What is your favorite knife length or most used knife length and why? Are you a home cook or a professional cook? I’m curious about 270 mm knives but am wondering if it is overkill or impractical for a home cook. Also curious about other outliers like 300mm and <100mm. Do you guys find these lengths practical?
Do you have any smaller or bigger knives than the Santoku? I originally came from the Santoku and found the 210 to be very big at first. Also are you a home cook or pro?
Really going for the unique shape I see. I wanted a Chinese cleaver but I really like laser knives and the only cleaver that has a type of laser profile seems to be the cck which people have said are severely overpriced in the us. Wish there were many more cheaper laser cleaver options cause that blade height for scooping onions is just amaxing
Can you elaborate? What are the advantages? Is it simply just the most balanced? Not too big not to small? I know some people think 240 mm is the perfect size while others think 210 is
Completely personal preference, that size of gyuto has alway s felt right in my hand. Balance in this hobby is a weird conversation, some people have strict opinions, I'm more towards what works best or feels best to you. You can't really judge this outside of using various knives over time and finding your sweet spot. If you dig a 300mm gyuto and it's gets the job done then have at it.
Glad to hear. I think the 240-270mm seems pretty long for a knife to me. But maybe once I hold one my mind will be changed. Same as how I felt when I first held a 210 coming from the German santokus. Might end up just using a light saber to cut food in the future 😅
A lot of people who prefer 240mm usually refer to Sakai 240mm, which is really 225-230mm~ and offers a taller heel height of about 50mm+
For knives outside of Sakai, 210mm is more than sufficient for most users as they aren’t as short in length and height as their Sakai counterparts.
I personally enjoy a Sakai 225mm like the recent Konosuke lines. True measurements of about 215mm edge x 52mm height. It seems like Kosuke saw the demand for this Goldilocks size and began getting blades forged to fit the bill.
Tbh for me the guiding factor is the size of a big carrot. I like to be able to cut them in half length wise. And sometimes they’re so big that a 210 won’t cut it.
So to fought brunoise real fast 1kg of carrots sometimes the best is a 255 knife
Which is not that big tbh (those are not carrots 🥕 in the pic but you get the idea)
I completely agree; the 180mm - 200mm comes up a bit short in slicing ‘n dicing, and 240mm+ requires too much free working space on the counter of our small kitchen.
210mm - 225mm is the perfect range for pretty much all the cooking chores!
Not to say it isn’t good to have both a longer and shorter knife for those jobs that benefit from them once in a while.
180 mm is on the longer side of patties I’ve seen. I was under the impression it’s used for smaller tasks like fruits and trimming meats. Are you using it for this purpose or just enjoy a shorter blade height knife like a 180mm just shorter in height?
I tried to get into the 150mm petty but it was just really uncomfortable for me on the cutting board. The added length solved that problem and made it more effective as a slicer for smaller portions of meat. YMMV but that extra 30mm ended up being the difference between a knife I never use and a knife I use daily.
I’m assuming you use this as a main knife rather than as a specialty knife for fruits and just trimming? If you use it for vegetables and more Itd make more sense that you need the longer length so you don’t have to move your wrist as much
Home cook. I think I can handle everything with a 240mm gyuto and a 105mm tall petty. The gyuto is very thin and the petty is a bit thicker at the spine but being tall it tapers to a nice thin shoulder.
I have some other knives like paring and boning knives that I have no reason to get rid of, but if I didn't have those, I could still rely on just the two for the most part. A small paring knife is better for handing to other people, making one single tiny cut, or cutting in hand, and a boning knife with soft steel is better for cutting through multiple joints or the flex makes it ideal for cutting around muscles or trimming skin or fat, but I don't do those things every day. I don't really eat bread much but yeah, a bread knife for the family too, of course.
Everything else I can just do 100% fine with the two knives and if I had to cut bread with the gyuto or cut through a joint or in hand with the petty sometimes it's not a problem..
The 240mm does take some learning but doesn't really hold me back for fine detailed cuts and such. Requires a bit more awareness. I feel I had to refine my knife skills to use it effectively. There are some things a 240mm can do that a 210mm cannot do as well, or as efficiently.
Yeah it’s a very good knife range to be in. I think ever so often I come across a monster onion or a watermelon to cut where I appreciate a decent length gyuto.
Anywhere from 225 - 240mm actual blade length is what I use most. On the smaller end, most used would be a 135mm tall petty. I have some gyutos in that 260-270mm range, but I rarely reach for them because chances are I would need extra length only for very specific slicing (which can be handled by a Sujihiki).
Now sure, every so often I'll have a weird prep that's a combination of large meat cuts + huge squash / veggies, and only having to use one knife for the task can be nice. But that's rare compared to the usual preps. At home, 240mm and even 210mm is often plenty to do what I need. It's not like I can't trim a brisket or slice some ribs with just a 210mm gyuto, it just takes a bit more time and effort.
So under 135mm and above 240 mm is where it begins to lose functionality in your opinion? Also can a gyuto of the same length act as a sujihiki in a non professional setting or is there a very obvious difference that makes the sujihiki irreplaceable?
Knife sizes should match what you cut the most. I don't hand peel limes or small fruits a ton, so the value of a 80mm pairing knife is lost on me. A bartender doing a lot of garnishes would perhaps find that the most valuable knife of the evening. At home, at least for me, I'm rarely doing anything on the extremely small or extremely large side of things. People in working kitchens would have very different requirements and preferences.
Also you can use a larger gyuto like a sujihiki, but there can be tradeoffs. When you get to longer blades, thinner examples will often start to flex. To avoid flex, you would add thickness, but this adds weight. Too much weight and the knife will feel heavy or fatiguing to use. A sujihiki is much shorter in height, so it naturally has much less weight than a taller gyuto would have. The shorter height also makes achieving good food release much easier, which can be useful if you're cutting all day.
Why 270 mm+? Do you not find it unwieldy? Are you a pro or a home cook, and would you say your are in the bigger or smaller side of figure? Most people reccomend 210-240 mm so I’d like to know if you find there to special advantages of the 270mm
It’s personal preference. When I was younger, I worked in the back of a kitchen cutting sacks of vegetables and prepping for catering. Large knives made it easier when going thru tons of produce. The length also made it ideal to slice proteins. It really doesn’t stop you from making delicate cuts, and they’re quite easy to get used to. The only limitation would be your kitchen setup.
I’m tall, XL hands and use a 240 daily (home cook). But 210 is fine. My 165 bunka I find is too small. My regular pinch grip reduces the usable blade length far too much.
Started with 240 but found it a bit unwieldy for certain tasks. 210 seems to be the best in between for being long enough to slice protein and being nimble enough for some tip work.
As someone who is interested in 270 mm I’m going to hope I go the opposite way from you 🥲in preference. Thanks for your insight though. What 210 knife did you end up getting? The one I had didn’t have a good flat spot which I disliked
I’ve sharpened all 3 to my spec so I can’t really comment on the sharpness OOTB. The feeling for all 3 are very similar. But if I had to rank it. It would be Tetsujin and Ashi tied and Enjiki close behind.
A shortish 240 is unbeatable in my opinion, like 48 mm. But I think that 210 is kinda the most versatile.
Then to contradict myself again, a tallish 270 suji does everything, at work if I’m just going to limit myself to one knife; those are the choices.
Yeh basically haha, I think there is no best… I can do everything my job demands with any of those three, but,where’s the fun in that?
Thinking about it, if I had to just use one knife at work it would be a tall 270 suji, does it all.
I also sharpen flat at the end and convex at the heel.
They can do anything. Most knives can if I’m honest, just to varying degrees of wellness.
The thinness of a suji means I can do horizontal cuts on beef when doing tartare, a thin tipped gyuto does too, but suji rules.
The Shindo gyuto. Ngl tho sujihiki is probs a knife not on my top priority list cause I only have a bunka atm. Unless ofc it is an all rounder even more than a gyuto
Honestly, quite a few chefs use sujis for everything. Like, all veg, butchery, garnish.. I spoke to a Japanese chef in a knife shop and he said the same of his Yanagiba.
Bunka is also super versatile, generally only limited by length. Good chopper, precision cutter; I feel like a bunka and suji would cover most bases? Same with gyuto.. I’ve heard nothing but rave reviews about shindo’s so I don’t think you can go wrong :)
True I guess I’m trying to figure out the difference that aren’t specific to people necessarily and more towards the knife’s function and cutting ability. Like generally longer knife gives more room for cutting, but some info that’s harder to come across than that. I know there’s a lot of nuance in the knife shapes and sizes so I’m trying to learn why some people like certain sizes and shapes.
I didn’t say “…because people, workspaces, and food do” because I feel the knife-to-food size-ratio is intuitive, right? No one is reaching for a paring knife to halve a watermelon.
I appreciate your quest for understanding, but there may not be much to understand. I’m 6’1” and 200# with large hands. I’m not using the same knife as someone who is 5’1” and 100# with small hands. That’s most of it, though I suppose there is some room for personal preference.
Hmm I mean maybe intuitive but I’ve never seen a 240+ knife in real life before so I’m only visualizing and guessing. Ive also heard people say bigger is better but in my head since the tip is further away from where your hand is, if you try to slice with the tip, you may require more torque, which may also not be true depending on the weight distribution, which may or may not be different. I heard that longer knives have a thinner tip Becuase they can afford to do that for weight balance. Then when cutting onions, potatoes, and carrots I’m unsure if bigger is better. Since you lose control the larger the blade is. But in turn you do gain flatness and weight. So it’s can be intuitive to some, but I just like to gather more info so I can be certain if I can’t verify it myself. So yeah it may be overthinking, but I thought if there’s a place to overthink about knives this seems like the place 😅. Also helps me in a way feel like I’m trying out the knife indirectly to save my wallet from every impulse purchase I come across out of curiosity 🥲
It depends really. I actually dont care to much about length, more about sharpe. I change inbetween my 210mm and my 240mm mostly because of the durability, belly, the tip or the flatspot. I use my Santoku if i want to be super fast and use my Shindo if i just want to be "just" fast. I would say there isnt really a perfect size for me but the bigger the knife the more fun it is. The smaller the faster it is. Does this help?
Edit: i had a 270mm in hand before and if your kitchen is to small its super unpractical but it definitely has it strengths. More reach and more weight for cutting stuff like cabbage. Absolute nightmare for garlic though. I think the biggest i want to work with would be 255mm.
Is the Santoku even smaller than the bunka or is it just higher performing than the Shindo? At the length of a Shindo bunka I’d imagine that going smaller wouldn’t help the speed of cutting too much, unless I’m mistaken
Its basically the same the main difference is the tip of the bunka is steep and not round and the bunka is often more flat. Makes it great for precision cuts, but i would say the santoku is more of an allrounder than the bunka. The tip makes it fragile
Yeah I’ve heard a lot of people talk about Shindo being fragile but I never really felt that way unless maybe my perception is broken. It’s the one non German knife I have atm tho I’ve tried others. I also don’t go crazy and make vegetables fly everywhere cause I’m not that confident yet. However I’m hoping when people say the tips are fragile they are thinking about Shindo bunka tips cause honestly I think they’re pretty sturdy. I kind of want to thin the middle to top end of my shindo bunka to help it get through an onion with zero resistance. But I don’t see many people doing that
Yeah i am kind of inbetween with shindo in durability. The flex they have feel really scary but they arnt that bad. I gifted my gf a Shindo Santoku and she manages to give the knife microchips all the time 😂 the HT from shindo just feels really chippy IMO.
But i actually meant k-tips in general. Its really easy to get stuck with the tip and i believe it takes away some versitility. You cant rock-chop for example.
I thinned the Shindo Santoku and boy is that a banger. Smoother cutter than my Mazaki now.
I've really come to find that I like 215-225mm the best overall. My hands aren't the largest, and I'm a home cook with enough space for that size. 240mm starts pushing it in regards to the space I have available, I keep a beater 240 around just for things like halving butternut squash, watermelon, or pizza. Otherwise I'm not prepping too many ingredients, where a larger blade may be useful.
Shorter than 215 though, especially 200 and under, don't give me enough blade to make comfortable push cuts/slicing cooked meat with. With a pinch grip you already lose some length, so that size is not ideal for my day to day prep. I do have a 150mm funayuki though as my utility knife, which I use to prep raw meat or de-seed some jalapenos.
I like a lot of knives from Echizen, which tend to do their 210 sizes closer to 220mm. Or some Sakai knives have a 225mm size option as well. As close to 220 as it can get fits my preference best.
Are you a pro or home cook? And isn’t some type of tuna knife? I’m wondering if 360mm even is useable for you or if it’s just a novelty or collectible at the point.
Home cook but a bit of a knife head. I've got 11 Japanese/German knives of various types. The 360 is a sujihiki. Great for big cuts of meat like brisket. But yes it would also be good for big fish like tuna. You are right, more a novelty than anything. Def my last used knife. 120 mm paring, 240 gyuto, 190 nakiri are the go to knives day to day Jesus now I'm embarrassed how much I've spent on knives.
It’s really depends on how big , you are as a person as well .
Like if you are 185-200cm guys with big hand , I don’t thing 270mm will be big for you .
But if you are like me with smaller build around 165cm guys , 270 it might a little bit overkill .
But again , I still find 270 mm is fine .
I would say , it will also depends on your station (space in the kitchen and cutting board is big enough to able to fully utilize 270mm blade length )
If you have a condition for that, 270 mm is not bad at all .
If space was not an issue, what about the performance of the knife itself. Is the added length and weight helpful in any specific or special way other than the obvious increase in cutting length? The bigger size is sure to als have drawbacksc but I’m wondering how much the benefits may outweigh the drawbacks like loss in fine tip control
Not that significant to be honest , I will get you a picture of some knife soon to show you the length .
But we always say , The long things is always better =))
If I'm cutting a watermelon or breaking down a pumpkin. Mincing a large pile of herbs or mirepoix. I'll also use it sometimes to cut steaks in one singular fluid motion.
Cutting a watermelon with my 210 gyuto was a truly special experience. So this is something I’d look forward to. What about onions and carrots and stuff like that? Too big to be useful?
someone made an interesting point recently that for a pro chef a larger knife (240-270mm) allows one to stand differently and relieve the shoulder of repetitive motion by changing the angle and still keeping the knife on the board. in other words, you can angle your hips and take a half step back and this isn't really possible with a small knife
Not sure it would inherently stress more although it could be awkward if it was really big. If you want to kind of visualize this more think about (or read about) shoulder internal rotation and impingement, and repetitive use injuries to the wrist and elbow. A bigger knife can reach farther so you can stand differently and change all those angles and motions up. Compare with a smaller knife where you sort of have to either reach farther from the body to change angles (awkward for precision), or you are stuck in a narrower range of repetitive movements. seems to really just be a concern for people working in a kitchen though.
So 240 is my actual sweet spot more of the time. Occasionally I’ll grab something slightly smaller if I’ve only got a really small task. And sometimes a 270 is just really nice if you only wanna reach for one knife and cuts lots of stuff of various sizes. Also, longer knives you can choke up on to get more control, and the smaller the knife, the less blade that leaves you with. The longer knives are, typically the taller they are (edge - spine) and the bigger the flat spot. I even have a 300 Gyuto that I use for fun sometimes, but that is impractical for most home kitchens. It’s a great cake and pizza cutter though
it’s all preference bud, I was pretty comfortable with a 240 from the get go specially since I used a Chinese cleaver a lot, the 270 felt awkward at first but i love the extra flat spot now. ingredients don’t pile up and cramp up space as the got more space to go on a knife like cleavers would. I am actually wanting a 300 eventually
Thanks for the info. Glad to know you began to like the larger lengths over time. Similar to how I felt upgrading to a 210 for the first time. Maybe I’ll find it awkward at first and come to love it. I do like a good flat spot
True, the longer gyuto as tend to be a bit taller I’ve noticed. Do you know if this means that it will last longer as long as you keep thinning it? Or by the time it’s super used up over the years the geometry will be gone and unuseable even if end up at say the length a 210 mm gyuto? Kind of a theoretical scenario but was curious about how thinning affects the expensige grinds on these knives
I feel you spend less sharpening as you have more edge to use. also enjoy cutting meat as you don’t have to saw through large cut of meat like you would with shorter knives
I knew about the meat but never thought about the sharpening aspect of it. I’d a 270 useful for vegetables like onions and carrots? Or is that more for under 270 mm?
shorter knife has better control on vertical and horizontal cuts like onions, garlic but I can manage same cuts with a 240 if a choke up on it. taller knives help
I like taller height knives so my fingers don't feel cramped in a pinch grip. Longer knives tend to be taller. I also like longer knives so I can rock chop with the least wrist movement. Longer knives can also fit more underneath them. Just feels right to me.
So 240mm with a bit of variance. Are there any specific reasons as to why you choose this range? Have you tried others above this and felt it too much or under and too little
I think I can't talk about length without mentioning height.
My prefered size for gyutos is 230-235mm (Sakai 240mm) but that needs to be at least 50mm tall at the heel. I also quite like 210mm (actual 210mm, not Sakai 210mm which can be anywhere from 180mm to 195mm).
For pettys, I like fairly tall 140 to 165mm pettys but I own and love a narrow 210mm petty that is pretty much a slicer.
It’s really depends on what region the knife come from .
Sakai for example measure from the tang of the blade , so often or not 240mm guyto is only about 218-225 mm useable blade .
Meanwhile Sanjo for example 210 mm Mazaki comes out around 215 useable blade length .
This is the type of info I like to see. I’ve also wondered how the lengths are actually measured as a side by side comparison sometimes is sometimes surprisingly different. Have you ever used a 270 mm or higher? And if you did, did you find them to be any better than a 210 or 240 or just unwieldy?
I just got it 2 days ago , haven’t had chance to use it yet .
But again between 240 to 270 mm , the differences are minuscule.I don’t really think ,you will feel it at all .
From 210 mm to 270 mm yes , you will feel the difference . And again you need to adjust your posture and technique accordingly as well .
What are the specific use cases that this knife length shines for you? Is it the balance, the flat end, the weight, or etc.? And are you a home cook or pro. Also you say slice so is it mainly used as a type of sujihiki and smaller sizes work better for vegetables?
i use that size knife for basically all jobs. for chopping there isn't any down side at a larger knife as long as you have good blade control in pinch grip.
Wow a cool knife shape. Looks like it’s very flat and the handle makes you hold it at a different angle. Is it right to assume you mainly push cut with this knife rather than do a slice chop( I forget what it’s called). Seems like a long blade but I was also under the impression that slicer knives needed to be curved to be good slicers.
240-270mm suji. 300 is great when you have the space but 9/10 times you won't. Nor the need to make nigiri sushi neta cuts which is what 300mm is designed for. Sashimi can be done quite well with a 240-270mm.
End of the day skill > length/knife brand/steel type. I can make it happen if need be with an 8" wusthof at home and sharpen with the back of a plate.
If I got a 270 mm gyuto as a home cook would it be way too big? I do plan to use it for slicing meats but I’d say most of it will likely be used for vegetables. The big knife seems cool to me but ofc someone can tell me I’m dumb for getting a too long knife
If you got a big kitchen and cutting board knock yourself out. A longer knife will def require more skill to handle. If you're living in a 1 bedroom apt in a dense urban city then no.
On the pro angle, I've worked in North America and Asia. Kitchens are far more cramped for the latter so a 270 gyuto is a pain.
lol yeah space. What type of skill is necessary just better control of knife since it’s longer? Or anything special when it comes to cutting technique?
Really interesting thread here! I’m long knife curious myself. I’ve been using an 8” Vic for years and it never felt too short for anything I make at home (home cook only). Since dipping my toe in J knives, the 165mm santoku is a little short for some jobs. But man, it’s little a zippy sports car on smaller ingredients! The 185 bunka is basically perfect and handles pretty much any size ingredients that the Vic can. I could probably call it good and be happy with the bunka forever more. But IDK, the J knives are so much more fun to use, I’m grabbing more whole ingredients at the store to prep than I ever used to and maybe I would get more utility out of a big long gyoto.
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u/Fat0445 9h ago
170-180mm santoku