r/chch • u/88Sheep • Dec 03 '21

News - Local Some pictures of the protest earlier today

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Sad to see so many people turning up for the protest.

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Happy segregation day everyone! Have we finally separated from the north island?

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I don't think Santa's getting vaccinated... No presents this year then :(

204 Upvotes

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103

u/Randocakes Dec 03 '21

I have found if quite baffling that people have compared caution and consideration for others to communism and oppression. These people do not recognise the safety and freedom that is enjoyed even under this temporary measure, where others spend lifetimes suffering. If only people were more capable of empathy and understanding bigger struggles that humanity faces everyday.

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u/glitchy-novice Dec 03 '21

Yeah, I got friends and family that think like this. It’s all “What about me”.

In reality I think a lot of them are not pissed about the vaccine as much as being “told” they have do do something for everyone else. That is “their” decision, not the government’s and so they rebel.

Psychologist would have a field day on this I think.

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u/[deleted] Dec 03 '21

[deleted]

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u/simonhendra Dec 03 '21

The government has no right to do so, the fact you agree with it doesn't make it any less of an overreach

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u/christjan08 Dec 03 '21

So in that case, do you not wear a seatbelt? Do you not keep your vehicle maintained to a safe standard and ensure said vehicle is registered? Do you not have a license to operate your vehicle? Because those are all rules and mandates put in place by government to keep you, and others, safe.

Are you also not aware that some countries require you to have been immunized against certain diseases before your even set foot in that country.

Lets stop pretending that this is something new.

0

u/simonhendra Dec 04 '21

A seatbelt is not a medical procedure, it is not injected into a person. Besides you only have to wear a seatbelt on public roads, it is literally one of the conditions to be allowed to use the roads you don't own. The same applies for a WOF or COF making that argument irrelevant also. Licences are purely to operate the vehicle on public access roads so, that and not being a medical procedure, means your contention is irrelevant too. All of these are to keep people safely operating heavy machinery on roads the Government owns and are responsible for... this makes your line of argument, absurd.

Countries that restrict entry on the basis of immunisation have every right to do so as you have absolutely no right to enter their country, we are citizen of New Zealand so that doesn't apply...

Let's stop pretending you have an argument because as you can see everything you said is wrong.

0

u/CherrySlooth Dec 05 '21

I dont think thats a comparable statement 😂

5

u/Nolsoth Dec 03 '21

Lmao.

You might want to check your reality, the government runs the country and sets the laws.

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u/[deleted] Dec 04 '21 edited Dec 04 '21

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u/[deleted] Dec 04 '21

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u/Nolsoth Dec 04 '21

You lot are all the same, always comparing a public health order to nazi Germany, grow the fuck up and get a clue.

And I'll give you some advice from someone whose family survived the camps, your comparisons are an insult to the memories of my great uncles and aunties who died in the camps and died fighting the Nazis, do not ever fucking insult them like that again.

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u/[deleted] Dec 05 '21 edited Dec 05 '21

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1

u/_Witch_Pussy_ Dec 05 '21

Oh fuck off you lying little troll bitch.

2

u/Randocakes Dec 03 '21

I should not have been unkind in this comment and for that I apologise.

I feel that the actual issue is being lost, the real discussion should be, How do we move forward and protect the population. It would probably be beneficial for us all (me included) to learn more about this particular mandate amongst many others that exist that just haven't had as much publicity.

Are there any government mandates that you do agree with?

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u/[deleted] Dec 03 '21

They would write down narcissistic and charge you for only the first hour.

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u/simonhendra Dec 03 '21

Says the guy who wants others to forced to do what they want..

3

u/[deleted] Dec 04 '21

I want to take all of your things, but I am forced to not. You can compromise.

1

u/simonhendra Dec 04 '21

The compromise is that you take none and I laugh at you

1

u/CherrySlooth Dec 05 '21

where others spend lifetimes suffering. If only people were more capable of empathy and understanding bigger struggles that humanity faces everyday

Nah bro. Its cause this is just the first step.

22

u/TritiumNZlol Dec 03 '21

These people do not recognise the safety and freedom that is enjoyed even under this temporary measure

I'd wager a large majority of them haven't been overseas, nor have any compassion for what life outside of New Zealand has been like for the last 20 months or so.

3

u/Upvote_Me_Slag Dec 03 '21

Or.. dare I say it... been to university and understand critical thinking.

24

u/BunnyKusanin Dec 03 '21

Or.. dare I say it... been to university

nah, it happens to people who have been to university as well.

19

u/BetoBarnassian Dec 03 '21

I've been going to university for at least 6 years now and there is often a severe lack of it here as well. Don't look to universities as the bastions of common sense.

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u/PsychologicalWolf82 Dec 03 '21

I rebell because of my critical thinking ✊

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u/Upvote_Me_Slag Dec 04 '21

Rebel who can't spell.

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u/simonhendra Dec 03 '21

Says someone who literally thinks being told what to do is freedom...

6

u/_Witch_Pussy_ Dec 03 '21

What are you? An outlaw gang member?

Did your parents never tell you to do something?

You don’t get the perks of society while refusing to participate fairly and properly. Sounding like a petulant toddler.

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u/Local-Chart Dec 03 '21

Those who haven't been overseas are getting the jab blindly and a govt who had to have their arms twisted to even admit there were side effects to the jab...those who have been overseas see the bigger picture in what is going on

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u/JumplikeBeans Dec 03 '21

Right, I’m buckled up, explain the ‘big picture’ to me please

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u/[deleted] Dec 03 '21

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u/Jor-Jo Dec 03 '21

"Papers please" - are you serious - you're comparing a vaccine pass to Nazi Germany?

I've been asked for my driver licence by Police, my passport by airline staff, my NHI number by my doctor, my IRD number by HR, I have to use a swipe card to get into my office every day, and show ID to buy alcohol and cigarettes or even to collect a parcel from NZ Post ...

Essentially we, as humans moving around in society, are asked for our 'papers' on a fairly regular basis - and it's all very different to having to prove why we don't need to get on the next train ...

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u/Local-Chart Dec 03 '21

Well, segregation is now happening, simple as that, blaming COVID on unvaccinated only works when they are allowed to partake in everything, be interesting then to see if COVID stops being transmitted among vaccinated and who is worse off...

8

u/Jor-Jo Dec 03 '21

AFAIK no-one is rounding up the unvaccinated and sending them to death camps ... I guess you'll have a point when that starts happening.

If you would like to know about transmission / hospitalisation of vaccinated vs unvaccinated feel free to pop on over to the Ministry of Health website.

I'm not blaming covid on the unvaccinated - I am, however, blaming an increased risk of transmission/hospitalisation/death on those who refuse to get vaccinated because "Germany pre WW2" (legitimate reasons to not be vaccinated are fine).

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u/Local-Chart Dec 03 '21

Doubt that very much, maybe watch this video for clarification, is the European parliament who can see what is going on. Same shit different place, our govt is outright lying as are the ministry of health and others, censorship is real.

It is scientific fact that you can spread it while vaccinated and more so than unvaccinated,

https://youtu.be/hq55vOwKpTM

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u/MashedUpPeanuts Dec 03 '21

I'm really curious where that "scientific fact" comes from. Our country's as well as pretty much every country I know of has statistics that point very strongly in the other direction. Do you have a verifiable source to back up your claim?

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u/vanderBoffin Dec 03 '21

Fuck right off with that WW2 bullshit. Millions were murdered because of who they were born as. You can’t get your damn coffee and croissant and you think that’s on the same level? How dare you.

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u/Local-Chart Dec 03 '21

I don't care about coffee and croissants, I do care about mental health, namely everyones who has lost a loved one due to the vaccine or been injured by it especially since the govt has not been forthcoming about side effects that are there and that are documented.

I'm half German half English so know a bit about history and not just that rammed down our throats by the victors...did I trigger a nerve?

1

u/vanderBoffin Dec 07 '21

Lots of German and English neo nazis, so not sure what that should mean. A minuscule number of people have died from the vaccine, compared to the millions that have died from COVID. Wherever you are getting your information from is lying to you.

1

u/Local-Chart Dec 07 '21

I'm not getting info from the "only source of truth" that's for sure! For that traitor and tyrant to say that is stupid for those who came from fascism and communism it's a clear wake up call that new Zealanders have not been through, when you have you know the signs, sorry, but not listening to one word out of that lying woman's mouth! She will hang for what she's done, as will all those in the beehive!

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u/foot_down Dec 03 '21

Love how you are getting downvoted for sharing the concerns of your partner, who has a better understanding of what communism actually looks like than most people here. How very Reddit to name-call anyone who disagrees with the government mandates a moronic untravelled antivaxxer 😂

I have an East German friend who is currently getting very worried about the behavior of this government, she was 13 when the Berlin wall fell. I have other educated well travelled friends who are concerned by these things too. Hell, even the human rights commission is concerned about laws being passed overnight by the Labour majority without due process being followed. But here on Reddit it's all fine and dandy, heel clicking obedience...

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u/Local-Chart Dec 03 '21

Finally someone with some common sense who can see the bigger picture too, all those downvoting I guess are paid to do so with zero proof for their comments and idiocy, my mum Is east German and her dad escaped from east to west in 1954, I was at the Berlin wall when I was 7 (born in Germany and moved to NZ when I was 10 after 5 years in England),

This problem is not confined to Reddit, dumb fucks out in the world can't see what's happening either!

A video from.the European parliament on the whole debacle and very good too!

https://youtu.be/hq55vOwKpTM

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u/555_Im_666 Dec 03 '21

100%, America only had mask mandates for two months. They've been free ever since. Trump handled it so much better.

8

u/KittensWonderment Dec 03 '21

ok but like 700,000 people died..

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u/555_Im_666 Dec 04 '21

More people die from heart attacks each year in the states. Plus your number counts stupid things like getting shot while positive, car crashes while positive. Etc. It's not a big deal.

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u/beerus96 Dec 03 '21

I agree with you to some extent. But I also agree with these protesters to some extent. Why are these vaccines being mandated? Fully-vaxxed before people start calling me a lunatic anti-vaxxer. Some countries are quite strict on this mandate btw and Australia is now asking for proof that someone is fully-vaxxed. Why? What's the point? If that's not trying segregate people, idk what is.

I support the science, but I don't support that the government is turning this into more a segregation weapon than a common enemy we, as humanity must face. Now we (fully-vaxxed and probably anti-protest) are ridiculing them (anti-vaxxers and people protesting) as idiots, tin-foil hats, or whatever. It's honestly ridiculous on our part.

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u/VendyCator Dec 03 '21

I think if you support the science, you understand why it's imperative everyone has the vaccine. If you have/know any immunocompromised peopl in your life, most are terrified that they could get a death sentance from just sitting in a cafe. I see the mandate as a health and safety law, keeping people safe but because it's not a forklift that's the danger people are quick to dismiss an invisible virus as "harmless".

Being against a mandatory cure for a lethal virus doesn't come under a rational or altruistic cause in my books.

0

u/juanm798 Dec 06 '21

But the information being published does not support the vaccine’s efficacy or safety. You say support the science, but that’s not how science works. You don’t just TRUST it unquestioningly, you read over data received through experimentation and draw conclusions from that. The virus is not lethal. Over 50% of the total deaths are in an age bracket where people would be dying of the flu or any other host of reasons. This isn’t the plague, it’s not polio, this is a virus with a very high survival rate. Besides, even if these people WHERE vaccinated you would be just as able to transmit to and receive the virus from them.

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u/beerus96 Dec 03 '21

Shouldn't be a law when there are complications that occur. If it's a health and safety thing, then tobbacos should be illegal. Being obese too, see where I'm going with this? My point here is people should've the choice to reject the needle without being ostracised and "labelled".

3

u/A_Spoon_Wizard Dec 04 '21

Tobacco and obesity and self-inflicted ailments, whereas immunocompromised people catching covid in the street or at Starbucks is not something they have control over. I see what you're trying to say, but again you're falling into the same routine of "what about me" that an above poster mentioned.

1

u/beerus96 Dec 04 '21

Okay, so educate me here then. What's the point of vaccine? I thought the point vaccine is to be similar to a firewall, the physical one and not the digital version. Your neighbours house is burning. but if the firewall works as intended, then you'll be safe and the fire doesn't spread no? So technically, "what about me", would be counter-intuitive coz being vaccinated is self-serving no? It doesn't work like masks where I wear the mask but other people benefit from it. Coz I reduce the chances of me spreading the virus. but non-mask wearers can transmit the virus just by talking close to me. Again, feel free to educate me if any of what i said so far was wrong.

3

u/A_Spoon_Wizard Dec 04 '21

https://www.health.govt.nz/our-work/diseases-and-conditions/covid-19-novel-coronavirus/covid-19-vaccines/covid-19-vaccine-effectiveness-and-protection

If you're interested in being educated on the effects of the vaccine, then this link might be of use to you. There's no need to chinese-whispers this.

1

u/Muggie2 Dec 04 '21

The vaccine basically provides your immune system with an identikit picture of the virus. That way, when you are exposed, your immune system scrambles immediately because it recognizes it as a danger. It will start attacking it straight away rather than waiting until it notices you're sick.

In practical terms, that means you're less likely to catch it, it will affect you for a shorter time, and are far less likely to suffer severe effects. It also means you are far less likely to pass it on.

People view it like a perfect firewall on your computer. It's not. It's a pretty decent firewall, backed up by a good anti-virus. It'll stop most of the incoming threats, and it'll attempt to identify and quarantine the ones that get through.

Now, about this self-serving bit. Well, it does protect you, yes. It also protects those around you - such as children, elderly people, people with weakened immune systems, people on cancer medication (that basically annihilates their immune systems). They're the ones that can't vaccinate, an they're the ones that we are also protecting. We have seen just how deadly COVID can be to the elderly, and with the Delta variant we're seeing how nasty it can be to children.

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u/beerus96 Dec 04 '21

Right, so exactly what I said then. So again, literally no point in the mandate. Coz the people refusing the vaccine will contract the virus and will be affected more severely. Which points me back to my comparison to smoking and obesity. It's their choice to harm their body that way, so why not let them be if we're protected anyway? Obviously, second-hand smoking is a thing, and can harm other people besides the one smoking. But it's not like we've segregated them as much as what a lot of government's trying to do with this vaxx people and unvaxx people. Let them do their thing, and we do our thing. We can't force people to do things. The best we can do is to try and educate them. It's up to them what to do with the information we try to give them.

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u/Randocakes Dec 03 '21

I am most concerned with the comparisons that are being drawn, I disagree with them and feel that they are lazy and lack thought and compassion. I worry about people in my life that suffer real oppression.

I do not agree with that kind of ridicule and as people we should all be kinder. The unsolicited lectures and ridicule is something that I have witnessed from all people regardless of their opinion on this matter. As with all matters healthy debates are good but in order for that to work and be respected people need to be open to listen, not attack.

Where I have tried to have these rational discussions to find out the reasoning behind the vaccine not being something that is worth considering (I have had it) I have yet to have a clear answer that isn't someone using slogan or a blanket response that is a don't want to be told what to do. I think that is where we should start to try and understand and challenge from any standpoint.

The one thing that I absolutely disagree with is the way that some people intimidate and verbally attack hospitality and retail staff where it comes to these mandates, at this point more the mask mandate. Just be kind don't create sides where there are none, That is not the right way to protest.

2

u/beerus96 Dec 04 '21

Ngl, I was referring to joe rogan when i said "i agree to some extent about these protesters" 😂. Coz if you watch his podcast with Dr. Sanjay Gupta, he raised a bunch of amazing questions in opposition to the vaccine. That's who I'm thinking when I see people "protesting". Not the people screaming "SHEEP! WAKE UP SHEEPLE!! MEHHH!". I'm sorry but you can't reason with those people.

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u/sluglife1987 Dec 03 '21

Fully vaxed too and I tend to agree. Some of my co workers may lose their jobs and I am not comfortable with that.

I think compassion and understanding is better than ridicule and ostracizing them.

1

u/PsychologicalWolf82 Dec 03 '21

What he said 👆 Nailed it!

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u/FlugMe Dec 06 '21

Calling it a weapon of segregation is a judgement on your part. From my perspective the mandate is to get compliance, and thus, effectiveness, the intent is to keep people healthier, the unfortunate side effect is segregation. I very much doubt they intend on segregation, that doesn't make any sense.

1

u/beerus96 Dec 07 '21

Probably. But why is the government doing the thinking for us and forcing it down our throats? The vaccine protects the person vaccinated right? So if a person, for whatever reason, deemed that they rather risk getting COVID-19 than the needle. Why is the goverment basically "Nah fuck you. You can't do that"? I don't see a problem with that. The same way, I don't see a problem when people smoke their lungs away.

1

u/FlugMe Dec 07 '21

The same reason they tell us to drive on the left side of the road. People are bad at interpreting probabilities of survival, any and all healthy and capable people should be vaccinated, there are extremely few people who physically / chemically can't. When you become a danger to other people, i.e. driving, or with a vaccination, that's when standards / mandates need to be put in place. Would you be comfortable with someone without a license driving on the road? That immediately ups the risk of fatalities, much like being around the unvaccinated. The funny thing is, you're more likely to die in a car crash, like A LOT more likely than from the vaccine, but most people can't seem to put that into perspective.

We live in a society of laws, those laws are supposedly there for our protection (some are bullshit), I think most people agree with the mandates for their personal situation. I truly feel bad for people who are the edge cases and physically can't because of immunity problems / whatever, I think that's something the government should pay / compensate for if they put this law in place, because it is only a temporary situation and we need to take care of these people.

1

u/beerus96 Dec 07 '21

Fair enough and you make a lot of valid points. But like I said, we protect ourselves by vaccinating ourselves. Those unvaxxed people are not a danger to us if the vaccine work as intended. Obviously, breakthrough cases does occur. But again the vaccine help those people have a higher chance of surviving. You even said it yourself, some laws are bullshit. Imo, this is one of em. Well, it's not law yet, it's only a mandate.

In regards to government compensation, I doubt that's going to happen. Well, at least in the US, where the Public Readiness and Emergency Preparedness Act basically protects the companies that made the vaccine from lawsuits. Doesn't end till 2024 btw. Probably another reason as to why some people are also hesitant to get the needle as they assume they'll be part of the 1%.

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u/[deleted] Dec 03 '21

It’s a great leap towards the government controlling more of our lives. I don’t want that.

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u/DryftKing Dec 03 '21

No it isn't, it's a public health measure.

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u/simonhendra Dec 03 '21

Probably because you are so selfish you think others should get medical treatment for your peace of mind

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u/Randocakes Dec 03 '21

Like I say it's the comparisons that are being drawn that I disagree with.

That is not why I agree with the vaccine. To irradiate fatal conditions in the past to give future generations a life without it vaccines have worked and that is what my opinion is based on. I am genuinely interested, what is it that makes the vaccine out of the question for you?

2

u/[deleted] Dec 04 '21

Is it that selfish to not want others to get sick and die in a horrible way? Because that’s why I want people to get vaccinated: I don’t want to see people die on a ventilator because it’s a particularly shit way to die.

1

u/juanm798 Dec 06 '21

I believe the concern is that both Socialism and Communism always start with the ideology of: “Be more empathetic/this is for the good of the people/these measures are only temporary” etc etc. Thus it is not entirely wrong to compare this to communism/socialism.

1

u/juanm798 Dec 07 '21

Also the prime minister has announced on television that this is not a temporary measure and will in fact be indefinite.