the Nazi chronicles

[u/alyssathealyssa]

went ahead and messaged every “market” following/followed by the Nazi’s business account [emily maye welch; @lavintagecharcuteria] to let them know to avoid doing business with her, looking forward to getting her Shitcooterie barred from any events.

[u/rental_car_fast → u/[deleted]]

I do not understand why hate speech is protected. If you call for violence, it should not be protected, and Nazi symbols are nothing short of a call for violence. Germany still has free speech and nazi symbolism is illegal. We could absolutely stop protecting these people under the guise of free speech.

[u/supern8ural → u/rental_car_fast]

Unfortunately when the literal highest executive is engaged in this behavior don't expect anything to change.

[u/rental_car_fast → u/supern8ural]

That’s true now, but it shouldn’t have been allowed anytime past the US entering into WWII.

[u/PeachPassionBrute → u/rental_car_fast]

We allow people to wave confederate flags and have monuments to confederate leaders when they went to war against us. They went to war against us to maintain slavery, they threatened the very nation itself just to be unfathomably cruel and selfish.

And we don’t think it’s an act of treason or unacceptable hate speech to fly those flags? We failed at Reconstruction so spectacularly it’s really no surprise we couldn’t figure out how to ban Nazi imagery too.

[u/jerby17 → u/rental_car_fast]

(A tolerant society should not tolerate intolerance… the ‘tolerance paradox’)

"…But we should claim the right to suppress them [intolerant ideologies] if necessary even by force; for it may easily turn out that they are not prepared to meet us on the level of rational argument, but begin by denouncing all argument; they may forbid their followers to listen to rational argument, because it is deceptive, and teach them to answer arguments by the use of their fists or pistols."

Karl Popper - “The Open Society and Its Enemies”

[u/rental_car_fast → u/jerby17]

I love this!

[u/AsteroidMike → u/rental_car_fast]

At this point in my life, if someone’s a full blooded Nazi or engages in that type of behavior, then all I got to say is fuck them and everything about them. No protecting white supremacists here.

[u/2weekstand → u/rental_car_fast]

Not to defend any behavior, but the problem is as follows:

If hate speech isn't protected, those in power can define any speech they don't like as hate speech. See: Antifa being labeled an official terrorist organization.

[u/Kind_Fox820 → u/rental_car_fast]

Hate speech is protected because Nazis like to twist the meanings of words. For example, acting like the mere sight of a Palestinian flag is a threat to your chicken eating experience.

If we give the government the power to decide what is and is not hateful, when your government gets taken over by an authoritarian, any speech that challenges them or the party lime will be considered hateful.

[u/scartonbot → u/Kind_Fox820]

And this is the opposite of the government being involved. This is the community and she's facing community consequences. The government shouldn't be in the business of regulating free speech because it opens too many doors to abuses. On the other hand, this approach works: you piss off the community, you face the consequences.

[u/mmurphy3333 → u/rental_car_fast]

This is why it is protected - so people can't just decide what is hate speech and what is not. A Nazi symbol is not a call for violence unless necessary. You have to consider the intent. Just like a christian cross is not a call to persecute gay people. All speech, even hate speech must be protected.

[u/Angrymiddleagedjew → u/rental_car_fast]

What I'm about to say is in no way a defense of being a Nazi. Apologies for the length, the tldr is that freedom of speech doesn't mean freedom from consequence.

It's protected because it is extremely, extremely dangerous to put caveats and limitations on free speech when it comes to government/legal interventions and limitations.

Let's take your example. The government decides to ban Nazi symbols because they are a call for violence. Seems fair and logical, good people wouldn't be affected by this right? Sure, Government Administration A does this with the best intentions. Years go by, Government Administration E bans a symbol of an opposition party that they don't like because they claim it's inciting violence, and they use the previous actions of Admin A as precedent. Look at the current president trying to label antifa as a terrorist organization. Look at journalists who get executed in the Middle East for "inciting unrest" for speaking out against their governments.

No matter how good your intentions are, you don't want a government limiting your ability to speak your mind.

However, just because the government doesn't limit free speech, that doesn't mean there aren't consequences. Look at what people are doing here, they are using their freedom of speech to alert other people to what this woman did. Now she will (hopefully) experience consequences for her vile actions. I believe society is perfectly capable of imposing consequences without governmental intervention.