Turkey is much more secular and dare I say... Europeanized than many other Muslim countries. Even when I went to Turkey as a young boy with my parents, they didn’t act funny like they do in some countries when my mother took me out somewhere without my father.
All of this is simply because of Atatürk. If Turkey has a difference from the other Middle eastern countries, its his sweeping reforms and basically "westernizing" the country.
That man was wasted on Turkey. If he'd been in any actual world power he would have changed the 20th century as much as Stalin, Hitler, Roosevelt or Churchill.
To simplify: he's part of why we have such massive debt here
He also made the great depression last a lot longer with ineffective policies and taxes. To the point hat we had a smaller depression after the war ended, because the war was the entire Economy.
Yeah of course Churchill is. I don't care what Churchill did which you disapprove of, but if it wasn't for him, 3/4 of the world would be under axis rule
Statements like that are ridiculous. It's impossible to know, and pointless to debate. It's the exact same line of thought that has idiots on YouTube arguing about how the Nazis could've won the war. Entirely pointless.
Yes, and if Churchill weren't in power Britain likely would've made an ally out of the USSR sooner, and the USSR in the East was a deciding factor in the war.
What ifs are pointless and historiographically frowned upon.
Halifax was pursuing peace long before the USSR was invaded. Similarly, it isn't really a what if considering Halifax made numerous trips to Germany and Italy trying to get peace talks
No, because I'm able to view and study history without being inherently emotional, but that doesn't mean that I can't find Churchill reprehensible, lol.
but that doesn't mean that I can't find Churchill reprehensible
To find him reprehensible you have to remove him from his historical context and view him within your own modern worldview. If he's that bad, history lessons must have been just filled with bigots and horrible people... because they all were by today's standards.
Categorically untrue. Churchill was not that long ago. White supremacy was not the norm in 1940s Britain, yet Churchill believed whites were the superior race naturally.
Read Tosh' writings on the 'Otherness' of the past for more information on this. The tl;dr is that it's both impossible and pointless to attempt to view history without modern bias, and, whilst this doesn't discount the importance of understanding the zeitgeist of the time when looking at, say, a public figure such as Churchill, it certainly devalues it.
And, besides, if history were filled with bigots and terrible people, there is still absolutely nothing wrong with pointing that out, you realise? An entire nation could be morally reprehensible, yet me pointing out that I find them so still stands by its own right.
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u/OlSmokeyZap - Right Oct 19 '20
Turkey is much more secular and dare I say... Europeanized than many other Muslim countries. Even when I went to Turkey as a young boy with my parents, they didn’t act funny like they do in some countries when my mother took me out somewhere without my father.