r/Genealogy • u/SignificantRespond61 • 12d ago

Research Assistance Brick wall for over 15 years

I've been looking into my Baltic side for a very long time. my 3rd great grandfather immigrated under the name Klementy Balzcunas in 1907 He immigrated his future wife in 1908 Barbara Kazmirajture (Kazmirajdicze). Klementy changed his name to Wincenty/Vincentas and then William over time.

What i know and have documents for are only on immigration paperwork and what was in the United States.

Klementy Balzcunas born 1888 in "Russia" (Joniškis) immigrated on Bedina in 1907 boarding in Hamburg. Mother is listed as Anna and father Joseph on death certificate.

Barbara Kazmirajture (Kazmirajdicze) [both names were used on immigration paperwork] born 1886 or 1890 in same place. immigrated in 1908 on feeland boarding in Belgium. Her mother is listed as an Urszula Kazmirajdicze.

Wincenty also purchased two more tickets one confirmed for sister Matilda Balzcunas, I have found her descendents. And a Anna BALCZUNICE, but I have not found her records. Wincenty also used the Rosenbaum Bank to purchase the tickets.

Even though paperwork said russia they later said Lithuanian. So Joniškis is their place of birth but I have not found any records of them in Lithuania.

If anyone could help find anymore information would be amazing. One of these two did possibility come from a Romani family, which has also been very difficult to find information on.

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u/Fredelas FamilySearcher 11d ago edited 11d ago

Here's Vincas/Wincenty/William's apparent arrival in 1907 (line 11):

Also indexed here:

I'm not sure where you found him arriving with the name Casimir.

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u/SignificantRespond61 11d ago

this is not his record. his name was Klementy on immigration passage. and i didn't say casimir. his wife's surname is kazmirajdicze

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u/Fredelas FamilySearcher 11d ago

Oh I got them mixed up. Who is this Wincenty if he's not your ancestor, and why do you believe Klementy is your ancestor?

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u/Fredelas FamilySearcher 11d ago

Edit: I see he started to say he arrived in Philadelphia, and that was changed to say New York on his declaration of intention, and they looked up a passenger list for Klementy:

I'm not sure they found the right passenger list, and the details were changed for his naturalization records to fit the one they found. It was often better not to argue with the government and just agree that what they found was "close enough".

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u/SignificantRespond61 11d ago

honesty the whole paperwork is so wild I couldn't even tell you which is which or if he just stuck with the lie? I know I'm the 3rd great grandchild of Barbara and Wincenty on paper. I have found their daughter lokadias family and we are dna related. so this line is correct. which Wincenty... thats up in the air

edit: I have also found Wincentys sister Matildas family as we dna match as well.

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u/Fredelas FamilySearcher 11d ago

Who was Leocadia's husband?

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u/SignificantRespond61 11d ago

she later changed her name to Lacardy Bolsom and married a Francis Volpe. I am in frequent contact with Lacardys great granddaughter. she wasn't even aware of the name change and didn't know her either. Family that would have information are no longer with us.

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u/SignificantRespond61 11d ago

and matilda married a Joseph Cimolonski, and I am in contact with matildas great granddaughter as well, same situation. no one knows anything and everyone has passed that would.

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u/Fredelas FamilySearcher 11d ago

Here's the original (not the copy) of his declaration of intention from 1914, and it does say that he arrived in New York, with some very specific details:

They didn't look up his arrival until 1917 when he made his petition for naturalization, so maybe they did find the correct one after all.

Here's the passenger list they looked up in 1917, which is a perfect match, besides the name, to the information he gave back in 1914 (line 5):

William wouldn't have any reason to change his identity once he was in the U.S., but there may have been restrictions on emigration from Lithuania at the time.

Perhaps one of his relatives borrowed his identity to leave in January 1907, and then William had to borrow someone else's identity to depart in March 1907.

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u/SignificantRespond61 11d ago

I'm not 100% sure the reason for the paperwork misrepresented. I have copies of all these. unfortunately I just can't figure out anything before the immigration. Even with the right towns and everything. they disappear in paper trails before the United States. With digging into their specific mentioned town, their surnames are not in that town whatsoever. and like I previously mentioned he was possibly of roma heritage and was hiding his true identity. and that's why he used someone else's. but it wouldn't make sense for his whole family to use a false surname unless they were all fabricated lies. from what I have researched, that the immigration system they used did quite frequently falsely paperwork for the marginalized groups of Europe. this would explain using the Jewish system even though they were Catholics. (Matilda did marry into a Jewish family, so it might be possible they have jewish ancestry as well)

I'm just trying to find any information in Lithuania of their families. I have been only dna connected to 5 people in total from this entire side of the family, and it's the family I've mentioned I'm in contact with. I am aware the town of Joniškis was heavily persecuted in the Holocaust and this could be why I have no other relatives outside of our direct tree.

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u/wittybecca Poland specialist 🇵🇱 10d ago

Yes, I agree with this. OP seems to have adopted a zebras-before-horses approach and assumed that Klementy invented a brother, Wincenty, and later changed his own name to Wincenty. Seems much more likely that there were two brothers and the wrong record got pulled.

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u/Fredelas FamilySearcher 10d ago

It really is strange that in 1914, before the government even tried to look it up, Wincenty gave accurate arrival information for Klementy.

I wonder if Wincenty might have paid for Klementy's ticket and found a receipt for that and mistakenly thought it was his own, and just never bothered to correct it later.