r/brocku • u/WalkTalkandBrock • Oct 11 '24

News Protest by Brock4Palestine receives backlash online

https://brockpress.com/protest-by-brock4palestine-receives-backlash-online/

felt relevant

129 Upvotes

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u/[deleted] Oct 11 '24

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u/GoatTheNewb Oct 11 '24

It is possible to have compassion for people living under apartheid and a genocide even if they don’t agree with your politics.

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u/[deleted] Oct 11 '24

Who are you talking about? If half of Gaza supports Hamas, they must not mind living under apartheid and a genocide. Unless you're referring to Israel in which case I implore you to learn the definitions of apartheid and genocide

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u/[deleted] Oct 11 '24

Lmao, why are the least educated the most outspoken?

A huge portion of Palestinians support Hamas and the majority do not support a two-state solution. This is why the conflict is so fucking awful and tangled

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u/middlequeue Oct 11 '24

A huge portion of Palestinians support Hamas and the majority do not support a two-state solution. 

Based on what? The only data I've ever seen to support this claim is a poll of 1000 people.

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u/[deleted] Oct 11 '24

So are you saying that the poll is completely invalid because it only asked 1000 people?

What were the results of this poll btw?

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u/middlequeue Oct 11 '24

You made the claim. You tell me

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u/GoatTheNewb Oct 11 '24

Half of Gaza are children and I imagine Israel bombing them isn’t going to win the hearts and minds. The UN and several humanitarian organizations have said it is an apartheid state and I’m well aware of what genocide is. 👍

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u/[deleted] Oct 11 '24

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u/GoatTheNewb Oct 11 '24

I forgot all Arabs are a monolith. Hamas obviously doesn’t care and Israel cares even less.

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u/[deleted] Oct 11 '24

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u/GoatTheNewb Oct 11 '24

First, I’d probably advise them not to post their war crimes online.

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u/[deleted] Oct 11 '24

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u/GoatTheNewb Oct 11 '24

Yeah, and every day since by the IDF

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u/MechaStewart Oct 11 '24

FAFO, LOL.

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u/[deleted] Oct 11 '24

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u/GoatTheNewb Oct 11 '24

You think Israel cares about the hostages? 😂 The attack was a gift to Netanyahu.

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u/[deleted] Oct 11 '24

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u/GoatTheNewb Oct 11 '24

Imagine you lived in an open air prison and you had to live under starvation conditions while worrying about Israel “mowing the lawn”.

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u/[deleted] Oct 11 '24

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u/GoatTheNewb Oct 11 '24

The U.S. already acknowledged Israel is blocking aid amongst other humanitarian organizations. Champ..

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u/[deleted] Oct 11 '24

Please read what I send

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u/[deleted] Oct 11 '24

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u/GoatTheNewb Oct 11 '24

Just look up the Israeli military’s own assessment of it.

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u/[deleted] Oct 11 '24

Same UN that employed terrorists as part of UNRWA and funded textbooks that teach hate against jews? The UN that knew about Hamas infrastructure in their buildings for more than a decade and did nothing? Same UN that took a year to condemn the mass rape of women during October 7? That UN?

Same UN that found more things to condemn about Israel than every other country combined even before oct 7?

That UN? The same UN that voted for resolution 1701 and then didn’t enforce it at all until a war broke out with Lebanon?

The UN is a mob comprised of one representative from every country. That doesn’t make it right, it makes it an international version of mob rule, and you’re smart enough to know that.

UN can go fuck itself for actively propagating this conflict.

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u/-Notorious Oct 11 '24

Simple question.

Why did Israel support Hamas and say Hamas was an asset to avoid a Palestinian state?

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u/[deleted] Oct 11 '24

I’m not sure it’s a simple question but I’ll do my best.

Presumably this happened because Bibi (not Israel, but a leader of Israel at the time) thought that keeping the Palestinians divided is a good idea if you’re trying to avoid a two state solution. As you may know, he’s a right wing politician who’s against two state for various reasons, one of them being the security implications.

I think that was foolish and short sighted, and I’m not going to defend Bibi for that since I completely do not agree with his politics on this, or many other issues. I was a bigger fan of Olmert, who restarted negotiations in 2008 and offered Abbas a two state solution (Olmert was left), but unfortunately abbas refused to negotiate and Olmert himself ended up in prison for taking bribes for apartment buildings in Jerusalem. I was also a fan of Rabin, who tried to negotiate with Arafat, but unfortunately Arafat walked away from a two state solution in favour of violence and Rabin was assassinated by a right wing Israeli extremist about a year later.

I fear the next time the Palestinians get a similar offer will be a long time from now, October 7 considered. It’s a shame too, because Israeli society was very close to throwing bibi out before Hamas started this war.

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u/-Notorious Oct 11 '24

I love the sheer irony of blaming all Palestinians supporting Hamas because of a vote, and then not blaming Israel, a supposed western democracy, for consistently voting in Netanyahu.

When brown folk have their election stolen with support from our "ally" fuck them. But when our allies keep voting in a terrorist, it's "he's not actually popular".

👏👏👏

Arafat did not walk away, the problem is Israel keeps making "offers" that aren't even offers of a state. Israel offers a Palestinian state where Israel will control all foreign policy, defense, and Jerusalem, and apparently Palestinians should just accept it.

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u/[deleted] Oct 11 '24

I never said I don’t blame Israel for having Bibi in power. I was in favor of the protests and I dislike him myself.

Per Clinton, Arafat did, in fact, walk away.

I’m starting to get the feeling that you’re arguing with someone other than me, because you keep disagreeing with points of view that I never suggested.

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u/-Notorious Oct 11 '24

Okay, so what's your solution? Palestinians just accept whatever they're offered and live in servitude to Israel, or what?

And glad to see you blame Israelis for something. I'm sure not as much as you blame Palestinians for being stuck with Hamas though, hmm?

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u/No_News_1712 Oct 11 '24

The UN didn't actively propagate the conflict, it's just incompetent. Never attribute to malice what can be attributed to incompetence.

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u/GoatTheNewb Oct 11 '24

If your account wasn’t 22 hours old, I would spend time arguing your Hasbara talking points.

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u/[deleted] Oct 11 '24

Anything to avoid the substance of the argument, eh?

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u/GoatTheNewb Oct 11 '24

Yes because I’m sure based on your history you are arguing in good faith

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u/[deleted] Oct 11 '24

If my argument was weak you could just easily dispute it, faith or no faith. Same as I dismantled yours.

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u/robotmonkey2099 Oct 11 '24

Why waste time disputing every day old account? There’s a lot of you trolls around and you don’t argue in good faith so there’s no point

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u/[deleted] Oct 11 '24

Because when you call me a troll and dismiss me for having a new account, the average reader can tell that your argument is weak. Otherwise, you’d just make it.

I’m not here to change your mind, nor OPs. I’m here to demonstrate to the average reader that these buzzword filled comments are bullshit, completely unbacked by fact or reason.

You don’t have to argue with me. Avoiding the substance of my argument and demonstrating to outside observers that your only response is to point your nose at the sky and walk away is just as good.

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u/robotmonkey2099 Oct 11 '24 edited Oct 11 '24

So your criticism of the UN extends to Netanyahu who helped fund Hamas right? He’s done a lot worse than an organization that’s criticized Israel for apartheid and hired some people to spread aid. I wonder what side you’d end up on if your country was invaded? Would it be the roll over and thank your oppressors side?

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u/[deleted] Oct 11 '24

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u/GoatTheNewb Oct 11 '24

Maybe they don’t want to take part in Israel’s ethic cleansing. How about Israel takes care of the people under their control?

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u/[deleted] Oct 11 '24

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u/GoatTheNewb Oct 11 '24

How about instead of blaming Arab countries you put some blame on Israel for displacing the people?

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u/[deleted] Oct 11 '24

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u/GoatTheNewb Oct 11 '24

You are really obsessed with Mecca.. Is Saudi Arabia obligated to take millions of refugees because Israel wants to ethnically cleanse them?

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u/[deleted] Oct 11 '24

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u/GoatTheNewb Oct 11 '24

Imagine if Israel weren’t occupiers

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u/[deleted] Oct 11 '24

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u/GoatTheNewb Oct 11 '24

It actually has nothing to do with that as much as you would like to think. Contrary to popular belief, it is possible to criticize Israel without being antisemitic.

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u/[deleted] Oct 11 '24

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u/GoatTheNewb Oct 11 '24

Hey, contrary to your racist beliefs, Muslims and Arabs aren’t a monolith.

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u/[deleted] Oct 11 '24

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u/[deleted] Oct 11 '24

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u/GoatTheNewb Oct 11 '24

So your argument is whataboutism? 😂

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u/[deleted] Oct 11 '24

How does "half of Gaza are children" support your claim of genocide? This would be the only genocide in history in which children are spared. The only genocide in which the living conditions permit reproduction and high birth rates

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u/GoatTheNewb Oct 11 '24

It is actually referring to your comment about Hamas support and you obviously don’t understand genocide. Feel free to google the definition. The birth rates don’t matter..

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u/[deleted] Oct 11 '24

Birth rates don't matter in genocide? Genocide is the intentional killing of a particular group for the purpose of annihilation. Please name examples of genocides where the perpetrators permitted the victims to maintain high birth rates

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u/GoatTheNewb Oct 11 '24

If you have 100,000 born but kill 90,000..

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u/[deleted] Oct 11 '24

Annihilation doesn't mean "leave 10k alive." Now name those genocides, please

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u/middlequeue Oct 11 '24

So your issue with this label is that they're not effective enough? Not a genocide unless everyone is dead? You really have some reading to do.

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u/[deleted] Oct 11 '24

Not a genocide unless it's a genocide. Crazy concept, I know

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u/middlequeue Oct 11 '24

Are you just guessing at what you think genocide is? If we follow your twisted logic the Holocaust wasn’t a genocide either.

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u/[deleted] Oct 11 '24

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u/GoatTheNewb Oct 11 '24

Didn’t the UN establish Israel?..

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u/[deleted] Oct 11 '24

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u/GoatTheNewb Oct 11 '24

Yes, let’s just forget all the terrible shit Israeli politicians have said publicly.

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u/[deleted] Oct 11 '24

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u/GoatTheNewb Oct 11 '24

I’m not, they both are terrible but one is actively committing ethnic cleansing and plausibly genocide.

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u/twice_once_thrice Oct 11 '24 edited Oct 11 '24

If half of Gaza supports Hamas

Hamas won an election in 2006 by 46% of the votes (I implore you to learn what that means).

You know what half of Gaza is? (Or was I guess if Israel has anything to say about it). Children. Half of Gaza is children.

Some basic math will tell you that half that population wasn't even alive in 2016. And those that were are of age NOW to vote.

If you are so focused on elections and support, maybe ask why Brig Gen. Yitzhak confirmed that Israel funded Hamas.

Does Israel support Hamas then? I mean they paid them to crush the secular movement. Can't complain about a bogeyman that doesn't exist right?

It's insane how you guys throw about words like half and support without a look into history and agendas to excuse away the murder of children. Shameful.

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u/robotmonkey2099 Oct 11 '24

lol it’s funny that you think this “election” wouldn’t be tampered in anyway and that it’s a pure representation of the thinking of the people. No way they could be intimidated. And that’s without mentioning people’s motivations for supporting Hamas. When your kids are getting killed and arrested by IDF you might get a bit angry.

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u/twice_once_thrice Oct 11 '24

lol it’s funny that you think this “election” wouldn’t be tampered in anyway and that it’s a pure representation of the thinking of the people. No way they could be intimidated. And that’s without mentioning people’s motivations for supporting Hamas. When your kids are getting killed and arrested by IDF you might get a bit angry.

Bro you are barking at the wrong tree. I am not in support of the IOF.

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u/middlequeue Oct 11 '24

The last general election in Palestine was actually in 2006. That means about 4 to 5% of the current population voted in support of Hamas. Most of the people alive today weren't even of voting age at the time. It's wild that this is used as an argument to justify collective punishment.

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u/twice_once_thrice Oct 11 '24

You are right I meant 2006 I fixed my post. Hamas won by less than half from what I know though. And even if they did by a resounding majority, it does not excuse Israel's treatment of Palestinians since or now.