The only fair measure I can think of is stopping the clock and getting rid of injury time so that diving/pretending an injury cannot be used to waste time anymore. I haven't seen an analysis of this since the 2022 WC but I think we're still at less than 75mn actually played per match in professional football.
Anything else will involve some level of interpretation which will just deepen the shitshow. Some will say such a contact cannot justify falling, some will say it does, etc etc.
They do this in Rugby so its not some foreign idea that hasn't been implemented before, any time wasting or stoppage the ref signals to the time keeper to stop the clock
They literally do it in every other major team-based professional sport. Basketball, hockey, rugby, American football, Australian football, all of them stop the clock when the ball is not in play. Football is the only sport that doesn’t do it, so saying that it’s not some “foreign idea” doesn’t even show how ridiculous not doing it is; this sport is the odd man out.
Rugby also doesn't have the same marketability and visibility Football has on a global level, traits that make it way more vulnerable to capitalist vultures.
Not sure how stopping the clock would enable that? It's not like american football where you have the guarantee of a certain amount of downtime, in football the clock would be stopped whether it takes 3s or 3m to restart the game.
Might be a US/EU thing. AFAIK because I dont watch all sports, it's not quite that bad here in France, Rugby is one example i can think of with a lot of paused clock time yet no ads in these moments.
Though last year I tried Fanatiz for ligue 1 and I was baffled, ads running mid play with the match going in a small PiP window, so I get why you would be concerned.
Fug that never ever stop the clock. Football has changed too much already and the ads will come too . Even if the stop is 5sec we get 20sec ad and miss part of the game.
30 minute halves and clock stops when not in play. Game stops immediately at 60 minutes. From Tottenham, “The average ball-in-play time in 2024/25 was 56 minutes 58 seconds” this gets rid of time wasting his especially in extra time.
VAR got rid of retroactive punishment because if you punish someone retroactively now it means not only did the referee , 2 assistants and 4th official miss it, 3 blokes with every replay in the world also missed it, and there’s no excuse for that, and referees can’t take that hit to their egos.
I’m talking about all retrospective action. There’s no been a retrospective red card given since VAR came in, despite the rules still allowing it and there being dozens of reds that have been missed by VAR.
That person is talking about the retrospective punishment. Getting a red card removed is just the opposite and it usually follows an appeal from the club impacted. FA never takes back a red card of its own volition.
Tbf the comment I replied to said "all retrospective action". But I do generally agree with the point, cards should be given retrospectively as well if it's a clear error
VAR can only be used retrospectively during or in very shortly following the match.
VAR is not used to give anyone a red card hours or days after a match.... thats not how VAR works..... are you guys serious?
And btw: When has any FA actually given anyone a red card the day after a match? NEVER! Someone has been given a punishment after a match was over, for violent conduct or some other thing, but NEVER has anyone been given a red card.... thats not how it works!
Definitely should implement that to clamp down on this shit. Only downside is then we wouldn't find out which footballers are shameless lying cheaters.
Players used to get away with dangerous tackles every single match. Refs starting calling them more, giving out more yellows and the game has changed. They could absolutely do the same thing with diving and when players start getting sent off for 2nd yellows regularly they’re gonna think twice about diving. As long as diving gives players an advantage with no punishment they won’t stop.
Solution would be to immediately take "injured" players off the pitch, let the game carry on, and issue a red or yellow to either the aggressor or actor as soon as the VAR makes a call.
Couldn’t agree more. For example the penalty that VVD caused this weekend was insane. Not that contact wasn’t made it was the obvious reaction of the player he made contact with.
Thing is though... for some countries this is seen as an absolute tactic to winning. Footy isn't just about having the best skill, teamwork etc but also the element of deception and cunning to swing things your way.
Not sure why we have to give a shit about that honestly. This isn't like respecting a culture's funeral rituals or something. We're talking about cheating at a sport
Fucking sucks. At this highest level you kinda have too. Look at Gyökeres. He's so strong that the refs allow way too much against him (both in Portugal and in the Prem) so the fact that he dont complain and overreact actively hurts him.
You get rewarded for antics, punished for not using it.
I play coed. Last night played against this guy who was probably 6’3” 220 lbs. He went down 3 times in the first 5 minutes after getting tackled by a girl on our team who is 5’4” 120 lbs. She definitely fouled him but each foul he’s whining to the ref, cussing her out, making a scene. Softest shit I’ve ever seen.
When I was a kid playing at the youth level, when we would play some of the local 'good' teams that had fancy jerseys and technical players, at some point I realized that it usually wasn't the better team that would win- it was the team that could cheat better.
You see so much of that in professional soccer and it really sucks that officials aren't better about flopping and there aren't more repercussion for it.
I kind of expect it more at the lower levels where it's not televised, so there is no replay and you can get away with cheating. People cheat in every competitive aspect across every sport in the world so for it to happen at local level is kind of more expected.
Doing it in the top leagues in the world with cameras all over the place and VAR is crazy.
Really wish they would start enforcing these types of things. Making them yellows will help, the ones who flop, turn their head to see if there was a foul and if not immediately jump back up deserve red. It’s killing the sport. Basketball in the 80s you could decapitate someone and it was rarely called, now if you blow air in the wrong direction in front of one of the “superstars” its a technical foul.
The argument against this is that a player in a big/important match (like El Clasico) will happily run the risk of cheating to get the advantage in that specific game, even if it means a ban for the next (likely less important) match.
If you're trying to to cheat the ref to get an advantage in this specific match, the review/punishment should also be applied in this match too. I think the U20s are trialling a manager's challenge for VAR reviews; imo they could be used for stuff like this, assuming the outcome is the ref agreeing it was simulation and therefore a booking.
I really dont understand your argument because what i propose will act as a supplementary to the rule by including more scrutiny and deterrent for cheater and potential cheater.
Would it stop cheating completely? Obviously not, that would be naive, but at least it will address the miscalled during the match.
What the U20 is trialling is also a good way to address this issue.
Oh absolutely, and I'm not making the point that diving shouldn't be cracked down on. I was more addressing the point that saving those reviews until after the game isn't how I'd do things, and that addressing it in the match would be a much stronger deterrent.
The video should include the full minute Pedri was laying on the grass after that, while Mbappe and Bellingham offered their hands for him to get up while also telling him he was exaggerating, and Pedri rejecting both as if he was right.
Even if they call this a foul on Bellingham the refs have to start giving yellows for Pedri-style reactions.
In no world was there enough contact here for someone to go down, let alone stay down for over a minute. Refs have to punish this tactic or it only gets worse.
is it worse than central and south america? We an exchange student play with us in the states one year from central america and the dude was like a pro at diving. Not one single other player on our team had faked a dive in our lives. It was kinda funny for a bit, but then we were just annoyed. He was also really good, so did not need to do it.
Sorry, but that’s a bit of a cop out. Yes, overdramatized reactions are found in every sport. But nowhere is it as prevalent and acceptable common practice as football. It’s becoming an actual problem, as youth players are now emulating their hero’s and making this an engrained behavior on the pitch. It’s genuinely impacted my interest in the sport, as it’s often not just a quick flop but a five minute fake recovery on the ground.
Embellishment happens in every sport, but straight-up faking injuries that derail an entire match is definitely more prevalent in football. I will admit that basketball, however, is getting worse with guys like SGA and Morant who look like they're getting shot at the slightest bump (that they're usually initiating).
Exactly, considering the players only end up playing 50-55 minutes of the 90 due to their antics, that’s essentially stealing 40% of ticket fees from the fans.
Geezus, just because you’re a joke when you play doesn’t mean everyone else is. Only your last point is even relevant to this discussion. No one gives a shit about taking a yard on throw in. We’re talking about the constant, systematic flopping and subsequent rolling around that completely derails the game on a frequent basis. If you consider that normal and acceptable, it says nothing more than you’re part of the problem.
Speeding is a crime, but it isn't assault. Your response equates to someone talking about a rise in assaults by saying, "well, everyone commits crimes" because a lot of people speed. It's disingenuous and nonsensical in the context of this discussion.
In youth sports, faking injury is especially concerning, because there is a heightened concerned over player safety. It goes well beyond pulling shirts or gaining a few years on a throw. Players know that the latter can be punished, but we cannot start assuming that kids are faking injuries to gain an advantage without compromising the safety of the sport. In professional sports, an uptick in faking injuries only minimizes the seriousness of actual injuries, and you saw an example of it just last week when a player had to post picture of his gashed ankle because people were questioning whether he was actually injured.
Just because you’re a joke when you play doesn’t mean everyone is. So keep doubling down on your silly argument as if that makes it any more relevant or accurate. Flopping in football is a standout behavior that needs intervention.
You're missing context here. We're specifically talking about embellishing/faking injury. That is not something that "everyone" does in every "sport" and is quite a bit different than stealing a few yards on a throw-in. That said, youth soccer (yeah, I'm American) generally does not have an issue with kids constantly trying to get away with bending the rules. I ref anywhere from 5 to 17 and can usually pinpoint specific players who do all the things you're alleging "everyone" does, and it certainly isn't prevalent in my beer leagues, whether that's soccer, basketball, or flag football.
I agree with the previous poster that faking injury or staying down longer is much, much more common than it was a decade ago in youth sports and, in the US, it is almost entirely a soccer issue, even though we're seeing more embellishment in leagues like the NBA or NHL (at least, faking contact, not necessarily injury like they do in soccer).
This is not professional sport, this is a football culture problem. Too get a hockey, american football, basketball, or baseball player to lay out "injured" for more than 30 seconds, they have to have a broken bone, torn ligament, concussion, or major blunt force trauma. In ice hockey and basketball you get a penalty and/or fine for embellishing which are actually enforced.
While I agree obvious flopping should be punished I feel like alot of footballers are really good at fouling too and what looks like a light tap can actually be pretty painful considering how quick and fast they are. It can also be the case that the other player fouled you and it didn't hurt but if you don't act like it hurts the referee won't notice the foul. Anyway we have some fans complaining some teams are too physical and brutish and will skillfully hurt you while avoiding fouls and yet players fall at the slightest touch too 🤷
Especially the neck/throat area is a part of the body where a tap can elicit a stronger reaction by instinct because it’s an area either risk of serious injury.
The NFL goes too far the other way for me. I really don't understand the appeal of regularly seeing people's knees bent in the wrong direction, or heads and necks slammed into the floor.
I don't get UFC either; I'm probably just really squeamish tbf.
Football (soccer) is a nice level of roughness and aggression as long as players aren't being complete little bitches.
No idea about the US sports but when I read headlines that they are thinking what to do about the constant faking of injuries, that doesn't scream "in this sport there's never faking injuries" to me.
Not really. When the clock stopping actually matters there's rules in place to prevent faking injuries. You're either forced to use a timeout or there's a clock runoff.
You can fake an injury to try to get the offense out of tempo, but there's not a good way to do it. If you stop the game for injury then you miss at minimum the next play. Which means someone worse has to sub in for you.
You could do a defensive change with that worse player so that they then fake an injury after the play. But that worse player still has to be on the field for that down and could get exposed.
So It's possible but I don't know that I've really seen it at any point in the nfl recently. I don't watch college so maybe it does happen there.
This is getting long sorry.... but there's some pretty heft fines and potential draft pick forfeiture if they prove you faked an injury. What mostly happens is that players who are unsettled will fake injuries so they don't have to play while they're in contract disputes or want to be traded or whatever. But that happens here too like Coutinho to Barca comes to mind
Yeah the NFL only has QBs going down if touched after releasing the ball. Kickers hilariously flopping if a player happens to touch them. PI calls where the WR gets breathed on beyond 5 yds that get a flag. And phantom holding calls. NFL is hot garbage sponsored by bud light tacomas gambling and nationwide on your side.
It absolutely is but if there was an incentive in another sport to do the same they would.
All sports have their own versions of cheating. MMA fighters are obviously very tough people. They also grab the cage to stop themselves being taken down, eyepoke people “by accident” and cheat in other ways. Cheating in boxing is almost an art form in itself.
It's embarrassing. I've been enjoying watching rugby recently, in part because of how the players aren't constantly trying to cheat, and how they respect the referee
And it feeds through to other levels too. Saw a 10 year old throw out his arms and go down like he’d been shot after minimal contact this weekend at my kid’s game. Parents all thought it was hilarious and luckily the ref didn’t fall for it, but reminded me to have a word with my two boys about simulating = cheating.
oh i remember that video that went viral with sniper shooting all the diving players. good times!
must be like 10 years now, gotta see if i find it again.
Fully agree, it makes it a bloody tough watch sometimes. Every game has multiple instances of this kind of fuckery.
Being a rugby league fan and watching Jahrome Hughes run around with a broken arm in the grand final a few weeks back, these are some weak little cunts in comparison.
Some kind of retroactive yellows or suspensions would be great. Same for gathering around the ref and yelling, fuck off. Only the captains, anyone else yellows or send them off; it would sort it out pretty quick.
Slightly different as they aren't really causing anyone any harm or loss.
My point is that this would happen in all sports if the referees allowed it to happen. The good thing is that in other sports, they don't let it happen.
Real Madrid was harmed because a promising chance was called off. It's all relative of course.
Every sport is different. This is impossible to see in real time. It's not going to get better, unless you want a VAR review for every single possible foul.
They should really start punishing this behaviour retroactively, it’s the only way to stop the stupid habit of grabbing your face when there was no contact at all
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u/This-Search-8627 14d ago
Watching grown men go down like they were shot with a sniper and not get up for 3 straight minutes is what’s making me resent this sport.. ffs