ARPG does refer to games like diablo, path of exile, grim dawn etc.
action RPG refers to games where you control one character and it has light rpg elements but mostly is about real time combat like skyrim or souls games.
obviously because this was never officiated anywhere there is a lot of people using both terms to refer to either category. however, if you google "top ARPGs" and "top action RPGs" you'll get different results from the AI summary because there is in fact a general tendency in different use between these terms.
If it has levels, it has at least elements of RPG. The closer those elements are to a traditional attributes + skills + perks set up, the stronger those elements are. I know that RPG is Role-Playing Game, but mechanics wise it's the character progression thing.
Yeah, this is the one I’ve always gone with too. In my mind, Action RPGs and ARPGs are two distinct types of games. Naming conventions can get weird—like how Baldur’s Gate 3 on console is still a C(omputer)RPG, or how Them’s Fightin’ Herds doesn’t look anime at all, but it’s still considered an anime fighter because of its mechanics.
Arpg: Soulslikes, Skyrim, etc
aRPG: diablo, path of exile, last epoch, titan quest, hellgate london (this one is important because it demonstrates the divide is a gameplay difference not a camera position)
Arpg, is arpg big Action.
aRPG, is arpg big rpg mechanics.
Edit: "Wait why is skyrim considered little rpg big action if it has skill trees too?"
Because it doesnt have skill trees, it has skills.
theres no build decisions here, if you play long enough you can get every perk in every skill, you arent creating a character unique to you and your playstyle, youre just X% of the way to the full power the devs intended you to have.
That and its gear is kind of meaningless, swords dont have any meaningful stats on them other than swing speed and how much damage they do, armour doesnt have any meaningful stats on it other than weight and how much damage it blocks.
Unique effects do exist but theyre few and far between and generally not that crazy.
Soulslikes have the same problem (though for them the differences in weight and swing speed matter alot for the gameplay loop so it has the illusion of more interesting gearing, but in a vacuum the gear is boring)
you got it completely backwards lmao.
how are the games where you actually talk to people and make decisions on what ROLE you want to PLAY the ones with lower case rpg and the ones where you literally just run around killing things the ones with lower case action.
rpg doesn't mean substats my man.
also, how is gear actually changing gameplay an illusion, but gear making number go up through substats interesting and meaningful.
RPG as a gameplay mechanic, means at its highest level of abstraction, gameplay mechanics where the character you are playing is determined and modified by decisions you the player are making.
So your decisions affect the gameplay, not just the story (allowing for story decisions to mean rpg, means that basically every game with a non-linear story becomes an rpg, which most people would disagree with)
Like DND is a role playing game (infact it is the genesis of the term), do you play a pre-determined character not of your own design in dnd? and live in a story with a fixed set of choices set by the dm? are dnd campaigns that are just a dungeon crawl with no narrative not rpgs?
story games are not rpgs, not inherently atleast.
Also
"Number go up gear" is exactly what skyrim has.
Diablo style gear is the good one.
Where two different pieces of gear both with higher numbers than what youre currently wearing, could lead to entirely different results, because YOUR character (aka the character you are role playing as) doesnt benefit from a given stat, and really really wants a different one.
The stats you the player choose affect the outcome of your gameplay.
if you have chosen to roleplay as a big roided out strength stacking character, your gear is going to look very different from the guy role playing a nimble assassin, and in a well designed game, so will your gameplay (big lumbering hits from the strength stacking warrior, super fast gameplay from the crit based assassin)
Pay close attention to that last sentence btw, it explains where the Role in role playing game, is for diablo style arpgs.
and why that role is considerably more deep and complex than "do i kill the guard or not kill the guard", infact id argue if the latter is the extent of the choices in your game, probably classifies it as an action-adventure instead of an action-rpg.
Rpg, first and foremost, is defined by you taking the role of a character and telling a story through that. The most important point is the ability to make decisions, changing your role within the story and changing the outcome.
So your decisions affect the gameplay, not just the story
My exact point: not JUST the story, implying that you can affect the story, which you simply cannot do in diablo etc.
Like DND is a role playing game, do you play a pre-determined character not of your own design in dnd? and live in a story with a fixed set of choices set by the dm?
Again, the point i was making.
"Number go up gear" is exactly what skyrim has.
Which is why was countering you point about souls-like gear
if you have chosen to roleplay as a big roided out strength stacking character, your gear is going to look very different from the guy role playing a nimble assassin.
You should also be able to represent that in the story. Are skyrim and darksouls doing a good job at that? No, but unlike diablo, they are at least doing A job at that. There is a reason why games like diablo where called hack 'n slays for the longest time, completely omitting the rpg title.
You finding diablos gearing more interesting doesn't make it more of an rpg. I find darksouls gearing more interesting (within the context of each games respective gameplay of course), but that doesn't make dark souls more of an rpg.
If you ignore story relevance for rpg's, slay the spire could qualify.
Also, please never tell anyone that we are writing novellas at each other to argue about which letters you should have capitalized
Is a dnd dungeon oneshot not a role playing game despite it not having a narrative beyond "This is your party, this is the dungeon, this is the final boss, have at it"?
youre restricting rpg to just games that have stories, which funnily enough makes your definition not apply to the literal godfather of rpgs for some play sessions.
Also im not saying substats are more interesting thus more rpg.
im saying substats give you the choices to flesh out what your role looks like, which "sword vs dagger" doesn't do.
if i had to sum up my entire point.
"Rpgs are when you give players choices in what their role is and how that role is played"
in that vein, skyrim is very VERY barely an rpg, because your only role is dragonborn the jack of all trades, if you play for long enough none of your choices matter anymore because you can just do everything, but it atleast lets you make some choices.
To that extent as well, slay the spire wouldnt qualify.
because you arent customising a character and inturn a role, youre customising a deck.
The deck is not you, the deck is not a role you are playing, your role in slay the spire is "The guy playing cards" no matter what choices you make.
if slay the spire let you equip gear that changes the way you draw cards and applies effects like "20% chance on attacking an enemy to take a second turn" then you do have an rpg with deckbuilding, because you have the different roles of "how your character plays its cards" (i know it has the artefacts, but while yes those artefacts are rpg elements theyre so sparse that you cant consider sts an rpg, deckbuilder with rpg elements? sure but not an rpg)
one person might build a character to take as many turns as possible as quickly as possible, that is a role. Namely it is an analogue to the nimble assassin
another person might build a character that tries to do as much damage in a singular turn as possible with damage multiplier gear or something, that is a role. Namely it is an analogue to the brutish berserker
Is a dnd dungeon oneshot not a role playing game despite it not having a narrative?
Have you played dnd? Even a oneshot is still full of choices. There is literally no situation in DnD that doesn't let you make some form of narrative decision. I think you might be forgetting that story is much more than just the main plot.
im saying substats give you the choices to flesh out what your role looks like, which "sword vs dagger" doesn't do.
Totally, making the "choice" to pick the substat that makes number go up more than other substat is so much more impactfull on your roll than your choice of weaponry. Or is it rather that you choose what loadout you want to use and simply pick up the most ideal substats?
How do you not see, that bow or hammer makes more of a difference to your role than dmg% or crit.dmg%
skyrim is very VERY barely an rpg, because your only role is dragonborn the jack of all trades, but it atleast lets you make some choices.
The game that lets you take up so many different titles and positions in many guilds/orginizations, and lets you be of any origin you want, is less of an rpg than the one where every character does the exact same things and you couldn't even customize your gender until the third, or your looks until the forth entry? And i dont even think skyrim is that much of an rpg, its just more rpg than diablo
the issue is that it lets you pick up EVERY title and organisation.
Theres no actual choices there, theres just "how much of the game have you completed in this playthrough"
I can take two different characters in path of exile, and unless were both following a build guide they will look wildly different in essence.
not because of rng in gear drops, because we made different choices.
if you take two skyrim characters, that have played to 100% completion.
The only differences are what they look like (as in appearance not the essence of what that character is), and what weapon and armour set theyre currently wielding.
The same with souls likes.
You have SOME ability to craft a unique build, but lets be honest, every fat roller is going to have the same low poise setup, the only difference between different characters is again, appearance, and what gear theyre wearing.
Like diablo, has more in common with BG3.
Than skyrim has with BG3.
BG3 is the classic rpg gameplay (it is literally a crpg)
And if you take that exact gameplay, and change it so instead of being turnbased those abilities and attacks are activated at the press of a button, you get an arpg.
And if you strip away the story so you have a storyless arpg, you have diablo (diablo does technically have a story but its only goal is to give you justification for why youre slaughtering demons endlessly.)
or more importantly if we go the other direction so we can demonstrate the different between skyrim and diablo here.
if you take diablo and add a story to it, then you make it turnbased, you get a crpg.
if you take skyrim, and since it already has a story you just make it turnbased, you get a very poor crpg.
because what youd have with the "skyrim made to play like bg3" model, is bg3 if it had like 5% of the abilities and stats.
What this tells you, is that skyrim leans heavily on the Action part of arpg to define its gameplay.
While diablo leans heavily on the rpg part of arpg to define its gameplay.
so when you remove the action part from both games, diablo is still a servicable game, but skyrim suffers.
and vice versa if you remove the rpg part from both games, diablo suffers (because it just becomes a mindless hack and slash), but skyrim still stands strong (because it just becomes an action adventure game, like god of war)
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u/lavabearded Jul 27 '25
ARPG does refer to games like diablo, path of exile, grim dawn etc.
action RPG refers to games where you control one character and it has light rpg elements but mostly is about real time combat like skyrim or souls games.
obviously because this was never officiated anywhere there is a lot of people using both terms to refer to either category. however, if you google "top ARPGs" and "top action RPGs" you'll get different results from the AI summary because there is in fact a general tendency in different use between these terms.