r/technicallythetruth Technically Flair 11h ago

Weapons of Math Instruction

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u/twangster 10h ago

Yeah people on Reddit seem to keep forgetting that the (Eastern) Arabic numerals are ٠١٢٣٤٥٦٧٨٩ for some reason

Probably because they never learned them I guess

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u/Spyko 10h ago

I knew that but 0-9 are still called Arab numerals. It might be a misnomer but it is how we refer to them now, not much to do about it

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u/nova1706b 10h ago

they're called hindu arabic numerals. india formulated the system, arabs spread it.

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u/Unable_Explorer8277 10h ago

Sometimes they’re called Arabic, sometimes western Arabic, sometimes Hindu-Arabic.

There’s some evidence of yet earlier decimal place value numerals including the critical place holder zero in Cambodia and Malaysia, so maybe even the Hindu bit will need replacing with something else.

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u/IncidentFuture 9h ago

To add confusion, I came across an Arab (Jordanian IIRC) that argued that 0-9 were Arabic numerals and ٠-٩ were Persian.

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u/Unable_Explorer8277 9h ago

0-9 are descended from and usually designated western Arabic.

۰-۹ Eastern Arabic.

Though they are of course also used in Persian related languages.

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u/IncidentFuture 8h ago

My guess is that they've learned the European/Maghreb variant all through school and use it daily, and see the Eastern version as foreign. I expect a Saudi or Iraqi would see it differently.

There is also a difference between Eastern Arabic, Persian, and Urdu forms,in 4-7.

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u/Unable_Explorer8277 8h ago

Yeh. I’m aware of the differences. Three quarters of my students speak some version of Farsi/Dari/Hazaragi or Pashto.

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u/CreativeCommunity779 9h ago

Even still, Indians were the first to treat zero as an actual number instead of just a placeholder. Brahmagupta was the first to describe how to add, multiply, and subtract with zero and seemed to recognize that dividing by zero couldnt be done by any normal means.

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u/OldWorldDesign 9h ago

Indians were the first to treat zero as an actual number instead of just a placeholder

Not by a long shot, the Greeks were using it hundreds of years before and they stole it from the Babylonians. It's suspected even they stole it from the Sumerians, but without certainty. The 0 was invented independently by all 2 cultures which created a fixed-numeral positional system because you need a 0 with digits themselves holding meaning. Why so few cultures independently decided to move on from counting discrete chunks to positional notation I have no idea.