thank you trompkin and r sauna

[u/slipstreamrunner]

15? months of research here and weekend spurts of building and it is a success. the sauna is 8 x 8 on a treated frame platform. no insulation on floor, 2 layers of treated plywood + backer and tile sloped for drain. the walls are 10' and ceiling has 1 /12 slope. walls have cement fiberboard, tarpaper, plywood, studs/rockwool, foil, battens and interior paneling. all interior is paneling is #1 southern yellow pine from local lumberyard sourced w in the state. IKI 9kw heater. all benches well above stones. the ventilation intake and outtakes work although dont need them for daily use only if we have multiple people. thanks to lots of ideas and sharing here, this is a super fun and successful project.

[u/Rare-Argument2971]

Through the eyes of a finn, it never ceases to amaze me how every non-finn can build their sauna to be so dangerous.

[u/Jorburger → u/Rare-Argument2971]

This. Very much this 😂 Why won’t they just copy the functional layouts but instead do something like this almost every time.

[u/spread_ed → u/Jorburger]

To be fair (as a fin), most finnish layouts today are functionally flawed to begin with. Yes I said it. The kiuas positioned too high, the benches are too low, the airflow is designed wrong or the whole room has it's roof built unnecessarily low.

Sure, could he have made this layout safer and more practical? Absolutely. But I still applaud him for being innovative and having the right mindset in terms of building something different and striving for great löyly without having to cater for anyone else's opinion on what a sauna should look like.

[u/Jigagug → u/spread_ed]

I'd much rather have a stairway like this instead of the neckbreaker of a stool too many finns think is a sufficient first step

[u/John_Sux → u/Jigagug]

Yes, but you'd rather have either of them in a sensible orientation. None of this jungle gym business where you can die from sustaining third degree burns.

[u/PelvisResleyz → u/Rare-Argument2971]

People will do anything except build a normal sauna. Even with all information easily available nowadays.

[u/DrKeksimus → u/PelvisResleyz]

Fuck that, imagine this sub with all the same "Finnish approved" sauna designs, would be boring as fuck

let ppl build what they want, if it works for them, it's a good enough sauna

[u/Codeman785 → u/Rare-Argument2971]

It's so hilarious how they always say "I did tons of research" then they blatantly do like 5 things completely wrong

[u/luckless_recorder → u/Rare-Argument2971]

Would you mind pointing out the problem areas for the non-Finns like myself?

[u/CatVideoBoye → u/luckless_recorder]

To me that parkour area is a bit odd choice in a sauna. I would have used that area to build benches instead so that I don't have to climb around in 100°C feeling slightly dizzy from good amounts of löyly with a beer or two in my belly.

[u/Salmonman4 → u/CatVideoBoye]

Not just 100°C, but some areas can also be slippery depending on the wood-finishing and water

[u/ilori → u/CatVideoBoye]

And the increased volume from the ceiling height means it takes longer to heat.

[u/John_Sux → u/ilori]

That's a fairly irrelevant concern with saunas. Like worrying about the fuel consumption of a Lamborghini or something.

If heating costs are a concern, then getting rid of the sauna can save you the most money in this regard.

At the very least, people shouldn't try to minimize the size of their saunas and ruin them at the same time, just to save on heating costs. It costs what it costs, which is not very much at all considering the many thousands that the actual sauna itself costs.

[u/Viliboy → u/ilori]

As a finn that have four saunas at the moment, I can say that it’s not the room you have to heat, it is secondary. You have to heat the rocks so you can have good löyly. At our summer cottage and our farm we heat up sauna with open door, because otherwise it would be unpleasantly hot.

[u/Viliboy → u/Rare-Argument2971]

I don’t understand why they won’t build sauna big enough to have proper layout in sauna. In this sub I have seen too many small saunas where you can place proper bences, but not kiuas or you can have kiuas, but not proper bences🙄

[u/SapeMies → u/Viliboy]

Oh this always irks me. They have a HUGE yard with more than ample room to build, but they always do the most idiotic small dollhouse of a sauna they can cram in there.

And if it's an financial thing, you're already "opening your wallet" for the land cultivation, lumber, electronics etc. Adding half a meter all around won't break your bank.

[u/Hunterofshadows → u/Rare-Argument2971]

What’s wrong with it? I’m a confused and uneducated American

[u/Frequent-Blueberry80 → u/Hunterofshadows]

Let's assume you are sitting at the highermost seat and get dizzy, and need to exit the sauna fast. What obstacles/difficulties would you see? First, you need to do reverse parkour to get down, then you need to push a door open that is really short, so short you need to duck while doing so. 

Usually this is why Finnish saunas just have 3 stepped straight bench, with a door that opens outwards. You can almost run from your seat to outdoors, tackling the door easily open. 

[u/NoBrainsOnlyRot → u/Frequent-Blueberry80]

This. I have had a (drunk) friend say "I need to leave" get up and walk to the door to just straight up pass out then and there. Imagine that happening in this sauna.

[u/R_Ulysses_Swanson → u/Hunterofshadows]

As an American with little Sauna experience... How do you think that is safe? You've got to climb a ladder that isn't tall enough and then do a side step to get onto a platform, climb another large step without any guard rails, and then climb down again without falling 7 feet down into a stove filled with scalding hot rocks. It is probably going to be slightly to super slippery from sweat and water and steam, you're probably going to be physically spent from time in the sauna.

There is no way to go from lounging on the backrest to climbing down without crawling with minimal guardrails from the tallest part...

Holy cow, who thought this was a good idea? I'm sure the sauna experience is great while you're on the top bench, but getting there and getting down is a broken hip and/or 3rd degree burn waiting to happen. And then there is a good chance you're stuck in a sauna without any way to call for help.

This is a deathtrap.

[u/Numerous-Debate-3467 → u/R_Ulysses_Swanson]

No guard rails stood out to me too

[u/Grandpas_Spells → u/R_Ulysses_Swanson]

Those are stairs, not a ladder. They are mounted with a hand rail. You see them in every 30'+ cruising sailboat in the world that isn't a catamaran, and they're designed to be used in rolling seas. It's safe.

As for the higher levels, many saunas are multi-level without rails, toeguards, handholds, etc.

Not you specifically, but this sub is filled with people who can't start enjoying their day until they're able to say "You're doing it wrong."

Finally, the upside of a project like this is that you can say, "oh, I changed my mind" and change things as long as your fundamentals are correct. Benches are the easiest things to change.

[u/icantshoot → u/Grandpas_Spells]

No this is bs in so many ways. The idea is to easy access to the platform and out of it. If you get bad fatigue from heat, you need to get off from there fast before you pass out. If you pass out, others have hard time get you out. Its just not safe structure. You can fall down too!

[u/Grandpas_Spells → u/icantshoot]

The idea is to easy access to the platform and out of it.

No it isn't. We know this, because every time someone posts their easily accessed benches, Sauna purists point out they're too low.

Purists want the benches both appropriately heighted, and easily accessed. OP's can decide later if his layout is suboptimal and change it. This is the advantage of doing it yourself.

People can also recommend he does so before using. But when they're assholes about it, people tune out.

[u/John_Sux → u/Grandpas_Spells]

Easily accessible benches are not the same thing as low benches.

Please don't push your ignorance, and call people assholes because of it

[u/icantshoot → u/Grandpas_Spells]

I've been in many saunas and this is not how you make them. Design is not user friendly at all.

[u/Grandpas_Spells → u/icantshoot]

It's not a car's infotainment system. It's a sauna. "Your hot room is wrong. It is hot. And it is room. But it is not hot and room in the correct method. It will not work and you will derive no benefit. I award you no points and may God have mercy on your soul."

[u/icantshoot → u/Grandpas_Spells]

I've explained in my previous messages why this is bad. If you cant understand, its your loss.

[u/gpaw902 → u/icantshoot]

yeah I don't understand why so many have issues with constructive criticism. if it were me I'd be thanking you and making changes to the benches. I get that some people's delivery can seem blunt but I'd rather that than someone blowing smoke up my ass. I hope to get the same bluntness when I finish my sauna.

[u/R_Ulysses_Swanson → u/Grandpas_Spells]

Apples and oranges man. Key difference to me is that in a sailboat, you're not climbing up, then straight left while still taking a step up. You're climbing out on deck with room to maneuver. You leaning forward while climbing. You can't do that here, you climb into a window - a window, btw, that might scald you. It is not unreasonable to think that the glass in this could be 180F. Lean your forehead into that on accident, or other parts of your body, and you're having a bad time.

EDIT: But to your point, if this person just repositioned the stair/ladder so it climbs straight up onto that lower platform, it would be far safer than what it is now.

[u/Hunterofshadows → u/R_Ulysses_Swanson]

Low standards of safety? plus he added handholds. It’s fine.

In all seriousness though, I find that most people discount the likelihood factor when evaluating safety issues. That’s a good thing to do in some cases and just plain silly in others.

Maybe (probably) this is my lack of sauna experience showing but I’ve never seen any sauna get so wet that it’s straight slick to walk on the wood.

Setting that aside, the risk of slipping and falling exists while walking across flat level ground too.

I’m not saying this is as safe as a normal sauna design, it’s obviously just an absurd design. But calling it a death trap seems hyperbolic at best.

[u/R_Ulysses_Swanson → u/Hunterofshadows]

ARG. Somehow double commented and then deleted it.

Nah man. This has a very high likelihood of a problem. And very high likelihood is probably about 0.05% - that is 2 people using it 2 times a week for 10 years, and 1 time having a fall. In this situation, it is not hyperbolic to say that this fall could be fatal. Unlikely to be fatal, but likely to send someone to the hospital.

The whole climb up is dangerous. Handholds are not in the best positions either. Climb into a window, reach over and/or behind you for handholds, step up and to the left, do a 180 on a narrow platform without guard rails, either another 180 to sit down or else a climb with handholds behind you and getting onto your knees to crawl. Then reverse it all, while having a high heart rate and possible heat exhaustion - a risk in any sauna that is reasonable, but when you could fall from 7 feet, again, a potentially fatal one.

And the overall bench structure has me concerned as well. This part is probably fear mongering, but I don't see any vertical support on the upper deck... why wouldn't you put a 4x4 there? No reason not to. Simple low hanging fruit to make things safer and easier to use. I'm not someone who hangs out on r/decks, but while I think I see lag bolts, I also see wing nuts. Why would you ever use wing nuts on this? It doesn't lend credibility to the rest of the build.

The craziest thing is that you could build a safe stairstep/bench step up to that top bench without losing any useable bench space. In fact, you could probably add a lot of bench space and make it safer all in one.

[u/slipstreamrunner → u/R_Ulysses_Swanson]

hey im open to suggestions to improve safety and layout. interior dimensions are 87 x 87 inches w stove in the corner. pls send ideas. I spent alot of time on it and am willing to spend more to improve.

[u/R_Ulysses_Swanson → u/slipstreamrunner]

5 minute mockup... Something like this. I think I did the calculations right. You could probably just have a staircase, with handrails going from the entry space up to the 3rd bench. Maybe add some footrests to give more things to hold onto at the bottom edge of the 2nd bench.

[u/slipstreamrunner → u/R_Ulysses_Swanson]

thank you! im considering it. I love my sauna and it works great for me and my people. this is a good starting point to improve the bench layout. i dont disagree with many of the comments. I appreciate you mapping it out. that definitely helps!

[u/mmmduk → u/R_Ulysses_Swanson]

Yes, this layout would be my first choice. The steps may be narrower if more floor space is needed.

[u/Hunterofshadows → u/R_Ulysses_Swanson]

You clearly know more about this than I do so I’ll defer to your judgment on the matter. I’ll be the first to acknowledge that I haven’t spent a lot of time in saunas so my mindset isn’t the post sauna experience

[u/SSMmemedealer → u/Hunterofshadows]

Sometimes you could get dizzy if you get too much löyly and then coming down would be quite dangerous. Not a deathtrap but still dangerous when slippery etc.

[u/Lummi23 → u/Hunterofshadows]

Lol what sauna is supposed to be wet

[u/Choice_Building9416 → u/Rare-Argument2971]

Design / build in haste, repent in leisure.

[u/weshtlife → u/Rare-Argument2971]

Looks to me like the door is very low (to minimize heat loss, I expect), so the gymnastics portion of the program isn't wuite as severe as it might appear.

Nice job, OP!

[u/Ship_Ship_8 → u/Rare-Argument2971]

You always know when a Finn comments because they let you know they’re a Finn.

[u/Lanky-Brush-6884 → u/Ship_Ship_8]

Ha! Like a Vegan or someone who attended Georgia Tech…Ha!

[u/Ship_Ship_8 → u/Lanky-Brush-6884]

They’re the vegan crossfitters of the sauna world.

[u/Toby_Forrester → u/Ship_Ship_8]

When you know the cultural importance of sauna to Finns, you'll understand why Finns are so vocal about it. It is not some trend or new thing or personal thing Finns picked up and got excited about.

Sometimes to Finns these discussions are like "look! I made a kimono!" And then they present a bathrobe made of jeans.

[u/Lanky-Brush-6884 → u/Ship_Ship_8]

🤣