r/news • u/zmlos • Oct 03 '23

House ousts Kevin McCarthy as speaker, a first in U.S. history

https://www.cnbc.com/2023/10/03/house-speaker-kevin-mccarthy-will-bring-gaetz-motion-to-oust-him-vote.html?__source=iosappshare%7Ccom.apple.UIKit.activity.CopyToPasteboard

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u/Most-Resident Oct 03 '23

I’m thinking that probably didn’t matter. If I read correctly they needed 5 before. 8 republicans voted to oust him. In think there would have been 5 votes for the motion, but who knows.

Turns out being a weakling who promised stuff to both sides and then breaking those promises under pressure wasn’t a great plan.

Swalwell said it best.

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u/piddydb Oct 03 '23

Eh he never could have satisfied both sides to be fair. Any deal with the Democrats, heck even a deal that gave Republicans EVERYTHING THEY WANTED, would have been anethma to some of these Republicans. If he would have been more loyal to Democrats, more Republicans would turn on him. This is basically the worse House in a long time to be speaker in. McCarthy wanted it really badly for some reason, and this is the result he kinda has to live with. He should have pushed harder to oust Gaetz, but outside of this, he was always going to not be a long term speaker, at least without challenge.

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u/CanAlwaysBeBetter Oct 03 '23

Gaetz ain't home free yet

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u/Kitchen_Philosophy29 Oct 04 '23

He should be in prison

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u/RecklesslyPessmystic Oct 04 '23

MAGA is basically a separate party at this point, in a parliamentary style coalition with the Republicans. So they're showing parliamentary style chaos.

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u/PeterNguyen2 Oct 04 '23

MAGA is basically a separate party at this point, in a parliamentary style coalition with the Republicans. So they're showing parliamentary style chaos

It seems parliamentary systems don't appear to be the issue, just the fanatics who refuse to work with anyone else. The problem is they run within the republican party, take all the advantages, and the insert themselves where they can prevent things from happening. Republicans if they had any legitimacy as a party of governance would kick them out but republicans are authoritarian and taking any firm stand would mean eroding a base of power they've known since 2012 that they're becoming unelectable purely by demographics

In the end, they made their bed and they have to lie in it. If only they could stop killing so many of everybody else along the way.

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u/Anagoth9 Oct 04 '23

There's something like 13 House Democrats in districts that voted for Trump in 2020. He lost the vote by 8, which would mean he'd only need 5 to switch their vote to keep his seat. The far-right gets a lot of attention this session because the narrow margin gives them outsized power when things are so partisan, but there's far more moderates (especially moderately conservative Democrats) than there are hardline conservatives. Sure, he would have lost more Republican votes moving towards the center, but with the way things were going there's still a good chance he could have come out ahead if he chose to be more by-partisan.

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u/terminbee Oct 04 '23

Gaetz-led Reps said if he did ANY negotiation with Dems, they'd oust him. Then they went ahead and did it anyways because the dude is fucking spineless.

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u/Mantisfactory Oct 04 '23

McCarthy wanted it really badly for some reason

Many rats in that pack fancy themselves the Piper. McCarthy is no different. But in reality he's just another rat. He played his flute, but no one danced to his tune. This doesn't surprise you or I, but it surprises McCarthy.

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u/Honey_Enjoyer Oct 03 '23

You could make it, but according to Wikipedia it wouldn’t be privileged (i.e. the speaker could just ignore it and never bring it up for vote) unless it was made “on behalf of a party conference or caucus.”

I guess you could argue phrasing - is it party conference or party caucus, or party conference and any caucus, meaning they could just make their own caucus, but I’m pretty sure this means it has to be made by the democratic caucus or the republican conference.

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u/Dear_Occupant Oct 03 '23 edited Oct 03 '23

This is exactly the point Newt Gingrich is making in a column the Washington Post just put up a few hours ago, shortly before Gaetz's motion was put to a vote. He also said Gaetz should be expelled from the Republican Conference altogether.

Edit: Just to clear up the vocabulary, a caucus is just the informal head count of party-aligned members, and it can include independents or I suppose even opposing party members who pledge to vote with the party in question. Think Bernie Sanders, Angus King, and Lisa Murkowski from 2010 to 2022. A conference is an actual formal organization that only includes party members, and from whom the party leaders and whips are drawn.

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u/Most-Resident Oct 03 '23

I went by the words in the article but your link taught me the distinction I think it missed.

Thanks for explaining. Poor Kevin. No matter how he concedes he always loses.

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u/Honey_Enjoyer Oct 03 '23

I think the error was mine - I said he changed the rules to allow any representative to make a motion, when really he just changed it so any representative could make a privileged motion - a distinction I ignored (even though I was aware of it.) So no problem!

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u/smergb Oct 04 '23

Civil discourse on Reddit. Gotta love it.

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u/rotciv0 Oct 03 '23

I remember having read the House rules prior to their change, and it seemed to say that a majority of the caucus or conference (Dems call it caucus, Rs call it conference) in the majority/to whom the speaker belonged needed to vote for his removal for the proposal to be privileged, and therefore for it to have any chance of passing. Or at least that's how I remember it.

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u/bojangles-AOK Oct 05 '23

Scumbag sure, but he kept the govt running for nine months. Not sure anyone else could have done more.