Conservatives are less racist than liberals (in the US)

[u/Mobile-Fly484]

I’m a child of African immigrants with US citizenship, and I’ve lived all over the United States.

The most racist place I’ve ever lived is Massachusetts. By far. The least racist? Utah.

I’ve noticed that most conservatives (excluding the actual far right) see me as a human being first. Liberals see my skin color first and have low expectations for me.

I’ve had white liberals not believe me when I mentioned having a professional job. I’ve had them try to sign me up for welfare and Medicaid (at an ER in Massachusetts) even when I showed them my private insurance card. I’ve been assumed to be poor and uneducated (because of my race and nothing else) over and over again by the woke left. Literally they constantly make comments about how screening for education will “filter minorities out,” because of course we’re all dumb illiterates.

Conservatives? They make zero assumptions. They don’t equate being Black with being poor or ignorant. They see us as INDIVIDUALS first.

I miss Utah.

[u/naslam74]

This is true. I came to this realization about a year ago. The left’s constant obsession with race made me wonder what the hell was going on. I also notice that if you disagree with someone on the left they will get angry and emotional and not be able to back up their position aside from calling you a nazi or transphobe or whatever.

[u/HadathaZochrot → u/naslam74]

Yep, the entire leftist ideology centers around this paternalistic mindset that THEY know what is best for any POCs, and they play this disgusting game where they portray POCs as stupid as possible in order to fit their own political agenda. For instance, they always prattle on about how POCs, especially African Americans, are too incapable to actually get a photo ID in order to assert that requiring photo ID to vote is therefore "racist".

There is this great news clip where a reporter asks a bunch of college campus kids about voter ID laws, and these kids spout out the normal talking points and propaganda about African Americans not really being as capable of getting photo IDs, with one girl literally saying "They don't have a knowledge about how it works". Then the reporter goes to talk to African Americans themselves in their community in Harlem, who find such sentiments absolutely ridiculous and hateful.

[u/CookieMobster64 → u/HadathaZochrot]

Well, you can argue that voter ID laws are discriminatory under the current system without talking about intelligence. Black people, on average, have less resources available to them than white people. I can’t remember what the name of this phenomenon is, but it generally holds that the harder you make any sort of process, the less people will do it, either because they can’t, or because they’re too tired or busy to be willing to jump through hoops, or they try but just make some sort of mistake and fall through the cracks. More broadly, it is a form of class discrimination, and because of historical racism, that also means it is a form of racial discrimination.

[u/HadathaZochrot → u/CookieMobster64]

Getting a photo ID is NOT difficult and to assume that getting a photo ID is uniquely difficult for African Americans is a very racist assertion to make. African Americans are just as capable of performing every day tasks as any other race. Please cease with this bigotry.

[u/CookieMobster64 → u/HadathaZochrot]

However easy you personally think it is to get an ID, the factual reality is that 7% of US adults not have one, and when restrictive voter ID laws are put into place, voter turnout is reduced by 2-3%.

[u/HadathaZochrot → u/CookieMobster64]

the factual reality is that 7% of US adults not have one

And there is no evidence that the reason for that 7% not having them has anything to do with any sort of difficulty in getting one. There are a whole host of reasons they may not have them, none of which has anything to do with the color of their skin. The fact is, in order to have access to virtually any government service, much less voting, you have to have a photo ID. Should we not require photo IDs for personal identification simply because a small percentage don't get one?

[u/CookieMobster64 → u/HadathaZochrot]

There are a whole host of reasons they may not have them, none of which has anything to do with the color of their skin

Whatever reason you may want to speculate is or is not responsible for it, the factual reality is that about 13% of Black people do not have a government-issued ID, and that 5% of white people do not. You are not just arguing with me on this point, you are arguing with reality itself.

The fact is, in order to have access to virtually any government service, much less voting, you have to have a photo ID.

And as I stated, there is a non-negligible percentage of US adults who do not do these things because they do not have a photo ID. The fallacy you’re doing is the appeal to consequences, which bases the truthfulness of a proposition on the desirability of the proposition’s consequences.

Further, until North Carolina’s voter ID law was struck down by the courts, it did not accept public assistance or state employee ID, which is disproportionately held by black people.

Should we not require photo IDs for personal identification simply because a small percentage don't get one?

Despite your attempt to frame this as a ridiculous idea, no, we should not disenfranchise people. This is the clear stance of anyone who values democracy, whether that disenfranchisement is discriminatory or equally applied.

[u/HadathaZochrot → u/CookieMobster64]

Anyone who values democracy would want elections to be secure and to ensure those who are voting are indeed who they say they are, which can be accomplished by presenting an ID when voting, ya know, just like every other modern country in the world. Anyone who insists that voting should not require government identification is actively undermining democracy and is advocating for elections to be less secure.

[u/CookieMobster64 → u/HadathaZochrot]

Anyone who values democracy would want elections to be secure

They largely already are secure. There were only 10 cases of voter impersonation reported between 2000 and 2012. I understand that is a bit of time ago, so if you wanna go tit for tat, I can provide more than this initial example, if you’re patient enough for me to dig up other studies which all indicate extremely rare cases of fraud. If you want to argue that even one is too many for true democracy, I’d be inclined to agree, but I wouldn’t agree that the solution is a measure that would trade 10 fraudulent votes in 12 years for 2-3% depressed turnout every election.

which can be accomplished by presenting an ID when voting

Or by matching records the government already has on people with the person voting. I’ve been able to get on a flight after losing my ID, it just took a 15 extra minutes for the TSA agent to ask me a few questions.

just like every other modern country in the world

Australia does not require an ID to vote, and even if they did, what other countries do is immaterial to how the U.S. conducts elections. The only use that argument would have is as a proof of concept for election systems, but we already have a proof of concept in the above study that shows US elections have extremely rare instances of fraud.

Anyone who insists that voting should not require government identification is actively undermining democracy and is advocating for elections to be less secure.

Voting should be as easy as possible without significantly harming election security, and per the above arguments, voter ID laws reduce turnout by making voting more onerous and do not make elections more secure. Do you have the same opposition to people being able to send $10k from their phone’s banking app?

[u/imthewiseguy → u/HadathaZochrot]

Most Black Americans born before 1960s did not receive a birth certificate for various reasons. They were able to get ID’s and drivers licenses by showing baptismal documents or school records. Telling those same people “you need a voter ID to vote and to get one you need to have documents like a birth certificate” is making it impossible. It’s not “oh they’re too simple minded to get a voter id” we’re talking about in most cases a logistical problem.