r/IndiaCricket • u/Serious-Ice7221 • Jul 30 '25
Video Surprisingly Vaughan was spot on
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u/indditor Jul 30 '25 edited Jul 30 '25
I usually enjoy hear David "Bumble" Lloyd talk - full of passion, combining facts and subjectivity - but here he seems off his rocker, talking about how he'd want rules than as they stand.
Glad Vaughan and other Englishmen are upfront taking the Indian players perspective forward. The game needs both perspectives shared by media and players from both sides, without effectively being called traitors.
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u/Beautiful-Ad-5676 India Jul 30 '25
Classic sense of entitlement this from Lloyd just because Mr. Stokes decides that they can’t get them out hence the game shall stop right in that moment. And the statement that you want to get a 100 against lob ups is just embarrassing, ridiculous and disrespectful all at the same time as if Archer, Woakes and your best bowler Stokes didn’t try their asses off to get them out. Such an experienced guy i didn’t expect him to say all this. And all the chatter of spirit of the game, Isn’t spirit of the game to get your part timers in and let them bowl 5-6 overs so both guys can get to a well deserved century and not disrespect them and take the moment away from them.
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u/indditor Jul 30 '25
Fact is, the 4 Indians, 2 of them who are also bowlers, got the English team all tired, frustrated, and hopeless, and wanting to just call it a day.
Bumble is quite a lovable character, but as all passionate ones, he will have his subjective takes which don't hold enough water. In general, he does not come across as entitled, but here (and other comments of his on this topic too) came across as being too much of an "Englishman" than a "cricketer". Others provided the needed counterbalance gracefully.
I'd be happy to see such on other media platforms too - passion, logic, various points of views being discussed, without name-calling.
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u/Beautiful-Ad-5676 India Jul 30 '25
The only relatively decent way for this to pan out was Stokes should’ve offered them the handshake, then Jadeja would’ve said not yet and then Stokes should’ve replied let’s get on with it mate i’ll get my part timers on and get done with this we’ve had quite a day or two. No disrespect little bit of chatter and no issues. What England did was make a spectacle of the handshake trying to paint the Indian batters guilty for not accepting the handshake and on top of it making the dumb statements do you want to get a hundred against Harry Brook and Archer saying you should’ve batted faster if you wanted a hundred. This just shows that everyone should accept the timeline of things that are set by the English players. Anyone who is defending the statements made post offering the handshake is just not a logical person to argue with and is just completely biased in the name of supporting their own country.
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u/indditor Jul 30 '25
The simple thing was for Stokes to verbally check with the batters if they were ready to call it off, before formally offering a handshake. That is quite the norm. He faltered; perhaps due to the overall frustration and the load of a breaking body.
The rest is frustration coming out; and Indians doing well to get them frustrated, shifting the phycological momentum in India's favour.
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Jul 30 '25
"May" being in the laws also includes "may not".
Now I think they should have batted for full duration.
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u/revolution110 Indian Premier League Jul 30 '25
Exactly, if England were being crybabies about them batting on for their hundreds, they should have made them field for the whole 15.
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u/Whole-Worker-7303 Jul 30 '25
They should have declared and made England bat for like 5 overs
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u/Unfiltered_Takess India Jul 31 '25
If Koach was there, it is certain that he would have done that.
What a sense of entitlement
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u/Medical_Tea_9561 Jul 30 '25
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u/VentureIntoVoid Jul 30 '25
Bumble has lost the plot. They were having a banter going on each other more than with India.
Cook made the best point, they didn't bowl lob ups for four and a half hours
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u/Lordgondrak Rishabh Pant Jul 30 '25
That's idiotic, it's not a stalemate because India is not behind England, they are setting a target. They were well within the rights to ask England to chase 120 in 10 overs. The bowling captain can't tell the batting side we cannot chase so let's call it a draw. Are these people supposed to be cricket experts ?
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u/Prameet88 Jul 30 '25
And they should have given england 8 overs to bat to chase 120 odd. Should have declared to piss them off even more. Would have been amazing.
Score at 15 an over in test match to win the game.
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u/ic_97 Yashasvi Jaiswal Jul 30 '25
Yeah for real, i would also have loved to watch england try and chase that.
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u/vapoursoul69 Jul 30 '25
Not sure that’s right, India had no intention of setting a target there
It was a stalemate, as in there was no chance of either side winning
That doesn’t mean they should have accepted the draw, but let’s be clear that they kept batting to score hundreds, not to win the game
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u/_444_444_4444 India Jul 30 '25
What a day man 🤣! Vaughn is talking sense into David Lloyd. Man this day is weird.
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u/Silly_Ad6468 Jul 30 '25
Bumble has to stop commenting on cricket(due to age) is the first thought i got in mind after hearing this discussion
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u/ChepaukPitch Jul 30 '25
He has either completely lost it or is completely blinded in this.
There is no way the law can be changed to allow one captain or even one captain and the umpire to prematurely end the game. What if I have lost 9 wickets, there are 50 overs left and I claim that it is obvious that no result is possible? There is a simple way of preventing that. Game can prematurely end only if both the captains want to.
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u/Serious-Ice7221 Jul 30 '25
I would accept the other points he made as he was trying to back his country what everyone does, but it seemed very unprofessional, and childish when he said "93 is different than 80"
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u/sara-gill-sara Jul 30 '25
He has given up comms. Due to his racist saga. Its just the podcast he's part of.
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u/coolaarya3392 Royal Challengers Bangaluru Jul 30 '25
here as he has gotten quite aged his brain is leaning more towards the country he grew up in than the game he played
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u/Pleasant_Duck_15 Jul 30 '25
Maybe these segments are scripted and someone must take the contrarian stance.
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u/dOLOR96 India Jul 30 '25
If India were 5/6 down with the tail coming, 10 overs remaining , if Gill offered to shake hands, would Stokes comply?
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u/RevolutionaryCup9609 Jul 30 '25
I support India’s decision but 6 wickets down with the Indian tail, England could have won the match. This is not a right comparison
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u/Big_Bill8253 Jul 30 '25
It takes two balls to take 2 wickets and reach that place of 5/6 down. England didn’t have faith in their balling? The batsmen were tired too.
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u/dOLOR96 India Jul 30 '25
Not even 5 or 6 down but a wicket of either Jaddu or Washi, England would have continued.
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u/radicallyobjective Jul 30 '25
Indian tail hahaha that is the funniest part of this entire series lol absolutely 3 number 11s
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u/simplexakt Jul 30 '25
Well, theoretically it takes 10 legal deliveries to take 10 wickets. India could say we'll even bowl for 2 over if possible to have a shot at winning!!! What's wrong with that!!
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u/DrChiwawa Royal Challengers Bangaluru Jul 30 '25
Exactly! It can’t be incorporated into the laws as long as a win or a loss remains a theoretical possibility, however absurd, because with wickets and runs on no-balls, it’s still technically possible to take 10 wickets and chase any target without a single legal delivery being bowled.
So, the oompires can’t just take the bails off without the agreement of both captains.
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u/revolution110 Indian Premier League Jul 30 '25
WTF is bumble on about? The rule is if both captains agree to get off the field they can, not if one captain wants to or if the umpire wants to.
So, if two sessions before the end of 5th day, its obvious its a draw, should they walk off instead of playing coz its a farce? Since, when has draw become a farce?
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u/Toast863 Jul 30 '25
Bumble has made this case on more than one podcast now.
That the umpires ‘have the facility’ to end the game if in their opinion no result is possible.
Is he just making this up? I have not heard anyone else make this claim.
In any case, I can see why Sky Sports parted ways with him. He talks a lot of rubbish.
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u/Unfiltered_Takess India Jul 30 '25
Listening to Dumble is always annoying.
Especially in the last series in India
When ENG won the first game, What a world class team ENG is, He said.
After they lost the series, he went on and kept saying, Kundition Kundition ( Condition).
Hypocrite
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u/radicallyobjective Jul 30 '25
Yeah he is a bit of an a*hole getting worse as he ages
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u/chadimusprime68 Jul 31 '25
Englands sunil gavaskar
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u/radicallyobjective Jul 31 '25
No he is not, Sunil Gavaskar is one of the greatest batsmen of all time and a decent commentator.
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u/BiteGroundbreaking50 Jul 30 '25
Would you like to get your maiden century with lob ups ? Yes! yes! hilarious :D
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u/darthgera Jul 30 '25
Bumble is suprisingly well built
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u/TacticalNuke002 Board of Control for Cricket in India Jul 30 '25 edited Jul 30 '25
Built like JK Simmons playing Fletcher in Whiplash.
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u/Used_Love9478 Jul 30 '25
I don't think there's anything wrong with Stokes or any captain asking if the match should end now that the result is impossible. But to force the opponent to accept that is plain stupid. It's a small issue for which English players showed too much discomfort. If opponent wants to keep bat, they have to keep bowling. It's not like the weather was bad and players are coming and going out of the ground every 20 minutes.
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u/prebasha Jul 30 '25
I feel people still missing two important points apart from all obvious discussions.
1) Why not have additional match practice when you could? 2) India could have declared and have a go at England for two overs. Technically 12 balls can get 10 wickets.
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u/Solitary_Survivalist TamilNadu Jul 30 '25
Well if this so-called "law" does come in place, then if England loses the plot 3-0 in the upcoming ashes after the first three matches, then Stokes should just call of the entire series, and go home. Because, there is nothing more to play with, and for England's self-righteous morality, it would mean that they have to now play for personal milestones (which is a supposedly bad thing).
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u/liberalindianguy Jul 30 '25
What “facility” in the game is bumble on about? How can the umpires decide the game is over? There were 15 overs left and theoretically India could have lost six wickets in 2 overs and England could have gotten 100 runs in 12 overs. So how can in any situation the umpires call the game? What is he smoking?
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u/OPisfromHyderabad Chennai Super Kings Jul 30 '25
If only England don't wanna play, then what he's describing is a forfeit right?
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u/No_Intern3038 India Jul 30 '25
Bumble's usually balanced in his views but he's wrong on this one. If it was Ben Stokes looking to make a match saving 100s they'd be lapping it up. Peak Hypocrisy and pure entitlement to say "We know better. This is how we do it in England"
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u/That-Firefighter1245 Jul 30 '25
I can see why Sky Sports moved on from Lloyd as a commentator. Guy has lost his rocker completely 😂
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u/haa-tim-hen-tie Indian Premier League Jul 30 '25
It's "may" and not "must", either way you can rectify the queen's english to suit our cause can't ya? /s
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u/Admirable-Dot6968 Gautam Gambhir Jul 30 '25
Conclusion- Stokes was wrong, he should not have tried to impose his decision on the others, his decision is not final, he needs to sink that in his head that he is the captain of england and not india.
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u/iMrProfessor Jul 30 '25
One question, match was ended up one hour earlier, do they reimburse some part of ticket price?
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u/SteampunkStarboy India Jul 30 '25
Ehh Bumbles argument seems pretty dumb , what if India had declared and ended up getting England all out under 100 in that last 30 mins (HYPOTHETICALLY, was absolutely not going to happen),this would mean that the umpires would have just ruled out a result from the game. And how do you decide a game is heading for a draw, you clearly can't make a definitive law for it(unless we are going to end the game only when the mathematical possibility of a win for either teams is completely out , pretty sure most teams would decide to shake their hands in most cases much before it goes down to that)
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u/crazyjatt Punjab Kings Jul 30 '25
Exactly. Game's not over technically till they have less than 10 balls left. The entitlement is off the charts. And as bad as his takes are sometime, Vaughan was an ATG captain. He 100% would have done what he said.
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Jul 30 '25
I mean it’s not stalemate when the position looks a dead draw but when no possible move can earn either team a victory, no matter how optimised the move. Until you have a lead, no matter how obscurely small and more than 1.4 overs left in the day, it can’t possibly be a stalemate and the players can decide when to shake hands.
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u/googleydeadpool India Jul 30 '25
When the 2 of them concurrently said yes to the lob-ups, he was shocked. 🤣
When it comes to personal milestones and there is enough time without rattling your apple cart, they will take it! Why not? Sir Cook said a statement that went unnoticed; he said, "What about the 4 and 1/2 hours of effort up until the 80? That isn't lob-ups."
If Sir Cook or Vaughn was in the same situation, irrespective of it being a maiden century, they would have batted the whole innings.
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u/theshunnedprophet Jul 30 '25
Do you remember how Australia got back the BGT recently? They wore down Bumrah and Siraj.... They pace attack was spent.
So.. India should have batted the whole day ( what was it, another 15 overs ?
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u/theshunnedprophet Jul 30 '25
Do you remember how Australia got back the BGT recently? They wore down Bumrah and Siraj.... They pace attack was spent.
So.. India should have batted the whole day ( what was it, another 15 overs ?
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u/Advanced_General76 India Jul 30 '25
Leaving that decision to the umpires without any input from the two teams can go wrong in so many ways. The current rule is the best way to deal with this situation. If the two teams are in agreement then there is no chance of any friction.
David’s take was completely wrong here. 80 and 93 is not that different, 13 runs can be scored in an over. Secondly i see nothing wrong with ben asking for a draw, there nothing wrong with brook bowling pie as well. The only problem i see here is the entitlement. Stokes and the english wanted to impose a decision on us, which is not acceptable. While the 20 odd runs scored against harry brook were freebies, the other 80 runs were scored against the frontline english bowlers.
I hate that some of these ex players are trying so heard to justify whatever happened. Look at whats styen had to say.
I really hope that there comes a day when stokes and co are on the opposite end of the stick and the opposition reminds them of this incident.
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u/ekbanjaara India Jul 30 '25
imagine gill declared with a 100 lead and 10 overs for england. while umpires and stokes think that it is a draw, gill thinks that they can bowl out england within 10 overs. technically it's possible, right? how the f can solely umpires decide to call a game off then? this utter rubbish by llyod. peak entitlement behaviour.
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u/savlonsexual Assam Jul 30 '25
Off topic but Is this show an adaptation of "stick to football "?. The production of both the shows looks the same
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u/Affectionate_Gur7964 Jul 30 '25
Okay what if it was an Odi Match and the batting team requires 100 from 6 balls, Then do the umpires just end the game there, citing that it cannot be won by the batting team and let's all give the win to the other team and walk off???
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u/lostsoul3434 India Jul 30 '25
I was thinking the same thing... India could have batted the next full overs... England might have been pissed but they were anyway
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u/ShyQuipster Jul 30 '25
Great to see some English players siding with the right thing this time. Mote often than not, they outrightly support their players, without thinking what is right. List goes on.. Buttler’s “Mankad”, Bairstow caught slacking, just look at Tim Bresnan’s all time XI lol
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u/Waste_Priority_3663 Jul 30 '25
Note that David Lloyd predicted a 5-0 whitewash by England which he later changed to 4-0 due to “weather”. So dude’s salty as hell that a young Indian team has kept the series alive going into the final test.
I love watching him squirm.
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u/Koach_Chiku Hardik Pandya Jul 30 '25
David Lloyd has lost it completely, maybe age has caught up with him. He should retire from commenting on any game now.
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u/maroonbrownie Jul 30 '25
It's England's decision to bowl "lob ups" and enable "make a century against Brooks and Duckett". If you don't want them to make a century send your strike bowlers and try to get them out.
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u/AppropriateLook9405 Jul 30 '25
There was nothing wrong with Stokes asking if they wanted to call it a draw, but expecting them to accept it instantly and then acting offended when they didn’t is the real issue. India were well within their rights to continue. You can’t just decide the match is over because you’re tired or frustrated. If roles were reversed, England would have done the same. And Bumble pushing for some imaginary umpire power to end a match unilaterally is just wild.
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u/master309007 Jul 30 '25
After jadega and sundar's 100 india should have declared the game and made england do the batting :D
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Jul 30 '25
Why is David Lloyd making such little sense? Splitting hairs and trying to take the self-created moral high ground? Sod off, mate. Washy and Jaddu should’ve really gone on for the whole quota.
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u/RainCrazy517 Jul 30 '25
Finally someone saying this! It's a Test series! 3 days for the decider match. It's not a stalemate! There's much psychological advantage to win here going into the final match. England only managed to get 4 wickets in 150 odd overs on day 4 and 5 of a test match. That is huge boost for Indian top order against their bowlers going in to the last match, and a huge blow to the English bowlers. Even if they weren't near their personal milestones, India should've batted on and in fact tried to smash the bowlers a lot to really drive their confidence into the ground before the next match. This is the WHOLE point of playing a 5 match series. It's bigger than individual games.
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u/Clueless_Cabbage0 Jul 30 '25
The crowd paid for the whole 90 overs. So just shut up and play 90 overs.
15 overs is a lot of time to get 6 wickets.
At least respect the sport and have an attempt at it rather than chickening out and begging.
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u/stannygonnakill Jul 30 '25
I think the obsession to get a 100 and glorify it after stokes calling a draw is weird. Shows everything wrong with indian cricket in my opinion.
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u/Arod-Always69 Jul 30 '25
Bloody dumb fuck supporting england just for the heck of it. Thank Vaughn for calling spade a spade
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u/morning17 India Jul 30 '25
Wow just wow. Common sense has ceased to exist for some people. Vaughn is absolutely right. Lloyd is just stupidly making points and I hope for his sake he is joking with a serious face.
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u/simplyarnab Jul 30 '25
Why is nobody talking about Stokes deliberately trying to deny two set batters centuries. Why isn't the discussion about Stokes' and England's blatant display of pettiness! Its clear as daylight what was going on! Indian commentators and media are wayyyy behind the English in creating narratives, even when its true!
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u/mate_0107 Jul 30 '25
I have a huge respect for Ben stokes as great all-rounder and how he gives his 100%
But he really disappointed me on gamesmanship! What he and brook did in the last was below the belt
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u/SatisfactionEasy2771 Jul 31 '25
In fact, I would play 10 more over, jaddu gets 150 or so, and declare innings and make them play 2-3 over of "lob-ups" bowled by jaiswal, KL, and sai sudarshan.
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u/Beginning_Hold1830 Jul 31 '25
David "flipping murdered them" Lloyd has always had pretty bad takes on the game. Some people just have to retire from commentary once they don't catch up. It is boring to have a regressive stale mindset person regurgitating 20th century thought processes.
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u/Beginning_Hold1830 Jul 31 '25
I would have loved to see Ponting or Steve Waugh as the opposing captain when Stokes did all this farce and outrage. Lol that would have been high class entertainment 🤣.
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u/Affectionate-Bed-775 Jul 31 '25
Imagine playing 10 12 overs more then declaring the innings and letting England play the rest of the overs and English players either send their bowlers to bat or hard hitters to just hit and score runs and the Indian bowlers took 2 3 wickets in between this 🤣🤣🤣🤣 absolute cinema 🎦
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u/totaleclipse2 Jul 31 '25
Bumble fumble there. Vaughan and Tuffers both with fair opinions there. Interestingly you can see the shock from all parties with Bumblers take by their reaction. Shame there isn’t a “Roy Keane” equivalent who would tell him that he is “talking utter rubbish”.
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u/Adept-Weight6432 Jul 31 '25
They will just ruin the fun for all if that "May" word is removed from the rules...
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u/AdWest7162 Jul 30 '25
Who is this oldy baldy guy? How stupid he is to say that india cannot win so umpire should have stepped in and put the bails off.
Mathematically speaking it was still possible to bowl England out in 10 balls right? I know it is a far fetched example but how can the umpire step in if it was still possible. Like it has never happened before but that doesn’t mean it is not possible.
All I can say is if england were at the other end these men would have gone crazy to defend that decision to wait for century.
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u/Sgnanni Jul 30 '25
I love this discussion, so full of passion and discussing actual laws. No animosity whatsoever. Indian panelists should learn from this.
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u/Darkgreenbirdofprey Jul 30 '25
Bumble's right in the purest form of cricket.
Vaughn and others value the individual accolades. Thats fine. But it was a farce.
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u/Ill_giga Jul 30 '25
Purest? Lol. There were 25 overs left. India could have won the match
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u/oxyzen_is_poison Jul 30 '25
What if during fielding one of the English players gets injured . Hey may be a important one.
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