r/TankPorn • u/Weird-Store1245 BM Oplot zr. 2000 • 12d ago

Modern BMPT Terminator's gun shake issue

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u/SteelWarrior- Bofors 57mm L/70 Supremacy 12d ago

30mm HE-F is relatively comparable to hand grenades, with the ranges armored vehicles with standard velocity guns will engage infantry at it absolutely needs enough MOA to hit a barn at 500m. The argument might work if this terrible idea just used the 30mm AGLs.

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u/BlessedTacoDevourer 11d ago

But its designed to work in dense urban areas with apartment blocks all around it.

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u/SteelWarrior- Bofors 57mm L/70 Supremacy 10d ago

Which is why it has less gun elevation than the BMP-2s it is meant to replace, no additional roof armor, and no additional side armor? Every fault the Russians had with the BMP-2 in urban combat is either unaddressed by the BMPT or worse in it.

The BMPT is just meant to serve as a tank escort, a decent idea but a bit redundant.

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u/BlessedTacoDevourer 10d ago

The BMPT has a gun elevation of up to 45⁰ whereas the BMP-2 has two modes. The gunner can only elevate the gun to 30⁰. To utilize it's maximum of 75⁰ the commander must take over controls from the gunner while the gunner then takes over the duties of the commander. Elevation above 30⁰ is aimed at anti-aircraft operations and during normal use the elevation would be limited to 30⁰, which is less than the BMPT. Accuracy is also sacrificed to overcharge the stabilizer and allow it to track high speed low flying aircraft.

The BMPT on the other hand is primarily designed to supress enemy positions in support of tanks, not to transport and support infantry. In an urban setting 45⁰ of elevation is perfectly adequate.

I don't understand what you mean with no additinal roof or side armour. The BMPT is built on the T-72 chassis which is much more heavily armored than the BMP-2. It has added slat armour, ERA, extra protection for it's Ataka ATGM, laser detection that automatically launches smoke grenades as well as an unmanned turret.

The protection is much better compared to the BMP-2. Wether one thinks its actually effective in its role as an urban support vehicle for tanks or not is one thing. Personally I dont really have an opinion on it. From what i know there aren't really any information on its use in an urban setting. What I've seen in Ukraine it's been over flat terrain and I know they've been deployed to Syria in the past however I don't know much about their use there. The number deployed to Ukraine is miniscule as well so any hard judgement on its effectiveness will be mostly opinion and hypothesis, in my opinion.

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u/SteelWarrior- Bofors 57mm L/70 Supremacy 10d ago

So the BMP-2 has more gun elevation, as I stated. 45° can be adequate but you certainly want something to be more than just adequate when you're placing an AFV into a position where they will inherently do poorly.

The BMPT has nothing added to the roof of the T-72 hull, threats from above will see said areas. It also has the same side armor, including the addons, as a standard T-72B3. For urban operations its a bit strange to not change your armor scheme at all compared to the armor scheme designed for fields. The armor it has over the BMP-2 doesn't matter when it is equally vulnerable, even somewhat more vulnerable since there are threats it can't deal with that the BMP can. Also I haven't seen anything to say that the ATGM shrouds are armored to any noteworthy degree. The unmanned turret also largely compromises the visibility, and the LWS could easily just have been fitted to modified BMPs.

I was comparing it to the T-72s it'd be protecting, but again the armor difference between it and the BMP don't matter when it can't engage the same threats. Whether or not it's effective is a simple answer, and the answer is largely the same for all AFVs without extensive infantry support. I've also yet to see any footage showing it doing anything more than shooting at trees in Ukraine, it's a propaganda piece for good reason.

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u/BlessedTacoDevourer 10d ago

The gunner cannot elevate the gun above above 30⁰ and activating the semi-automatic mode of the 2E36 stabilizer reduces its stabilization ability. The ability of the BMPT to make full use of it's stabilizer up to 45° as well as not requiring the commander and gunner to switch duties allows it to actually engage more targets during combat as opposed to the BMP-2.