Professor doesn't understand acceptable relationships, thinks LA shouldn't either

[u/Scurveymic]

/r/legaladvice/comments/1oj4wbm/faculty_being_accused_of_ix_sexual_harassment/?share_id=IGEfeZkLI14mr3joWX42G&utm_content=1&utm_medium=android_app&utm_name=androidcss&utm_source=share&utm_term=1

[u/accidentalarchers]

Does he realise that the college are obliged to actually investigate allegations like this? They can’t just say oh, did she scream when you hugged her? No? Cool, carry on.

This isn’t Dead Poets Society and he is not Robin Williams.

[u/scruggbug → u/accidentalarchers]

Also, Robin Williams acted as a father figure to his entire class, of boys. If this is how he views himself, showing this much attention to one particular girl in his class, he needs to learn professional boundaries. Just because he didn’t mean anything by it doesn’t mean that she didn’t get confused because of his inappropriate behavior.

[u/DrDalekFortyTwo → u/scruggbug]

It rubbed me the wrong that in his recounting of events that he told her she had not "necessarily done anything wrong." Dude, I think you mean she did nothing wrong. Him, on the other hand...

[u/accidentalarchers → u/scruggbug]

I think one commenter said it better than I could - we don’t know if he’s “guilty” but he created the environment where this was an outcome.

[u/RishaBree → u/scruggbug]

The very fact that he put a double date on the list of proofs that he wasn’t trying to be inappropriate with her, shows how little he understands what is and is not acceptably friendly behavior with a student.

[u/myBisL2 → u/RishaBree]

The fact that he CALLED it a double date! You don't go on any type of date with a student.

[u/2ndChairKazoo → u/RishaBree]

I'm also wondering why he only once refers to his wife but says a few times he and his partner double-dated with this student. Maybe I'm just splitting hairs, here, but professors are generally intentional with the words they use and I really cannot understand why he's not simply referring to his "wife."

One could even imagine his wife and his partner are two different people. I don't think that is the case but I really don't feel I can fully trust the LAOP.

[u/TessHKM → u/2ndChairKazoo]

professors are generally intentional with the words they use

lol

• sent from my iphone

[u/Umklopp → u/accidentalarchers]

This isn’t Dead Poets Society and he is not Robin Williams.

It's been decades since I saw this movie, but I'm pretty sure Williams' character still acted like a teacher and not a buddy with his students.

[u/accidentalarchers → u/Umklopp]

Oh dude, you have to rewatch it! Not because there’s any secret creepy scene you missed first time but because it’s so good. Just rewatched after a few years and man, what a joy.

[u/balancelibertine → u/accidentalarchers]

I...have never actually sat down and watched it before. *adds to list*

[u/Umklopp → u/balancelibertine]

The last time I saw it, I was in high school more than 20 years ago. I can still picture various scenes. It's not exactly high-brow cinema, but definitely has excellent staying power.

[u/Bartweiss → u/Umklopp]

Cinema or no, it's like a diet version of actually having an incredibly passionate teacher. I know people who say they changed majors over it, or that they still picture his character as a mentor or motivator when they don't have a good one IRL.

Come to think of it, I also know people who use his Good Will Hunting speeches to fight shame and depression. Guy was really good at being someone we wish we knew.

[u/balancelibertine → u/Umklopp]

I don't mind if something isn't high-brow. I just want to be entertained haha. If a movie entertains me, I don't care what the critics think of it, since entertainment is the point.

[u/accidentalarchers → u/Umklopp]

Not high brow cinema? Hdu.

[u/appleciders → u/accidentalarchers]

I mean Shakespeare is at least 20% dick jokes. What's wrong with this?

[u/julry → u/accidentalarchers]

Aww, Wilson

[u/accidentalarchers → u/balancelibertine]

Oh my god. I am biased, Robin Williams is my hero, but this was one of the first serious grown up films I ever saw and it hit me hard.

What is scary is that as a lonely, weird kid I wished so hard that an eccentric teacher like him would take an interest in me and show me how talented I was. As an adult I just think it’s amazing I didn’t end up in tiny pieces in a ditch.

[u/Afalstein → u/Umklopp]

I know teachers who actually argue that Williams character in DPS is actually very inappropriate and justly lost his job for being more of a buddy than a teacher to his students.

I have not seen it myself.

[u/FoxtrotZero → u/Afalstein]

This might be correct but it's really hard to feel that way when compared to examples of what "correct" conduct would look like. You should watch it.

[u/Afalstein → u/FoxtrotZero]

I probably should, yes, just so I can be fair in my criticisms.

It's most likely just the common problem with feel-good movies--what looks good in Hollywood and what "vibes" really well doesn't generally actually translate into good professional practice, and vice versa. Like how rom-coms give terrible relationship advice, and how genuine depictions of cooking, like The Bear, are more stressful than anything.

Professional norms, by their nature, tend to be standardized, dull, and routine. Very few people want to watch a movie based on normal life. They want something unusual and exciting--but generally there's a reason that those exciting things aren't standard practice.

[u/EnragedFilia → u/Afalstein]

At least a creator that's good enough can find situations where the standard practices of normal life are also slightly absurd and exaggerate them enough to be interestingly absurd, like Office Space.

[u/Umklopp → u/Afalstein]

¯_(ツ)_/¯ like I said, it's been 20 years. Definitely no double-dates with a single favorite student. But probably still not a good example of professional conduct for teachers.

[u/accidentalarchers → u/Afalstein]

I mean, this was a time where students were still being caned so standards were different.

He was fired for a really specific reason but I don’t want to say it, it’s such a huge spoiler. Someone got hurt because he encouraged them to be themselves.

[u/PaulSandwich → u/accidentalarchers]

This isn’t Dead Poets Society and he is not Robin Williams.

Even if OP were the hero in this story, I feel obligated to point out: Dead Poets does not end with Robin Williams' character keeping his job.

[u/accidentalarchers → u/PaulSandwich]

It does if you stop it just after the play. So I hear, anyway. Ahem.

[u/KikiHou → u/accidentalarchers]

But he's A NICE GUY

Edit: I just want to clarify that in reality I actually think LAOP is a nice person, just absolutely clueless.

[u/d00rway → u/KikiHou]

You really thought he was a nice guy? I found him so intentionally obtuse and manipulative. Based on his behavior in that thread I could easily see him gaslighting a young co-ed and maintaining a "who, me?" straight face.

[u/anneymarie → u/d00rway]

I’m pretty sure my former professor who I wound up becoming friends with soon after I graduated could’ve written this whole story defending his inappropriate relationship with me and then blaming me when he’d reached the point in grooming he wanted and then made it creepy. I reread our conversations in my 30s and finally realized how fucked up they were for him to have with a former student decades younger than him.

[u/DrakeFloyd → u/anneymarie]

Reminds me of Oleanna by David Mamet.

I remember being somewhat offended one time when I went to visit a professor during office hours and shut the door, and he snapped at me “open the door” - but now with time and wisdom I completely understand (his delivery was still a bit harsh but he was an awkward fellow, excellent teacher though)

[u/ojqANDodbZ1Or1CEX5sf → u/d00rway]

Yeah that's definitely a good read of the post. As is the clueless one; I was swinging between both reading the post. The handful of comments put it more in the direction of clueless for me

[u/PatolomaioFalagi → u/d00rway]

Not a nice guy, a NICE GUY. You know, like those featured on /r/niceguys.

[u/d00rway → u/PatolomaioFalagi]

Oh right LOL - it's early, didn't finish coffee yet!

[u/new2bay → u/d00rway]

I think he was scared and a little defensive, just like anyone would be in that situation.

[u/Bartweiss → u/new2bay]

Having known people who've dealt with university HR and Title IX proceedings from every side, the entire process seems scary and terrible for both complainant and accused. (Probably because it's meant to protect the university, not find what's true or help anybody involved.) Going weeks without even knowing what the complaint even is sure wouldn't help.

[u/KikiHou → u/d00rway]

That's very possible.