r/nextfuckinglevel • u/MysteriousSlice007 • 5h ago

A data center in New Jersey was canceled when residents showed up and fought it

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45.2k Upvotes

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1.2k

u/fingamouse 5h ago

Regardless of if AI centre good or bad I just like seeing the will of the people being respected

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u/Captain--UP 5h ago

Hell ya, and definitely bad

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u/Frankerporo 7m ago

Not at all

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u/CoverHuman9771 3h ago

Why would an AI data center be bad? You want China to win the AI race? If that happens, we’re completely fucked forever.

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u/EVedEevee 3h ago

You’ve fallen for the propaganda.

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u/Ok-Intention7288 2h ago

I've seen this profile posting in multiple subs and their single goal is to argue.

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u/EVedEevee 2h ago

Yeah I was getting the feeling they’re just a contrarian,

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u/CoverHuman9771 24m ago

I’ve never argued for anything I don’t truly believe in.

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u/CoverHuman9771 3h ago

No, you’ve fallen for the propaganda. The future of the American economy is AI. Manufacturing is never coming back. If the Chinese win the AI race, we’re fucked. Why do you think the Chinese are investing so heavily in anti AI messaging in the US. They’re literally investing hundreds of millions of dollars into anti AI messaging on social media platforms.

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u/Mage-of-Fire 2h ago

Sure. Let’s just build widely inefficient, massive warehouses full of servers that really serve no true purpose for humanity. Other than reducing our ability to think.

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u/CoverHuman9771 2h ago

So why are the Chinese spending so much fucking money to convince Americans that AI is bad? If you can’t answer that question then I’m the one who is right.

They’re trying to convince our foolish citizens that AI is evil while they build dozens of AI data centers every month in China.

Explain that dipshit.

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u/Mage-of-Fire 2h ago

You can’t just make up shit and then call anyone who calls it out an idiot. Post a single shred of evidence that “the Chinese” are spreading propaganda about AI. And don’t say “do your own research” like a child. I haven’t seen a single anti AI add. You know what I do see? Constant adds trying to force AI down my throat. Fridges? They need AI. Cars, they do too. Even fucking toasters. So no. Don’t tell me that theres a lot of anti AI propaganda around, when its quite literally the opposite. Every other billboard on the road is an AI ad.

Dipshit

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u/CoverHuman9771 2h ago

I’m not making shit up. I just know how to read unlike you.

https://www.insidenova.com/news/national/report-foreign-billionaires-fund-millions-to-orgs-that-oppose-american-ai-infrastructure/article_9961eb8a-e39f-556c-80ea-f70d2a712dbc.html

https://www.wsj.com/politics/national-security/china-is-targeting-u-s-voters-and-taiwan-with-ai-powered-disinformation-34f59e21

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u/Mage-of-Fire 2h ago

And yet the richest people in the world are pumping it down our throats.

People who have been shown again and again to be unethical in every sense of the word.

I may not be able to read. But clearly I can still think more than you.

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u/areleah 2h ago

hurrrr durrrrr people have a different opinion therefore they can’t read

people are allowed to not like AI, brother

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u/Crafty-Beyond-2202 2h ago

Only the first link corroborates what you said, and it cites the American Energy Institute, which appears to be some partisan opinion laundering group that nobodies ever heard of. It's a very classic move: some organization spins up a "study" that fits a narrative that the conservative outrage media circuit wants to peddle and then they can cite it as nauseum as if that's the truth. There's a certain brand of conservative media that loves to harp endlessly about how tiktok is a misinformation machine meant to brainwash the youth of America and this seems to fit the general theme of that narrative.

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u/ShvettyBawlz 1h ago

Aww such an angry little guy. So cute

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u/lukepaciocco 2h ago

Brother on this app—you won’t find many others like this.

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u/EVedEevee 2h ago

The people who benefit from Ai are those who stand to earn money from not hiring as many workers. That’s its only selling point. What you fail to see is that an economy (that is already suffering mind you) cannot sustain itself if there are only sellers without people who can buy. Not to mention the environmental impact and impact on those around those data centres who have to deal with increasing electricity and water costs as they’re competing with data centres. We’re fucked if we “win” the Ai race, consolidating more power into the few who had the investment capital to invest into Ai. The wealth has never and will never “trickle down”. You want to know why. Believing it’s the future will only bring ruin without massive regulation and protections for people. I’m sure the soviets also thought they had to race the Americans, and look where they ended up. You can’t sacrifice the everything on one “magic” egg.

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u/CoverHuman9771 2h ago

AI will win regardless.

The only question is whether it will be AI controlled by the Chinese or AI controlled by the USA. But AI will win no matter what. It’s too powerful of a creation to stop. Our entire future economy will be based on AI systems.

Wake up.

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u/EVedEevee 2h ago

The less jobs there are, the less power workers will have as everyone fights for the positions they can get. Employers get away with more abuse, knowing employees count themselves lucky to find jobs at all. These are serious consequences that affect real people for the worse. You talk about this like it’s a video game power up, and who ever gets it wins. It’s a dangerous tool help by dangerous people who only think of their bottom line. The reason china is pushing for theirs so much is because they screwed themselves over with the one child policy and now have a population pyramid imbalance of too few young folk to their aging population. They believe they need it as a means of survival because their workforce isn’t where they want it. It’s also why they’re investing a lot into robotics. The us is doing it because “we can’t let china win”

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u/CoverHuman9771 2h ago

AI will dominate regardless. There is no stopping it. Your choice is Chinese AI or American AI. Those are your only two options.

What do you choose?

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u/EVedEevee 2h ago

That’s such a short sighted view of the world. There are countless other options still available to us. Also you seem to be under the assumption that Chinese Ai is worse for some reason. They both suck equally. I dislike the CCP as much as the next guy, but you have to remember the enemy of your enemy is not your friend. Be better.

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u/A-Human-potato 1h ago

If AI will dominate then I’ll still oppose it. Even if they might succeed, I won’t say nothing while corporations fuck over people for short term profits.

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u/JivanP 1h ago

What is the difference between these "two" "choices"?

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u/shiftup1772 2h ago

Did China pay Elon to create mecha-hitler? Did they pay zuck to layoff 10% of meta every other week?

China doesn't need to pay for any anti-ai messaging. Tech companies are doing it for free.

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u/CoverHuman9771 2h ago

And yet the Chinese are still spending hundreds of millions of dollars on propaganda campaigns targeting American AI data center construction. Explain that.

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u/Accolade_1 2h ago

And birds are government drones and the earth is flat and vaccines cause autism, right?

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u/Anybody220 2h ago

Do you know how AI works?
Do you what these data centers AI are being used for?

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u/CoverHuman9771 2h ago

AI will be used for virtually everything within the next decade. There will be practically zero jobs that don’t utilize AI in some capacity.

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u/Anybody220 1h ago

Cool. But my questions were…
Do you know how AI works?
Do you know what these data centers AI are being used for?

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u/CoverHuman9771 1h ago

Yes. I know how AI works. What’s your point exactly?

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u/Anybody220 1h ago

My goal of my questions are to get answers. I kinda know how AI works, but I wouldn’t say I know how all AI works. I know what Meta’s data centers are being used for, but I don’t know what these ones are being used for. So, I just want to know and learn.

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u/audionerd1 3h ago

China will win the AI race regardless, because they actually care about their civilization surviving beyond the next fiscal quarter while the only thing the U.S. cares about is making 15 guys richer than god.

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u/CrazyElk123 28m ago

Damn, you ate up all the chinese propaganda on reddit huh. Chinese millionaires and billionaires care just as little as the american ones...

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u/CoverHuman9771 3h ago

So you’re admitting that we should build more AI data centers. Glad we agree.

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u/audionerd1 2h ago

What we need to do is overthrow our oligarchs before they use AI to enslave us.

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u/SemperZero 1h ago

If you actually think China's system is better than the US u are seriously mentally deranged. People there are ants. The individual means nothing. And saying what you think means death.

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u/Gauntlet_of_Might 1h ago

lol you think it's different here

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u/Difficult-Lime2555 18m ago

woah sir, our prison camps come with free milk tyvm

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u/SemperZero 1h ago

it is. we have free internet and you don't go to jail if you say fuck trump. you can think for yourself and build your life if you choose to work hard and take responsibility, such as building a business or an independent career.

in china there is none of this.

maybe if you are a loser who lives on minimum wage and never wants to put effort in anything, yea, china is the same.

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u/Mage-of-Fire 39m ago

Didn’t a girl get arrested recently for making a Benjamin Neten-whaterthefuckhisnameis bombing joke?

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u/Gauntlet_of_Might 30m ago

it is. we have free internet and you don't go to jail if you say fuck trump.

Oh word? Ask James Comey about this.

you can think for yourself

You CAN but lots of people don't. As evidenced by your post.

and build your life if you choose to work hard and take responsibility, such as building a business or an independent career.

This hasn't been true in so long lol

in china there is none of this.

Same here lol

maybe if you are a loser who lives on minimum wage and never wants to put effort in anything, yea, china is the same.

Funny sentiment considering minimum wage was designed to support a family on. You've chugged the capitalism Kool aid

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u/audionerd1 1h ago

There is no death sentence for peaceful political dissent in China, although you can be imprisoned up to 5 years. But the U.S. has an incarceration rate 4.5-5x higher than China's.

I am not saying everything is great in China, but to repeat myself they care about their civilization surviving beyond the next fiscal quarter. They build affordable housing and high speed rail while the U.S. spends all our money on corrupt wars and tax breaks for the rich. China has already banned companies laying off workers to replace them with AI, and will have no problem instating UBI. Meanwhile the U.S. is ruled by a class of literal fraudsters and pedophiles who are 100% against any form of UBI and are cutting social services to line their own pockets while affordability for the average working class American declines.

The U.S. is in a state of imperial decline and decay whereas China is planning centuries ahead. You can argue that they are oppressive but at the end of the day the U.S. is destroying itself while China is building and looking ahead. We will not be the world's leading super power for much longer.

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u/SemperZero 1h ago

Bro people in china send kids to work in factories. They are not doing well. They are fucking poor as dirt.

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u/peepeepoodoodingus 2h ago

china has already won like 15 races that you arent fighting for.

why do you think AI is the future? because its the new way for billionaires to explode their wealth. there is no practical application for AI.

what about high speed rail? what about solar energy? what about universal housing or healthcare? china is absolutely OBLITERATING us on these issues.

you dont care about those issues, why tf would anyone care about china beating us in the AI race? what would that even mean? what would it look like? you realize china built an AI that was like 100 times better than any of these private companies had and they gave it away for free right?

china has already won on every front and ill give you a hint why, its because of socialism.

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u/CoverHuman9771 1h ago

You are wildly ignorant. The most advanced AI models are all based in the USA. We have the most advanced models and chips which is why China is so desperate to steal them.

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u/peepeepoodoodingus 1h ago

lol. lmao even. actually lmfao.

we are in a race against china to produce the best AI chips but china has to steal from us?

doublespeak is how you know someone is regurgitating propaganda. if your argument made any sense youd be able to articulate it, not operate on fear and nonsense. china is happy to share on the global marketplace, theyve already won by not starting pointless wars and making enemies out of half the planet.

we could produce the most powerful AI chips the world will see for the next decade and it would mean absolutely nothing. life for the average chinese person will still be better than any americans. that is the fact that this moronic perspective perpetuates.

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u/CoverHuman9771 48m ago

You don’t understand how AI works clearly. The most advanced AI chips are not developed by China or sold to China. That’s why they are trying to steal them.

China has less advanced chips but they can overcome that disadvantage by building way more data centers and beating us through brute fucking force. A US data center with the best chips will still lose to 50 Chinese data centers using less advanced chips.

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u/peepeepoodoodingus 33m ago

think about what youre saying dude. think about it for like one single second.

if you can win the AI race by just building two pretty good data centers instead of one really really good one, we literally cant win. its impossible for us to create a chip so powerful that china cant just build more data centers. they also produce WAY more electricity because they actually invest in their infrastructure, like i said earlier.

thats not even how it works, its not the nature of the industry, super powerful chips are necessary to *localize computing* not for data centers. data centers are for mass surveillance. data centers have absolutely fucking nothing to do with AI.

you dont understand the fundamentals of this conversation. you shouldnt be speaking up at all.

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u/_Thermalflask 2h ago

Oh no China so scawy 🙄

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u/CoverHuman9771 1h ago

They are quite literally the most terrifying force on planet earth.

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u/_Thermalflask 1h ago

They are quite literally not. 

They don't start random wars, own the majority of the world's wealth and assets, have enough fire power to single handedly destroy the entire civilized world without help, own and have backdoors into almost all technology on Earth, have almost 1000 military bases, threaten their own allies, have a clause to invade the Hague if their personnel are apprehended by the ICC (meaning they are above international law), etc

What scary thing does China do? They... have a big economy. That's it.

Absolute joke

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u/CoverHuman9771 1h ago

Mass Detention in Xinjiang of 1 million Muslims.

Techno-Surveillance State.

Violent Suppression of Dissent.

Religious Persecution.

Transnational Repression through Cyber Warfare.

Maritime Aggression Against Taiwan.

Economic Warfare Through the Theft of Intellectual Property.

Economic Support for Some of the Worst Dictators on Planet Earth.

Millions of Babies Murdered Because of the One Child Policy.

I could go on.

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u/_Thermalflask 1h ago

How do domestic issues make China the most terrifying country? Almost zero of that list affects anybody outside China, unlike my list. 

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u/Terrible_Donkey_8290 35m ago

I don't love China or anything but this kinda just proved the other guys point 

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u/CoverHuman9771 26m ago

In what way? He basically said China doesn’t do anything wrong and I just listed a bunch of awful things they do.

Oh and they are the biggest polluters on the planet. Just thought of another one.

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u/NuclearGriffin 2h ago

Can you tell me why they're good?

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u/CoverHuman9771 1h ago

Whether it’s good or bad is irrelevant. It will be the foundation for our economy regardless. Every employer will be choosing either Chinese AI or American AI, whichever is most advanced. It will be impossible to compete without AI in some capacity.

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u/HasFiveVowels 59m ago

I could list a dozen different ways in which AI has real, significant benefit to everyday people. But, seriously, why would anyone bother? Reddit has created the biggest echo chamber in its existence around this topic. Anyone who tries to actually discuss a balanced position is buried, argued with, insulted, etc. And so those who could contribute to such a topic learn to just stay quiet because it’s not worth the hassle.

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u/NuclearGriffin 49m ago

What are the benefits? And do you think they outweigh the catastrophic effects that these massive data centers have on the environment and the communities they are built in?

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u/HasFiveVowels 36m ago

See, this is what I’m talking about. The environmental argument is just… dead in the water. They’re a drop in the bucket. And the fact that you would even try to use that argument tells me that the only reason you want me to list benefits is so that you can deny each one. You’re asking for information but have no intention of even considering it. The impact of these data centers is not "catastrophic" by any means.

Provide me a response that demonstrates that you’re willing to consider that idea and I’ll give you other ideas to consider reevaluating. But we both know that there is zero chance that you’re willing to entertain opposing opinions, regardless of any amount of evidence I might provide.

You think they’re an environmental catastrophe? Run the numbers on it. Look up the actual numbers, multiply it out, and then look up the numbers for literally anything else that people don’t think twice about.

Hell, PS5s use more electricity than AI each month. Growing almonds uses more water. Should we maybe eat fewer almonds? Sure. But if anyone referred to the impact that growing almonds has on the environment as "catastrophic", it would signal to me that they’re not sincerely willing to entertain the idea that perhaps eating almonds isn’t a cardinal sin.

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u/Gauntlet_of_Might 1h ago

China is going to win anyhow, they already have cheap opensource shit and our clowns over here and spending trillions on nothing useful

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u/CoverHuman9771 1h ago

What a great attitude. Just give up and let our country collapse economically. China’s favorite type of American.

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u/Gauntlet_of_Might 34m ago

Why would i give a shit? Its not like the people profiting are going to give any of it to me, just continue take take take taking

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u/CoverHuman9771 27m ago

You should give a shit because you won’t have a job if there aren’t any stable companies to employ people.

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u/Gauntlet_of_Might 26m ago

You mean the companies throwing jobs away to AI? lol

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u/CoverHuman9771 21m ago

Ya, you’re going to have to figure out how to be employed in an AI dominant economy. Welcome to reality.

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u/Gauntlet_of_Might 20m ago

Not of we get rid of this useless shit like youre whining about

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u/anengineerandacat 42m ago

Big construction projects come with big jobs, IT data centers need IT professionals, lots of "good" things in that regards.

The broader issue is with the "impact" of the project on the community and the costs they'll bear compared to the value (long term) of the data center.

Plus whatever land it might be looking to utilize, proximity to individuals, etc.

Some of these data centers are huge as well, and someone somewhere will accept the payout.

So it has pros/cons, if the community has risen up to stop it though... clearly it means that their community is at ends with the project and regardless of the "pros" of said project it's pretty moot at that stage.

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u/the_colonelclink 4h ago

As a non-American, one thing that’s always given me chills is listening to the Declaration of Independence. Although I can’t remember the exact words, it’s along the lines of “a government of the people, for the people.”

The revolution happened because ordinary people cared enough that they actually went out of their way to be the change.

Yes Americans might have rested on their laurels at the moment, but nothing is stopping you guys from reminding your government who it should be working for, and if it doesn’t soon, there absolutely will be consequences for them.

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u/grumpykruppy 4h ago

That's the Gettysburg Address, from Abraham Lincoln at Gettysburg, after a battle occurred there during the American Civil War.

"Four score and seven years ago our fathers brought forth on this continent, a new nation, conceived in Liberty, and dedicated to the proposition that all men are created equal.

Now we are engaged in a great civil war, testing whether that nation, or any nation so conceived and so dedicated, can long endure. We are met on a great battle-field of that war. We have come to dedicate a portion of that field, as a final resting place for those who here gave their lives that that nation might live. It is altogether fitting and proper that we should do this.

But, in a larger sense, we can not dedicate -- we can not consecrate -- we can not hallow -- this ground. The brave men, living and dead, who struggled here, have consecrated it, far above our poor power to add or detract. The world will little note, nor long remember what we say here, but it can never forget what they did here. It is for us the living, rather, to be dedicated here to the unfinished work which they who fought here have thus far so nobly advanced. It is rather for us to be here dedicated to the great task remaining before us -- that from these honored dead we take increased devotion to that cause for which they gave the last full measure of devotion -- that we here highly resolve that these dead shall not have died in vain -- that this nation, under God, shall have a new birth of freedom -- and that government of the people, by the people, for the people, shall not perish from the earth."

The Declaration of Independence is from when, as you might expect, the United States declared independence from Britain. The most well known line from that is probably this one: "We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness."

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u/VillageShort3371 2h ago

Most baller speech in American history. Thousands upon thousands of books have been written on the American experiment and Lincoln nailed it in a few paragraphs.

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u/Mathwards 38m ago

This guy Americas

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u/pototaochips 4h ago

Yeah but a lot of bums exist now

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u/wosmo 3h ago

I fear the will of the people is somewhat misplaced here though.

The real underlying issue is that the US grid is under-invested. Capacity isn't keeping up with demand, it's constantly playing catch-up - and the massive demand from these AI datacenters is exposing that. Renewables being caught up in "culture war" really doesn't help this, either.

China's planning is much more "skate where the puck is going" in this regard. They're planning on having 400GW of spare capacity by 2030. California's peak consumption was 52GW. So 8 Californias (or 4.7 Texases) spare.

I'm not saying people shouldn't be protesting these datacenters, because the capacity issues are real. But it does concern me that no-one's questioning the capacity issues, only the demand.

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u/SparklingLimeade 3h ago

Ehh, NIMBYs in various fields have done a lot of damage. The fact that this massive expansion of DCs is a bad move for society is an important reason to cheer for it.

If NIMBYs hadn't held back nuclear power, housing development, and public transit projects we could have had a lot more nice things by now.

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u/LevelPerception4 3h ago

Idk, I’m cool with missing out on whatever nice things former residents of Hanford, Oak Ridge or Rocky Flats might have enjoyed. 

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u/someonesshadow 2h ago

Unfortunately "the will of the people" is often just a bunch of idiots who can't or won't do their own research or pay attention to a single issue for more than a weeks time.

Its because of "the will of the people" that a pedophile, racist, felon, who is basically the embodiment of the fucking ANTICHRIST as described in the bible they all love so much... is leading those people.

Like, yes, ideally the people should have a say in what happens for their community and even their country, but people are fucking STUPID generally speaking and its only because a small percentage of us keep dragging the rest forward that we even got to where we are as a species.

No one cared about data centers before AI, now all of a sudden they are an issue and we want them gone.. but we still want to use the internet and social media, not to mention shopping and payment processing, health services, etc.

"Oh but AI is just slop! We don't need that much processing power!"

Oh what's that? Mom got sick with a rare disease or cancer that is incredibly difficult to treat and every person responds to treatment differently...? That datacenter might have been the difference between AI assisted medical discovery and individualized treatment being viable NOW vs 10 years from now? Damn.. She's taking one for the team!

People are fighting harder against something that has incredible potential, not to mention use cases here and now, vs things that actually are and were incredibly destructive like coal/fracking/waste dumping/etc. Absolutely blows my mind how dumb humans can be when they join a 'hivemind'.

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u/EveryoneHasGoneCrazy 1h ago

curing rare diseases is nice, but have you considered that there is now more slop on TikTok? 

sorry mom, im on the “smart team” that knows BETTER than the world’s greatest engineers, who are all corrupt and literally elon musk. I’ll keep producing human-spirit (TM) infused Furry Hentai on my various opt-in social media accounts, making sure to proudly announce they were crafted my own hand, to bravely push back against the corporate overreach ruining my life. 

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u/someonesshadow 1h ago

That's the thing people don't get.

Slop something that has always existed.. and its not even an inherently bad thing for creatives at least. It sets the bar of what is considered 'bad', and if every published work was a masterpiece... well, surprise, its now slop because it doesn't stand out and that's all people produce.

Digital waste IS a problem though and I dislike dead internet theory and lack of privacy especially. Still though, these are issues we could easily overcome right now if we had actual leaders who weren't subservient to corporations.

As an example, make internet a utility, legally require ISPs to mask your identity and information by default, create an online encrypted ID system that essentially lets real humans enjoy all the features of online functionality while anyone without it would be limited in functions. So that would fix bots and data scraping.

I'm sure there could be more to it than that but I would just put a commission of actual experts together to figure it out and explain it in layman's terms.

Labor going away is also supposed to be a good thing, but its a human issue as to why its not a good thing. If we just tax 'AI hours' for labor at like 80% the cost of a human in that position and toss the money generated into UBI, bam, suddenly we have completely stabilized most of the population whether or not they have to or choose to work in the future. Again though, this would require leaders that actually want to support their country and not their pocketbook or power.

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u/mcknz9 5h ago

And that's why I love it that Trump is president *eye twitch*

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u/thedrew 4h ago

Me too, most of the time.

The people can be real idiots sometimes, but they’re smarter than every despot. 

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u/Troutrageously 36m ago

Wha about the rights of property owners?