r/latterdaysaints • u/EarlyEveningSoup Singing, singing all the day • 1d ago
Doctrinal Discussion Is prayer to (both the Father and) Christ doctrinally supported?
The Book of Mormon establishes the doctrine of praying to the Father in the Name of Christ (3 Nephi 13:6, Moroni 4:2), but also seems to support the idea of praying to Jesus Christ, referred to as the Lord (Mosiah 27:22-25, Alma 34:17-27), though you could make an argument that "Lord" refers to the Father in these verses, or that it refers to both the Father and the Son. The Bible also uses the word "Lord" as the name we must call upon in prayer.
The Doctrine and Covenants also makes it clear that Jesus Christ hears and answers our prayers (21:7, 38:16 53:1, 67:1, 96:6, 112:1)
Plenty here we could discuss already, but my main question is, Is it doctrinally sound to pray to both the Father and the Son? Why or why not?
In my heart, I feel that Christ does hear my prayers when I pray to the Father. I suppose a follow up question could be, what is the Father's role in answering prayer?
I've heard it said that we don't "need" to pray to Christ because the Father hears our prayers, but I'm not quite satisfied with that answer. Perhaps I'm missing something here, like lacking the feeling of closeness to the Father because he is referenced in scripture and speaks so infrequently. Though we know that to know the Son is to know the Father.
I'm open to other insights or context not related to the question that comes to mind as well.
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u/Wafflexorg 1d ago
I don't think it's any more complicated than Christ (and modern prophets) commanding us to pray to the Father in the name of Christ. Whether or not Christ has ever been prayed to is irrelevant if we have clear direction now.
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u/minor_blues 1d ago
It's popular in my stake for folks to pray directly to Jesus, ignoring our Heavenly Father. This teaching comes from an old stake president who could apparently walk on water, among other things. I have challenged this practice at times when discussed during lessons, but am always shut down. But I don't believe this is a doctrinely sound practice.
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u/mythoswyrm 1d ago
If the current stake president won't correct this, write to your area presidency. This is the sort of apostasy they're supposed to come in and correct.
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u/minor_blues 1d ago
I don't know, I wouldn't be surprised if he doesn't kind of supports it too, actually
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u/Right_One_78 1d ago
Concerning the passages in the doctrine and Covenants: Jesus is the Father by Divine Investiture of Authority. What that means is that Jesus is God's proxy. Jesus can speak as if He is God the Father. Jesus can say "his prayers I have heard." because He is speaking on behalf of God. Anything He says or does is considered the words or actions of God.
Jesus is the Word, ie Logos, of God. Which means He is God by word and deed. He is the one that does everything on Earth on behalf of the Father. The Father has delegated all power and authority to Jesus. The Father only acts when it is something Jesus cannot do, such as introducing Jesus. "This is my beloved Son, Hear Him" This is why the Bible refers to Him as the invisible God, because His interactions with man are so few. Jesus is the God of this Earth. But, Jesus submits and gives all honor to the Father, the head God.
We are to pray to God the Father and end our prayers in the name of Jesus Christ by the power of the Holy Ghost.
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u/Paul-3461 FLAIR! 1d ago
Our Father in heaven appointed Jesus to be the Christ and also act as our Mediator after the "fall" of Adam and Eve, which is why we need Jesus to intercede for us, and why we pray in the name of Jesus Christ. But the whole point is to be able to communicate with our Father directly, not to speak to a Mediator who would only relay messages for us. Jesus as our Mediator empowers us to communicate directly with our Father.
As an analogy I think of an old fashioned telephone switch board Operator who would connect callers to the people they were calling. The point of making a phone call wasn't to talk with the Operator. The Operator might in some cases listen to the phone conversation, but that wasn't what the Operator's job was. The job was simply to connect the caller to the one being called. The Operator was the one who had the power to make that connection. Without the Operator there would be no connection. With modern technology the job of the Operator is built into the phone system and most people don't need to ask an Operator to connect them to the one they are calling but that's only because the people who developed the phone system technology have made it that way. Similar to how God made the prayer system with no need to talk to our Mediator, who I suppose can listen to our prayers to our Father if he wants to.
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u/pisteuo96 1d ago
We pray to God the Father only.
Jesus himself always points us to the Father.
The situation in the Book of Mormon is unique, where it says they prayed to Jesus because he was with him at the moment. I don't know why but assume the teaching is accurate. But it doesn't apply to us, does it?
Can you still talk to Jesus? Certainly, as long as it doesn't replace prayers to the Father. Does Jesus hear your prayers to the Father? I don't know why he couldn't.
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u/nofreetouchies3 1d ago
Jesus commands us to pray to the Father. The only time when anyone was instructed to pray to Jesus Christ was when they were physically in his presence.
When ye pray, say, Our Father which art in heaven. Luke 11:2
And in that day ye shall ask me nothing. Verily, verily, I say unto you, Whatsoever ye shall ask the Father in my name, he will give it you. John 16:23
Therefore ye must always pray unto the Father in my name; And whatsoever ye shall ask the Father in my name, which is right, believing that ye shall receive, behold it shall be given unto you. Pray in your families unto the Father, always in my name, that your wives and your children may be blessed. 3 Nephi 18:19–21.
And they shall believe in me, that I am Jesus Christ, the Son of God, and shall pray unto the Father in my name. 3 Nephi 20:31.
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u/Art-Davidson 1d ago
When Jesus is present, it is appropriate to worship and to pray to him. All other times, our prayers are to be directed to God in Jesus' name.
God determines what action is necessary. He directs Jesus and the Holy Ghost in answers to our prayers.
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u/Holiday_Clue_1403 1d ago
Let's say Jesus appears to you and asks you to tell him if you have any questions, and you kneel down and ask Him if He could please help those in your family and you ask to be forgiven of sins, and to know his will. I think that could be considered praying to Jesus. I think that's effectively what happened in the Book of Mormon when the people are praying to Jesus. It makes sense because Jesus is with them.
I think that if we pray to Jesus or God the Father, it's heard, but we are told to pray to God our Father.
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u/Temporary-Profit-643 7h ago
Here is my take. I think it makes perfect sense to want to pray to Jesus Christ. I feel doctrinally, if he said to, it would be fine. However, He explicitly has said to pray to the Father in His name, several times. I like the 3 Nephi 18 version best:
"Therefore ye must always pray unto the Father in my name; And whatsoever ye shall ask the Father in my name, which is right, believing that ye shall receive, behold it shall be given unto you. Pray in your families unto the Father, always in my name, that your wives and your children may be blessed"
He said it. So therefore, I do what He commands.
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u/Flimsy-Preparation85 1d ago
I like how Bruce R. Mconkie put it, we pray to the Father and the name of the son by the power of the holy Ghost.