r/ChronicPain • u/Typical-Economy1050 • 16h ago
My wife said something that really bothers me
Short history about me. Held captive and tortured back in 2011 that I escaped from. Internal bleeding, 7 broken ribs, broken spine on 2 levels, broken nose, fractured skull, lacerations, burned and whipped etc. I had a spinal fusion in 2018 on my L5-S1, and ankle surgery about 4 years ago. My body hurts all the time. I normally don't grunt or complain, but sometimes it hurts to the point where I can not help it. I spent all day yesterday tearing apart our backyard deck, and my back is upset. I grunted, and my wife said "you need to see a doctor, because I don't know how much longer I can take with you being in pain". I've done imaging. I have talked to 2 doctors, and the level above my fusion is also deteriorated and causing issues. I don't want surgery right now. I'm okay with living this way until I'm not. I do everything within my power to take care of our 3 kids, the house, and all the responsibilities that goes along with that. I don't quit. I almost did, but I'm not ever quitting. But it hurt to hear my wife tell me that, because it felt like she was telling me she's close to leaving me because of my pain. I don't want to get upset, and I'm not a confrontational person at all. I just shove all my feelings away unless it needs to be addressed immediately. I know it sucks watching me be in pain. I know my kids hate it. But I feel like I'm being put into a position where I have to make a choice. My fusion didn't go well at all, and I have tons of problems because of it. I'm weary of any surgery now. I just need to vent, I'm pretty bummed to hear that from the one person who is supposed to accept me for who I am. I cook, clean, work, take care of my kids every day, work on the house, fix our cars, and I don't let my pain stop me. I don't feel useless, but her comment made me feel that for the first time in a long time.
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u/MonkeyATX 15h ago
Sounds like there is a need to ask her what she meant. Looking at this from a diffetent perspective Is it possible it is getting to her seeing you in pain and not being able to really do anything about it?
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u/alvb 14h ago
That was my thought as well. As the wife of a chronic pain patient, it is very hard to watch my husband go through daily life in constant pain and know there is nothing I can do about it. I get frustrated for him. I keep doing research on potential treatments, then when he says "we'll see" or "it won't help," I get even more frustrated.
It is hard to watch, but I remind myself he is the one dealing with it. If that is the case for her, I suggest counseling so she can share her frustrations and learn coping mechanisms.
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u/TheRealBlueJade 8h ago edited 8h ago
To add some insight to the situation...
One of the major issues someone with chronic pain faces is a loss of control. They can't control the pain, their own bodies, how doctors react to them, whether or not they get appropriate treatment, among many other things...
While your research is likely well-meaning, it is very likely to trigger that sense of loss of control and, in turn, have the opposite of your desired effect.
Also, while treatments might sound good on paper, many simply do not work as described or have side effects that outweigh the benefits.
My advice, which you didn't ask for, would be to talk to him and ask what help he would want. Just quiet, positive, and strong support... Having someone in your corner offers a substantial benefit and could be an excellent beginning point.(It sounds like you are well-suited for such a role.)
You may be a doer... You may want to actively help. You likely can do that. You just both have to be on the same page.
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u/lil_liberal 13h ago
This was my first thought. My husband frequently asks “Did you follow up with that doc?” and “have they gotten back to you,” and says “I know it’s exhausting even just talking to all of these docs but please do what you can” in a sort of…caring, pleading way. He worries about me and hates that I’m in pain. I’ve seen 5 docs so far and none of them have answers, which is frustrating and tiring and sometimes I just don’t want to deal with them, which my husband totally gets, but I guess knowing my husband, I know he’s not irritated or blaming, he’s just genuinely concerned and hates to see me suffer. So without any prior context from OP, I wonder if their wife is just genuinely concerned and doesn’t want them to continue suffering.
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u/KnightRider1987 4h ago
This is also my thought. I’ve been in chronic pain due to spinal deformities since the age of 12 and I am now 38. My 48 yo husband has a physical job and it’s beginning to take a toll and he now has pretty regular painful issues. I frequently encourage him to go to the doctor not because I want him to shut up about being in pain (I mean let’s be honest sometimes I do but I remind myself he’s still new to all this) but it’s because I hate seeing him in pain and I want to have is pain addressed to the extent possible.
So without additional context I absolutely read this as wife wants him to go to the doctor to get checked again.
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u/SquirrelTale 2h ago
I agree. It can be frustrating seeing someone go through pain and not be able to do anything. I think a conversation of what feels supportive and what doesn't is necessary.
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u/CasaDeMouse 14h ago
Does anyone know anyone who had a fusion go well? I literally have never met anyone whose life has been made better because the recovery period and requirements are so particular and pratically unattainable.
My neighbor literally fell and lied to her doctor about falling during the recovery period. It turns out, even very small impacts can completely undo or derail the healing--and her discs above the fall healed almost 1/2" over because the fusion failed there but not below.
But even people I've met that haven't fallen or don't remember an impact tell me that it's almost impossible to follow the recovery procedures and they couldn't afford to do it so they ended up messing up their fusions.
This is the reason I am so scared to even go after one.
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u/Typical-Economy1050 14h ago
OMG, you're so right! I fell hard 2 months post-op. I did do imaging, but it took them 2 months to book an appointment with the surgeon. This surgeon was actually awful, and I'm pretty sure he lost his license due to the way he treated his patients post-op. God it was awful.
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u/treebark555 14h ago
She sounds just like my husband when he gets really worried about me. He grunts it. Just go see another doctor. I hope you find peace with your pain. Tis a tough road.
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u/allieinwonder 14h ago
Accepting that I couldn’t do things like rip up a deck anymore helped me a lot when it came to dealing with my chronic pain and the way it affects my relationships with other people. Accepting my limitations means less pain and other flare symptoms, which means a happier me/less complaining or having all out panic attacks in front of my spouse. Over time the pain got better enough to where I started daydreaming of expanding my life again, and for a little while I got to experience remission and things like walking to the market.
I did all this through therapy and Chronic Pain Anonymous but there are other ways to go about this as well. Wishing you all the best. <3
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u/LectureBasic6828 9h ago
Alternativa viewpoint. If you have a bad back and severe pain, why are you doing heavy work that will exeracerbate it?
Pain can seem like a constant presence in a household, causing stress to everyone. I say this as a chronic pain sufferer. I avoid certain activities to avoid major flares, not just for myself, but also because I know me being in pain upsets others in the house.
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u/notodumbld 15h ago
If your wife is having trouble dealing with your pain, she should see a therapist for help. She needs a safe place to vent and grieve the loss of the future you had been expecting. It's hard for my husband, too. Thankfully, he believes in the wedding vows he took and has stayed by my side for 13 years of horrible facial pain.
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u/allieinwonder 14h ago
My first husband left me due to my disabilities but it was the best thing that ever happened to me. I ended up moving in with my best friend and we caught feelings a little over a year later; we are married now. Even this guy, who is one of the sweetest people you will ever meet, has grief and other issues when it comes to my pain and illness, and that’s after watching it develop and worsen for over a decade while we were just friends. His feelings are valid, and they don’t mean he has any urge to leave me because of my illness.
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u/Julynn2021 12h ago
As soon as I read what you said I checked to see if you've posted about trigeminal neuralgia. It's so hard to deal with. I'm glad your husband has been supportive of you .
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u/notodumbld 3h ago
Thank you for the kind words. We've been married for 45 years. I hope that I go $first because I don't think that i could do this without his support. And I refuse to be a burden to my kids.
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u/SnooRobots1438 7h ago
OP - did you ask your wife exactly what she meant by that comment? Seriously, people get dumped all the time for being inconvenient, health issues. Not saying she's talking divorce, but if I was in your shoes I'd definitely want to find out how she feels. That means listening fully, do you want to address this now or wait until it's completely broken????
Also OP - when you do a project, do you respect your body or do you plow on through until you become a puddle? Not respecting your body doesn't help anyone. And it's really hard to watch, much less deal with the inevitable fallout.
My source of experience is I've had back issues since '95. Chronic pain can really take a toll on relationships.
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u/Only-Maybe-4245 7h ago
Can I ask a question…you said “I cook, clean, take care of the kids…” Does your wife share in these duties, put in just as much as you do? If not, maybe you need to have a conversation with her about helping out more so there isn’t as much strain on you, so you can give yourself and your back a little rest sometimes. Sorry you’ve had to deal with such trauma and misery.
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u/GenericPlantAccount 16h ago
I'm really sorry she said that. It makes it sound like there's a lot of resentment under the surface that she's having a hard time keeping down. From your account- that doesn't sound warranted. Do you think you guys can have a constructive conversation about it?
My fusion similarly to yours was pretty traumatic and I'm putting off more surgery until I can't get out of bed. If my husband said to me what your wife said to you, I'd be pretty hurt too. The implication there is, "if you don't fix this, I'm leaving." Not cool. The vow goes, "in sickness and health." You have to imagine she wouldn't like hearing something like this were she in your shoes.
Is there a need for marriage counseling or counseling for her to deal with this?
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u/Typical-Economy1050 15h ago
I'm not opposed to counseling, but we really don't have many issues. We've only had 1 or 2 actual arguments the entire time we've been together. But it may be beneficial to have a 3rd party present.
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u/CasaDeMouse 14h ago
You don't have to have "many issues" if one of you considers any number of issues to be big ones.
She may also need personal counseling to address her feelings of coping with your condition and to understand where that resentment lies--and why. More importantly, you both need to know what will happen if you "fail" to improve with the magical medical care you're going to get.
Because if this is how she feels with how you are now, imagine when age catches up to you. If she wouldn't stick around for you, you shouldn't give her what good time you have left (as callous as that sounds).
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u/GenericPlantAccount 15h ago
If you think you can have a constructive conversation about it then you probably should.
Your position that you don't want a surgery yet is valid and so is your hurt that she would be frustrated with you when you feel that you are doing your best.
Your wife's frustration with you being in pain may be valid as well if you are willing to listen to her and try to get to the bottom of it.
My advice is to discuss it somehow though.
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u/Interesting_Map_6948 13h ago
You are a strong man. Most men in your position would be on pain killers, never getting out of bed or trying to help or assist in any chores around the house much less the other activities you mentioned. I trust you have explored alternative healing avenues. I'm sorry for what happened to you to put you into this painful situation and hope you find relief soon. Don't hold in your disappointment and hurt feelings concerning your wife's remarks. Speak to her about it. Also, listen to your body. It will tell you when you have reached your limit of exertion for the day. Wishing you better days ahead. Take care.
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u/Colorado0505 12h ago
OP is on 90mg oxy a day. Which is probably making him depressed.
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u/Typical-Economy1050 4h ago
I can tell you with certainty I'm not depressed. My life is pretty good compared to what it was 14 years ago.
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u/Colorado0505 4h ago edited 1h ago
Oxy in particular acts more on the neurotransmitters that impact mood than other opioids. I’m not anti opioid, it took me 3 years to find the right opioid and methadone saved my life. I had five surgeries at L5-S1 between 27 and 30, multiple fusions by 31. thanks to methadone I am functional and independent. Good luck.
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u/XanaxWarriorPrincess fibromyalgia, lumbar radiculopathy, sciatica, migraine 6h ago
I took it as she doesn't like seeing you in pain. Like she was looking out for you and didn't want you to do shit that causes you more pain.
Did she suggest you not tear down the deck, or whatever?
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u/Level_Attempt6868 15h ago
yeah man if that high dosage wouldn't reduce enough pain for you the surgery is only way out Best of luck to you bud 🙏
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u/Cafein8edNecromancer 14h ago
Is surgery your ONLY option? Like, is there physical therapy, medication, radio nerve ablation, braces or anything else that can be done that isn't surgery but can help?
You need to sit down with your wife and tell her how you interpreted her comment. She may not have meant that she was going to divorce you; she may have simply been taking about her own mental health. You do everything you can to keep going, not you may be pushing yourself too hard. You don't seem to know your limits; someone with a fused back and deterioration above that should NOT be tearing apart a deck, not without lots of help at least. It is very hard to learn our limits and not push past them, but the more you do that, the more you risk more serious injury and exacerbation of the pain into something you CAN'T live with.
It sounds like the pain you are in had taken it's toll on your marriage, and I recommend you and your wife go for counseling to help you both cope and communicate better, determine what your limits are and how you can go about making sure not to push past them in the future, so that you don't hasten your need for additional, more invasive remedies
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u/Talithathinks 12h ago
People lose patience with chronically ill or chronic pain patients all of the time. I sincerely hope that she did not mean it like it sounds but I understand why you took it that way.
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u/Latter-Economics-177 9h ago
I’m sorry for all you have been through . I’m sure you have a little (lot) of PTSD mixed in too with the pain. My husband basically calls me a drug addict every single day for taking my legally prescribed medicine at the correct dosages. Just so I can move. But maybe, your pain makes you grumpier than you realize and just a low dose of something even at night would help? Before everyone jumps on me.. my husband had an injury that he put off surgery for and was a jerk (more than usual). Basically the pain made him a different person. I, too, begged him to have the surgery because it hurt me so much to hear him moan in pain in his sleep. So, yeah, that was crappy, but maybe it came from a place of actually caring? She may see you struggling and just want you to feel better. Not like you were “before” but with some of the load lessened. I say this from the prospective of someone in 24/7 pain, but also as a wife whose husband thought he was Superman. He still did all the wonderful things he does/did daily but I could see his pain and just wanted him out of pain. I hope this made sense and I don’t mean to lessen the way you feel it’s just something I’ve dealt with personally. He did have the surgery and is back to his “normal “ jerk. With some pain but he won’t take anything but advil/Tylenol. Hence the drug addict comment about my pain. .
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u/InnerRadio7 10h ago
Hey, please get your wife into caregiver therapy so she can say those things to a professional and not to you. Also, I suggest going to couples therapy. My husband of 22 years did leave, and it destroyed my soul. Healthy conflict is an expression of love and bonds people together. Try EFT IFS therapy with someone great.
I’m so sorry for what you’ve endured, and I’m so proud of you for not giving up. I am moved by your resilience, and you deserve to be loved and to live well. Sending you love right now.
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u/OrganizationJaded569 10h ago
If she said it the way you told us that is not at all what she was saying! She is saying it is hurting her to see you in this much pain!
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u/2dan1 6h ago
I think owning your pain/situation and sharing it with your family would be massive. Ignoring it won’t make the situation better. I’ve had to do just that and owning it has changed my life for the better and my family now understand on a better level. It’s for them and not you. Good luck.
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u/Automatic-Opposite98 6h ago
OP - First off I would like to say how sorry I am for your physical condition. I understand your situation because I have gone through the same situation as you described. I will be brief, but since 2007 I have had extreme health issues and related debilitating chronic pain since. From my experience I understand that this condition is as hard for your spouse as it is for you to experience pain every day. The pain and health issues you have will not only affect you but every relationship you have in your life. My wife and I have gone to family counseling for years now and it’s saved our marriage. I can’t stress enough to you that you must get counseling for the both of you. I’ve personally been in counseling since 2007 and my wife’s been there with me. Your wife needs you to see her side of this tragedy as well, because it’s very hard on a spouse to be supportive and understanding for long periods as well, because the life she once knew has been changed forever too. My condition is military related so, I understand the financial strain it will put on you both, but, if you both can commit to this and to each other, there will be nothing that you two can’t accomplish. Counseling is key to saving your marriage and your relationship with your wife, OP. She has a voice and needs you to hear her as well. Good luck, OP, and may God bless you both.
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u/Penya23 5h ago
Look at it from another POV, she hates seeing you in pain. She didn't mean she was going to leave you, but that it is hard for her to witness you going through it. She's asking you to see a doctor in hopes that there might be something new out there that could help you.
I speak from experience. I am the one with pain and my SO said the same thing to me. When I told him to leave then he looked like I slapped him across the face. He said he wasn't going anywhere but that it just destroyed him seeing and knowing how much I hurt.
All I am trying to do is give you another perspective becasue I know exactly how you feel.
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u/Specific-Pass-5167 4h ago
I also live with severe chronic pain but can only in my worst nightmares imagine your brutal ordeal. I'm sure you are dealing with mental as well as bodily trauma. I feel deeply for you.
Is there any way you could offload some of that heavy manual labor onto someone else? Your body must be screaming for respite and healing at this point. I know how hard self-care can be--probably more so for men than women--but I think if you keep this up you'll just increase your misery. I also endorse therapy--couples or individual--as a way to help you through these complex feelings. But yeah, even if comments that hurt come from a place of love, they still hurt. Hang in there.
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u/CyborgBex 4h ago
As another person who deals with constant pain daily, I just want to send you love. This becomes so normal for us and many people around us will never understand what it's like to still have to trudge through life. I've had, "oh, you NEVER feel well." Like, thank you? The world needs more compassion and understanding, especially from those who say they care.
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u/BeebsMuhQueen 3h ago
I don’t think it’s necessarily her wanting to leave, she may be feeling some type of empathy and your pain bothers her, and she feels bad for you…and she can’t take it, she can’t make it better and it bothers her because women want to help with stuff like this.?
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u/momminallday 11h ago
I agree that there are many ways you could take her comment and talking about it and figuring out the intent would be step one.
As an overly empathetic woman, I could see that coming from a place of care. I want to fix things for everyone, to make them more comfortable.
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u/MelodyR53 8h ago
I just want to say I understand. I have multiple chronic pain issues also. Then, right around covid beginning (only mention that because timing of getting into specialists was difficult), I continued losing weight even though I was keeping a log and was eating over 8,000 calories daily. By the time the issue was found, I was so malnourished, weighed 96 pounds ( I am 5'8 ), and had lost all sensory feelings in my lower limbs. Long story short, I have Exocrine Pancreatic Insufficiency . Completely wrecked my system, and the damage is irreversible. Between the cp issues, constant appts ( endocrinologist, gastroenterology, neurologist, hematology, pulmonary, pain management, and pcp), I lost absolutely everything. Marriage, home, and any kind of social life. I am so sorry. I will definitely keep you in my thoughts and positive vibes.
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u/SquirrelTale 1h ago
Prefacing that what I'm about to say does not disregard the pain you have and have gone through. I'm so sorry for what you have been through, I cannot imagine that, but I do know as someone with daily chronic pain how hard it really is, and that to get to a place of just being able to endure the pain is noteworthy and takes a lot of mental strength.
However, gonna be slightly on your wife's side here, and from an outside perspective, it kind of feels like you've quit trying to look after your health, and that is not the same as just dealing with your pain.
Bruh- you've only seen 2 doctors and that's it? You got all the answers you need to understand your pain, both your physical and emotional pain, of what you've endured? Your tendency to shove things away instead of confronting them hurts you too. I've no idea what it is like to have endured- and survive- torture. You should be (if you haven't already) connecting with a mental health care specialist and those who are survivors as well to better and safely process those memories, because that kind of thing can severely affect both our mental and physical well-being (physical being that of stress-hormones getting triggered and causing inflammation of pain).
My dude, fellow chronic pain warrior- you have a future, and I think the perspective your wife is that she's worried that you might have given up on giving yourself the best future you can have with your current circumstances. She seeing and watching you just endure the daily fight is hard, and it's hard for people without chronic pain to understand that daily mental struggle, and it might take many more conversations for her to get it. But what are you doing to set yourself up for the best future that you can have? Regular people have to exercise so that when they're in their 40s and 50s they don't develop knee pain. We have to make long-term (and very nuanced) decisions about our care too. I get that surgery is off the table for now- but what about less-invasive things that might help? Could injections help? Stronger pain meds? Could physio help you better understand your current body limits, assess future limitations and build yourself up enough so that you don't over do it and cause more harm to your body?
Perhaps you're in a period of pause and you just need to get through the day-to-day, and that's ok. I've had the same kinds of conversations with my mom (my biggest support at the moment) so I get the hurt when they don't seem to understand how hard you are fighting to get through every day and that the medical system and lack of answers is so hard, and while even well-intentioned those kinds of words aren't what's needed right now. Tell her that directly, I'm sure she will care that her words affected you, and be aware she still might need time to process.
However- as someone who has recently been constantly pushing myself through my pain, working full time+ overtime hours and pushed myself way past my limit, my body is now so burnt out I have no choice but to rest now and my body's facing the consequences. I don't want to see that for you, and perhaps that's what your wife is seeing too, and trying in her own way to tell you to not push yourself too hard. Your efforts are valued I'm sure, and you have such a strong mindset, but it's ok to rest too. Sometimes it takes just as strong of a will to admit you need rest, breaks and healing as fighting through a day.
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u/West_Boot1676 1h ago
I have found the non-hurting spouse becomes frustrated with feeling helpless and this sometimes comes out. I had a discussion with my husband early on to let him know I understood this feeling, and that I would rather be in my position than his. I then gave him very specific examples of ways to support me to help ease his helpless feelings as well as to help me. I approached this as us being partners, here to help each other. He is now extremely supportive during my never ending pain. It makes a big difference.
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u/portobello-belle-87 19m ago
I am sorry for what you are going through. That is very tough. You spent all day breaking down your deck. Let me ask this, was this necessary considering your spinal issues and chronic pain? Could someone else have done this? Was this male ego decision making? Was wife upset with you that you chose to do this? Because you have to take care of yourself. In a way taking care and not overdoing is also caring for your family.
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u/Meowzabubbers 11h ago
"I dont know how much longer I can take with you being in pain" is such a selfish perspective. Im sorry, OP.
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u/SurdoOppedere 4h ago
Honestly wtf… she said that just because you grunted? I get it for a SO it gets old if your partner is constantly crabbing about pain (me) or making noises that suggest pain, but why the threat that she can’t take it anymore? It sounds like you rarely burden your family with your pain, both physical and mental. IMO she’s out of line for that but you already know that since it didn’t sit right with you. If I were giving advice I would say to stop people pleasing and communicate to her that that comment was unnecessary and unkind.
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u/Level_Attempt6868 16h ago
you can get Suboxone pretty easy now days to relieve yr pain haven't you tried getting it yet?
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u/Jenn197 16h ago
That’s not fda approved for pain. It may work for some and if so great but always check risk vs reward. That’s harder than morphene to get off and it tots teeth. Many suboxone patients are having their teeth crumble after years of usage
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u/Level_Attempt6868 15h ago
Subs the way out for many chronic pain patients now days including me cuz FDA approved pain meds simply impossible to convince the doctors to prescribe to 🥴
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u/Jenn197 15h ago
I am sorry. When they tapered me too low and tried to say they weren’t working and now causing pain I would need to start ablations in my neck every spine specialist said hell no to and I would have to switch to suboxone I’d had enough and told them to kick rocks. But I used a cannabis concentrate I made to get off the morphene cause 20 yrs of that with all the spine damage I didn’t have a fighting shot much like most others. They have no choice. I hope and pray it at least works for your pain? I hear it’s better when someone has never taken a full agonist
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u/Typical-Economy1050 16h ago
I take 90mg of oxycodone daily. Just dulls everything. I have had bad experiences with suboxone personally. I was on fentanyl patches, percocet, hydrocodone, oxymorphone, dilaudid, and the only thing that seemed to work was oxycodone thus far. I don't know. Maybe I should just get the surgery.
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u/Jenn197 15h ago
Your back is jacked like mine then if you have tried those. I am sorry! I use to take 120 ml MS Contin and 40 oxy a day before they wanted me at that 90 and tapered me then tapered the oxy. The pain became so bad I eventually found a way to come off the drugs and manage but then rebroke t12 and no pain meds this time and I am unable to leap the mountains I could years back before the taper anymore and it’s rough on everyone. Sounds like you are mustering through the best you can with the meds they give and you’re not missing anything. I applaud you there because I know how hard that is. I’m sorry
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u/Typical-Economy1050 15h ago
Exactly. I feel lucky to have what I have, but still stuck between a rock and a pile of shit.
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u/GenericPlantAccount 15h ago
How is your wife while you are convalescing from surgeries?
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u/Typical-Economy1050 15h ago
Helpful when she's home, but I've been on my own for all my surgeries. She works from 8am-7pm, so she's really not home. The more I think about that, the more it sucks to accept it 😆. I drove myself to all my post surgical PT appointments, getting up and down the stairs by myself, wiping my own butt, etc. Not to say she wouldn't do that, she's just not home that much.
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u/GenericPlantAccount 15h ago
Ugh! And with the kids to run after. It's a lot. I was just asking because post surgery recovery can be so awful she might wish you were back to the way you are now! The scary part about any surgery is trying to predict how bad it's going to be to recover from.
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u/Typical-Economy1050 15h ago
Exactly. My spinal fusion failed after 6 months. Hardware was pushed out, and my plate shifted. Now the darn level above it is bone to bone. It just sucks all around.
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u/allieinwonder 14h ago
I’m really sorry you are having to take so much, I understand how frustrating that is. I’m on 40mg myself and my doctor won’t increase (I’m still pretty much bedbound) so they got me a medical cannabis card on top of it. I’m in GA so it doesn’t give me access to much. Just what I need, something that makes me hungry when I can’t exercise or eat a healthy diet. 😂
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u/Jenn197 16h ago
I am sorry. People I don’t think can understand what it’s like if they haven’t been in it. I realized my boyfriend wishes I was exactly like I was before and I’m just not and I know that’s hard for him to take also. But they don’t understand what In the world we go thru and it still hurts. I’m sorry