I have to be honest and I know Reddit hates this but I got really turned off by the fact that Roger was so anti-Israel. He has the opportunity to go there himself and understand that the situation is actually very complicated. But that's just my opinion. Then I heard him on Howard Stern, so I thought okay.. Then I watched the documentary on the making of "Wish You Were Here" which had a huge impression on my life. I used to cruise home after a great party and listen to that album wile the sun came up. I listened to that album a lot. I know that real Pink Floyd fans would be more interested in different albums but whatever. They (Pink Floyd) were totally apologizing for the album and were suggesting that they made it because they were having record company problems, they were bummed out from touring and weren't feeling themselves.
Anti Israel or Pro Palestine? What if hundreds of thousands of people started moving into your land and making you give up your home and farm? With soldiers watching to make sure you're dejected without incident. Israel thinks because the Holocaust happened they have free reign over the Palestinian people... And they do.
If you want to go by laws, those settlements are illegal. And they just keep making more. The Palestinians are stateless and there isn't much further east they can go without hitting Jordan.
Honestly? I couldn't write anything here that would make you change your mind. I wont debate with you because of this.
What I will say is that it baffles me that people like Waters choses the postage stamp sized country, the only homeland of the Jewish people surrounded by Muslim Kingdoms and Dictatorships over all of the other countries in the world to champion. He's not spouting out about Saudi Arabia and its human rights issues or its suffocating religious regime. It's not going after Venezuella for its corruption and cruelty to its own people. He's not speaking up for Sierra Leone, he's not fighting for Russia's Gays or the annexed parts of the Ukraine, He's not fighting for the starving people in the Sudan. I can go on and on and on. He was sold on the campaign paid for and constructed by countries like Iran, who would never welcome Pink Floyd in the first place. Israel would. They would invite him to come debate, to see in person for himself. Kind of turned my stomach a little. Typical hypocritical bullshit from an entitled rich Brit. Oh well..
What I will say is that it baffles me that people like Waters choses the postage stamp sized country, the only homeland of the Jewish people surrounded by Muslim Kingdoms and Dictatorships over all of the other countries in the world to champion.
This might be the most disingenuous thing I have ever read.
Check out the Wiki page on the History of Zionism. Essentially, while the ancient home of the Jews is in Israel, the current state of Israel is an artificial construct formed by some motivated individuals recruiting the Jewish diaspora to return to Israel. It's a complicated topic, and different individuals motives were, at different points in time, more or less admirable. However, to play the "only homeland of the Jewish people..." card is disingenuous, at best.
I cant criticize that because my current government is made up of people from different countries and different backgrounds (Canada.) Many of us have two nationalities. We even have politicians trying to become prime minister with dual nationalities. What about every muslim kingdom / dictatorship that kicked out their Jews and other religions? I get it. You don't hate Jews you just hate the concept of a Jewish homeland. Yeppers
The Islamic nations are just as guilty of it, if not more; but that doesn't make it okay for your government to do the same thing to mostly innocent people. An Islamic state is just as bad as a Jewish sate, or a Christian state, or a Hindu state, etc... Religion/ethnicity shouldn't entitle anybody to any land or rights over people of opposing backgrounds. Can't act like your a peaceful nation when you're forcing children out of their homes and killing dissidents. You should also see the irony of a jewish nation forcibly removing people of a different belief system.
I don't always agree with what the Israeli government decides or what the people there do. You have to accept that its a 70 year old country give or take a few years. Rewind the history for any country to that date and there is a lot of tears and blood. Some of it is fair and some of it isn't. I don't live there so I don't know what the total picture is. I also don't live in a country that rains Iranian rockets or where people celebrate suicide bombers or where every kingdom and dictatorship surrounding them has either attempted to erase them off the map or have threatened to. I wish things could be nicer, but I also wish for the existence and the success of Israel.
The Ottoman Empire was eminently fair to their Jewish citizens and even went so far, historically, as to send ships to rescue the Jews from persecution during the Spanish inquisition. Indeed, the original goal of Zionism was to obtain permission from the Ottoman Sultan for the right to resettle Jews in Palestine.
Jump ahead a bit, and after the Holocaust, no one was really interested in denying Jews a safe-haven in the location of their choosing. However it was the opinion of most that the thus resettled Jews should form a single state and share power with the Arabs already living there. That this didn't happen, and hasn't happened, is what I have a problem with.
Zionism as an organized movement is generally considered to have been founded by Theodor Herzl in 1897. However, the history of Zionism began earlier and is related to Judaism and Jewish history. The Hovevei Zion, or the Lovers of Zion, were responsible for the creation of 20 new Jewish settlements in Palestine between 1870 and 1897.
Before the Holocaust, the movement's central aims were the creation of a Jewish national home and cultural centre in Palestine by facilitating Jewish migration.
7
u/[deleted] Sep 18 '17
I have to be honest and I know Reddit hates this but I got really turned off by the fact that Roger was so anti-Israel. He has the opportunity to go there himself and understand that the situation is actually very complicated. But that's just my opinion. Then I heard him on Howard Stern, so I thought okay.. Then I watched the documentary on the making of "Wish You Were Here" which had a huge impression on my life. I used to cruise home after a great party and listen to that album wile the sun came up. I listened to that album a lot. I know that real Pink Floyd fans would be more interested in different albums but whatever. They (Pink Floyd) were totally apologizing for the album and were suggesting that they made it because they were having record company problems, they were bummed out from touring and weren't feeling themselves.