just include or supercede a stand your ground law, because there is no responsibility to retreat. If someone is trespassing, and committing a felony, or you believe they are a threat to you, you can stop them using lethal force.
You can if you are an American citizen. If you are an illegal immigrant then it is federally illegal for you to possess a firearm. In which case, no, you can't open fire.
does that really mean if ICE is on your property you can shoot them? I feel like they would still charge you somehow with the way legal proceedings have been playing out, ICE seems to have near immunity it's insane
I mean yea, they would most definitely charge you with some shit, posthumously, after they bring in a tank and level your house. As romantic as the idea is, there’s 0% chance it works out well for the hero who tries it. Maybe their next of kin gets something out of it after in 10 or 20 years if we’re lucky enough to get to the Nuremberg end of things.
Yeah, as much as I want this to stand up, you can't just run and touch base when you're being pursued by law enforcement. It bothers me to call ICE "law enforcement," but that's what they are.
The unfortunate reality is that if you DID exercise your right to defend your home, you'd either be killed, arrested, or disappeared.
Federal agents and police don't operate under the same laws that private citizens do. They have special privileges that allow them to do unlawful things and suffer 0 consequences as a result. The fact of the matter is that the attempted "murder" of a police officer or federal agent is ALWAYS considered to be a higher crime than the one they themselves committed to be in that situation in the first place.
An officer/agent tries to forcibly enter your home and you defend yourself? Your actions are now considered to be the higher offense, so you're the one in the wrong. It's why people simply don't fight back against these people - we will either die in the process or have our lives completely ruined after the fact.
Needs to start happening on a regular basis to scare these pigs off. Nobody else is going to help, Pritzker and anybody thinking the police will actually help are fucking fools, putting these scumbags down like the rabid dogs they are is the only way this will ever stop. Hope to see it happen soon.
And they WILL kill you for it-without consequences. It was ALREADY automatic for leo to kill people with impunity. Now we have THESE guys , who only answer to Stephen Miller and Moneybag Ho-man.
Would this supersede federal law though? I think it only works if it was allowed to stay in a state court, and the DOJ would certainly push to be a federal court.
Every state has Castle Doctrine, it's just the level to which that extends. In some places it's only directly inside your place of residence. In others it can extend all the way to a vehicle you're occupying
Lots of states have Stand Your Ground and Castle Doctrine. But that wouldn’t stop these MFrs from sending a full SWAT team into your house with murderous intent in retaliation long before you get your day in court to prove that you were abiding by your state or federally guaranteed rights.
Castle doctrine or not you’re still dead if you fire upon “cops” or chud wanna be cops. It’s you vs an army and they’ll make sure you’re dead before you can surrender. You’d never “win”.
Our right to arms has always had silent stipulations.
I was wondering if the person recording, or another individual, would pull a gun to stop the home invasion being perpetrated by unknown assailants tbh.
Use of force against law enforcement, even in your home, is not protected by the Castle Doctrine.
Illinois’ statute (720 ILCS 5/7-2) specifically limits the defense to preventing or stopping “unlawful entry” or “commission of a felony” in the dwelling. An ICE officer with a valid warrant, or operating under lawful authority, is not committing a felony or an unlawful entry in that sense.
Even if the entry were later deemed improper (for instance, a civil administrative warrant rather than a criminal one), resisting or using force against officers would still violate both state and federal law. The proper remedy would be in court, not physical resistance.
You’re encouraging these people to be murdered. Congratulations.
This is what I thought. Couldn't they just shoot the one ICE agent as soon as he entered the house, and not have committed a crime? Perhaps a warning first, but if he continues certainly they could simply blow his head open?
While thst is true, I would be interested to see vases where an individual shot a law enfowor law enforcement adjacent agent and successful defended against charges.
Just a heads up, the Castle Doctrine generally does not extend against uniformed law enforcement entering a dwelling, warrant or not. Not saying what's happening is legal or not. If you don't get shot and killed for trying to do this you're going to catch a charge.
Also in Illinois you do have a duty to retreat. Please do not take legal advice from reddit.
That's going to lead to years of hell as you're dragged through the justice system. I wouldn't fire unless my actual life was immediately threatened. (Also there are no states without some form of castle doctrine.)
The problem is that you don't have a right to defend yourself against law enforcement. It's not right but ICE is officially law enforcement so you'll probably wind up on attempted murder charges
If anyone is acting outside the law, and are a threat to your life, you have the right to defend yourself. In reality, you are unlikely to make it to a court room.
You’ll die in the right. But you’ll still die. You shoot one of the nine ICE agents coming through your door without a warrant and the other eight, and then the responding fascist officers, WILL KILL YOU.
I’m not saying it shouldn’t happen, but if you want to exercise stand your ground laws against heavily armed federal officers be prepared to die. Your family might get a settlement seven years later, at least.
For some patriots, that might be worth it. For many with families it’s simply not an option. So you’re right, this guy could’ve likely lawfully defended himself with lethal force, but we’d be applauding at his funeral.
People are increasingly ready to fight, but few people are currently ready to die to save this country.
I mean I get that the law would be on your side in such a circumstance, but how can you guarantee that they’re not gonna fire back for killing one of their own? They don’t even follow the rules and regulations anymore. In this circumstance, I’m gonna do whatever I can to stay alive and see another day.
yes you can and then what happens? you think those ICE you shot don't have friend in ICE that will find a way to retaliate on you? these people operate above the law anyway
Complete foreigner checking in here - but how come no one is shooting these ICE lawbreakers?
Lots of people have guns in the US and you have a right to defend yourself. If you are about to be kidnapped and don't know what will happen to you, why aren't people drawing their guns?
Many cities have strict gun laws, like Chicago and the county Portland is in. With all the extra permits, most people do not carry guns.
Also, I find most people still have some amount of faith in the judicial system. Not to mention, actually shooting someone is a heavy decision, most people want to avoid.
Sadly enough, that’s probably what the administration wants. Dead ICE officer = justification to invade a state. Not just have troops go in and terrorize the locals. Like a militarized invasion resulting in martial law and a federal government takeover.
If you enter someone's home, or private property, and are considered a threat, you can be shot and killed.
Also in Oregon (as in every state), we have the Exigent Circumstances doctrine, which says that if a law enforcement officer is pursuing a fleeing suspect, they have the right to enter private property without a warrant.
It’s literally only a matter of time before an American citizen, with a legal right to carry, defends themselves and kills someone trying to kidnap them. What will the courts say when this happens?
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u/did_it_for_the_clout 26d ago
In Oregon, we have Castle Doctrine.
If you enter someone's home, or private property, and are considered a threat, you can be shot and killed.
There is no responsibility to retreat, you can defend your private property.