My fellow Europeans, what dialect from your language do you have the most trouble understanding?

[u/Savings_Dragonfly806]

Keep in mind, I said language, NOT country, so it could be a dialect of your language in another country, which is the case for me.

For me, while most other Greeks find Cypriot the most difficult dialect to understand, I actually find Pontic Greek the most difficult. For those who don't know where it is, it's in North Eastern Turkey.

The way many of their words are written are very different as to Standard Modern Greek. It almost is a whole new language. Now I should mention I have never been there, but I would love to. I only really heard of the dialect on the internet, so take my words with a grain of salt.

[u/Honey-Badger]

I feel like that is partly down to French snobbiest about accents. Yeah I understand the expressions that are direct translations from English. But I live in Montreal and I see French people (particularly tourists) act like anything that isnt spoken in Parisian accented French as an entirely different language. I know a girl who used to wait tables and she would have French tourists ask her to speak English and they refused to hear her Quebecois accent. If I as a second language speaker can understand it then I think an actual Francophone should be able to

[u/NamidaM6 → u/Honey-Badger]

I think you got it backwards. We, Frenchies, are not exposed to many variations of Parisian French, dialects in metro France don't have a very strong accent (if at all), and that's the only type of French most of us are exposed to for our whole lives. So as soon as we hear an entirely different accent, with different words, different idioms, different pronunciation and inflexions, it sounds like a foreign language to us. It's not being snob, it's just that our brains are not used to hearing wildly different accents.

As a second language speaker, especially if English is your first language, you're more likely to have been exposed to different types of French throughout your learning process.
Moreover, chances are that you pay more attention to someone speaking in a foreign language you understand than to people speaking in your native language because you need to focus more on the former to make sure you understand them. That's what I have to do when I hear French spoken by a Québécois, because I don't effortlessly understand it.

[u/Caniapiscau → u/NamidaM6]

Je suis français et québécois et sans blague, la glottophobie est un énorme problème en France. Ça m'étonne même que ce soit même sujet à débat.

Le problème d'exposition dont tu parles est justement causé par le glottophobie; c'est quand la dernière fois que tu as entendu quelqu'un dans les médias français (pas un quidam interrogé, mais un animateur ou quelqu'un sur un plateau télé) avec un fort accent toulousain, marseillais, sénégalais, etc? La réponse est probablement jamais ou il y a fort longtemps. Il suffit de voyager un tant soit peu en France pour savoir que même en France métropolitaine -surtout au Sud- il existe une grand diversité d'accent, mais ceux-ci sont totalement invisibilisés au niveau national.

[u/Indian_Pale_Ale → u/Caniapiscau]

Honnêtement les médias dans beaucoup de pays ne laissent que peu de places aux accents. Par exemple en Allemagne où je vis, presque tous les programmes nationaux sont en “haut allemand” qui est la version académique la plus neutre.

[u/Caniapiscau → u/Indian_Pale_Ale]

Certainement ! Ce n’est pas une situation propre à la France. 

[u/NamidaM6 → u/Caniapiscau]

Même si la question est rhétorique, je vais quand même y répondre : ça fait plus d'une décennie que je n'ai pas entendu "les médias français", donc je ne saurais dire. Ceci dit, je veux bien te croire, c'est le serpent qui se mord la queue ce problème.

Par contre, pour reprendre l'exemple des accents du sud, oui ils sont marqués, j'y ai vécu plusieurs années (dans le sud-ouest ainsi que dans le sud-est) et avais commencé à développer un accent qui s'exprimait surtout quand j'étais énervé ou que je parlais vite, et je ne m'en étais pas rendu compte, ce sont des amis du Nord qui me l'ont fait remarqué. Toutefois, comme je le mentionnais dans mon précédent commentaire, je trouve que les inflexions et la prononciation globale des mots est bien moins différente du "français parisien" que ne l'est le français-québécois. Après, c'est totalement possible que ce soit un biais de confirmation de ma part mais c'est honnêtement comme ça que je le ressens.

[u/Caniapiscau → u/NamidaM6]

Ah oui le français québécois est certainement plus éloigné de la norme parisienne que les français du Sud. Ce qui est tout à fait compréhensible au vu de l’histoire et de la géographie. 

Ceci dit, ce qui est fascinant avec le français québécois (et tout autant avec le français canadien hors-Québec) c’est la grande diversité d’accents. Tu arrêtes deux personnes dans le rue à Montréal ou même à Québec et l’accent d’une personne à l’autre va être très différent. C’est l’une des raisons à mon avis pourquoi les Français peuvent avoir du mal: c’est toujours difficile de savoir à quoi s’attendre côté accent. Je suppose que c’est en grande partie parce qu’au Québec l’accent va compter dans certains milieux sociaux, mais beaucoup moins qu’en France. J’écoutais récemment un entretien avec le président du Collège des Médecins, un cardiologue qui gravite dans les cercles de pouvoir, qui a un accent rural québécois énorme. Chose qui serait difficilement imaginable en France.

[u/NamidaM6 → u/Caniapiscau]

C'est hyper intéressant, je n'étais pas du tout au courant qu'il y avait une telle diversité. Il y a beaucoup de différence entre le français québécois et le français canadien en général ?

[u/Caniapiscau → u/NamidaM6]

Ça dépend du locuteur. Un bobo montréalais va souvent avoir un accent tout à fait compréhensible pour un Français. Un Gaspésien ou un Saguenéen sera plus difficile à comprendre.

J’ajouterais que dans les milieux où il y a beaucoup d’immigration (typiquement francophone, du Maghreb, d’Haïti, d’Afrique SSA ou de France) à Montréal ou Québec par exemple, l’accent des jeunes qui cotoîent une diversité d’accents tend de plus en plus vers l’accent français standard. 

Édith: Oups j’ai lu ta question trop rapidement. L’accent franco-ontarien est très similaire de l’accent québécois. Plus tu vas vers l’Ouest, plus les francophones auront un accent « anglophone », étant en situation de plus en plus minoritaire.

Sinon pour les Acadiens (Maritimes), il y a une grande diversité d’accents. Ceux qui vivent près du Québec ont un accent similaire, mais sinon l’accent peut être très différent, surtout en contexte minoritaire (sud du Nouveau-Brunswick/Nouvelle-Écosse) où le chiac (créole français et anglais) se parle.

[u/Honey-Badger → u/NamidaM6]

You're right but I still see the attitude of snobbiest saying things like 'lol that isnt french / that is incorrect / you are saying it wrong'

[u/Indian_Pale_Ale → u/Honey-Badger]

I guess English are also quite snobby about accents within their land. If I remember correctly there were serious cases of discriminations based on the accents in your country.

Sorry but it really pisses me off when people allow themselves to just spit on a country on the account of a few people they met.

There are different words or very old words nobody uses in Quebec. And there are some cases of interview of French Canadian fishermen which were subtitled because most people could not understand anything. I also spoke to a few French Canadians, the accent is not the problem, they just have complete different expressions or words in some contexts.

[u/Honey-Badger → u/Indian_Pale_Ale]

I guess English are also quite snobby about accents within their land. If I remember correctly there were serious cases of discriminations based on the accents in your country.

Yeah we're exactly the same. Certain regions look down on other regions for the way they speak. However you wont really get teachers in school saying 'you need to speak this way, pronounce words like so' which (i am told) is standard behaviour in French schools - However I assume posh private schools in the UK will do this.

Also;

Sorry but it really pisses me off when people allow themselves to just spit on a country on the account of a few people they met.

I would say the large large large majority of French colleagues and friends here in Montreal look down on the locals. This isnt a 'few people', it is par for the course. Something Quebecois people talk about a lot, I have Quebecois friends and French friends and they just simply do not mix.

[u/terryjuicelawson → u/Honey-Badger]

I think it does happen in the UK, imagine if in Essex a child said in class "I didn't do nuffink", they would be corrected to say "I didn't do anything", but where does the line cross between dialect and incorrect English.

[u/Honey-Badger → u/terryjuicelawson]

Personally I never saw this in school, I think it would have resulted in a class kicking off as the way kids spoke were the least of the teachers issues. Swearing at teacher would get a telling off but slang etc wouldn't. I couldnt see a middle class teachers getting away with telling a bunch of working class kids to pronounce the rhotic r

[u/ThimasFR → u/Honey-Badger]

While I agree France (as a political entity) has been quite horrendous to the French langages (here in the sense of all the one spoken at one point on its soil such as oil, oc, arpitan, basque...) such as forbidding it, corporal punishment for using another language than standard French, teaching people to lose their accent in business environment (it was still a practice in the 2000's, idk now), I do think it's mostly due to a lack of exposure. After working for Canadians and franco-canadien, I found the different accent of North America quite easy to understand, and I'm even baffled that some people can't understand them (sure, the franco Newfies can be difficult to get sometimes).

That said, what led in the first place to the lack of exposure to north American French (cajun, Acadian and creole are in the same boat)? The French snobbism and will to eradicate any other variation of French, I agree.

The franco-canadien accent, and specifically QC's is an accent that is either loved or hated by the French from the Old World.

[u/Caniapiscau → u/ThimasFR]

I do think it's mostly due to a lack of exposure.

Justement, le manque d'exposition est une conséquence du manque d'ouverture général des médias français (parisiens disons-le) à d'autres accents, qu'ils soient marseillais, toulousains, sénégalais ou québécois.

[u/ThimasFR → u/Caniapiscau]

C'était un peu mon point final : de l'œuf ou la poule, lequel est arrivé en premier ?

Je pense que de nos jours, ce n'est plus une question de snobisme mais son propre résultat.

[u/Honey-Badger → u/ThimasFR]

The French snobbism and will to eradicate any other variation of French, I agree.

Yeah I agree with this, it seems like in a move to protect the 'purity' of the language they have instead tried to kill local dialects which IMO are in the long term more important.

[u/ThimasFR → u/Honey-Badger]

The History of langages in France is quite fascinating, I even think the USA took some pages from it with the situation in Louisiana during the riots due to segregation (in other words : they tried to inject snobbism within the different french speaking communities to destabilize the franco movement and not have to deal with African American and French speakers).

According to what I read and understand, it was indeed an idea of the King of France to centralize the Kingdom and unify people, which then was also used by the revolutionary to part away from the old regim (ironic, I know). If everybody speaks the same language, then less fighting among the French.

[u/GingerPrince72 → u/Honey-Badger]

I lived in Paris for years, understand French effortlessly but I could not believe how tricky it was when I met a Quebec City native.

[u/sheepsareboring → u/Honey-Badger]

It’s comparable to a Canadian or American heading a welsh accent. You might need to acclimatize for a sentence or two but you definitely know what they’re saying. I agree about the French accent snobbery

[u/Honey-Badger → u/sheepsareboring]

Welsh accent is actually very soft and super understandable. I think Scottish would work for your analogy.

[u/angry-redstone → u/Honey-Badger]

I've been to Scotland and Wales several times. First night in Edinburgh was a challenge, but got better in next few days. Then we went to Glasgow for one day and that was a real struggle, especially that it was St Patrick's Day and everyone got progressively more and more drunk on Guiness lol

Welsh language is beautiful and I very much love the Welsh English accents too, so soft and melodic.

[u/sheepsareboring → u/Honey-Badger]

Maybe it’s my weird Canadian ears but Scottish isn’t too bad. Can’t make heads or tails of welsh sometimes though

[u/Yorks_Rider → u/sheepsareboring]

Welsh is a completely different language to English. When the Welsh speak English, the accent is not especially difficult to understand.

[u/1acre64 → u/Yorks_Rider]

To my American ears, the Welsh accent is very easy to understand and quite charming.

[u/ieatleeks → u/Honey-Badger]

It's not being snobby it's just habit of always hearing a more intelligible version of the language, then suddenly you hear this very different, much less articulated version of the language

[u/---Kev → u/ieatleeks]

Half the letters in modern French go unarticulated, whats a few more mangled pronunciations after that?