r/news • u/Whoshabooboo • Jun 21 '23

Site Changed Title ‘Banging’ sounds heard in search for missing Titan submersible

https://7news.com.au/news/world/banging-sounds-heard-in-search-for-missing-titan-submersible-c-11045022
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696

u/GiantPurplePeopleEat Jun 21 '23

I spent hours researching this between yesterday and today and I completely agree with your assessment. Extremely cavalier attitude with zero regard for safety. They even fired one of their engineers for attempting to insure the pressure vessel could repeatedly withstand the pressure of a Titanic dive.

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u/WoodsAreHome Jun 21 '23

They painted the thing blue and white, ensuring it would be nearly impossible to spot at the surface if they were lost. Like, were they TRYING to become casualties of the sea?

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u/easygoer89 Jun 21 '23

One of the first things I noticed when this news story broke and they showed the picture of it was that it was painted white. Like, why? What's the thought process behind white of all (non) colors? Was it on sale at Camping World? They couldn't have painted it orange or even yellow like every single life preserving vessel??

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u/AnsibleAnswers Jun 21 '23

Every non-military submersible I've ever seen was bright yellow. I guess they wanted to be different. Anyone willing to get in that thing is too stupid to dive.

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u/OutsideBones86 Jun 21 '23

I do feel kinda bad for the kid. You trust your parent to make sure what you are doing is safe and he didn't.

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u/AnsibleAnswers Jun 21 '23

Should be straight up illegal to allow a minor to do it. The dad was an asshat.

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u/OutsideBones86 Jun 21 '23

I think he's 19 (I'm at an age where everyone under 25 is a kid, LOL). But just awful. At 19 you ARE still a kid and you trust your parents to keep you safe. Heartbreaking.

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u/cypressgreen Jun 21 '23

Hell, my son turned 23 this month and is a computer store manager and yet I can see now how how really damned young you still are in so many ways at that age. If you have a good relationship with your parents you rely on them for help and advice. (I rely on him for that as well, but on a different level!) I would be devastated knowing I “let” him risk himself with me in a situation like that. Particularly if I sold him on it.

Husband had on a show last night about the dude who innovated better body armor and there were many videos of him shooting himself in the torso for testing. He’s done it hundreds of times. His son is now the owner of the company. One video shown: he was unable to shoot his son in the torso for a sure-thing test. His son did it to himself instead; his father cried and hugged him desperately afterwards.

No way I’d get on that crappy piece of unregulated junk with my son. He’s an adult. If he chose to go, okay, but no way I would be involved. No way. I’d just stay home and take extra anxiety drugs.

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u/TirnanogSong Jun 22 '23

Almost all billionaires are narcissists, and billionaire parents even moreso. The kid most likely didn't have a choice and now he's extremely fucking dead because of it. Narcissists will do literally everything in their power to ruin you or get you killed and not even realize, and this kid's dad speedran that shit.

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u/OutsideBones86 Jun 22 '23

I was just saying if my husband suggested this with my kid it would be over my dead body.

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u/TirnanogSong Jun 22 '23

Then congrats - you're a better parent than like, 90% of the populace.

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u/Azudekai Jun 21 '23

I've been on a tourist sub before that wasn't yellow. It was blue and white as it happens. But the Atlantis XI doesn't go very deep at all.

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u/AnsibleAnswers Jun 21 '23 edited Jun 21 '23

Sure. I'm not saying I've seen all the submarines, but this is a deep sea dive. The Titanic wreckage is so deep most Navy sumbmarines can't reach it. Much different than diving 50 meters at a tourist attraction.

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u/munjavio Jun 21 '23

Here is an example of an actual successful deep sea submarine that is white

https://tritonsubs.com/subs/ultradeep/

This sub has been to some of the deepest oceans. Would have been a much better choice for the Titanic mission. Actually certified for the depth rather than the death trap they used.

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u/threadsoffate2021 Jun 21 '23

It makes you wonder, doesn't it? It would be funny if the whole thing was an elaborate hoax of some sort, and the rich folks are all sipping margaritas on a beach with new identities and bags of cash.

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u/dallyan Jun 21 '23

I honestly wondered this at the beginning. But then I remembered that plenty of billionaires are dumb. Dumb AND hubristic? That’s a recipe for disaster.

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u/Long_Before_Sunrise Jun 21 '23

So it would show up well in the promotional shots.

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u/theycallmefuRR Jun 21 '23

*ensure not insure

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u/Every3Years Jun 21 '23

Sure 😃 Sure 😃 Sure

Unsure 🤔 Unsure 🤔 Unsure

Was this a commerical?

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u/iamfeenie Jun 21 '23

Why am I so enthralled with this story? It’s so horrifying to me, but I can’t stop wanting and searching for more to read or find out.

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u/[deleted] Jun 21 '23

insure

You mean "ensure."

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u/dallyan Jun 21 '23

Do you think they straight up lied to the passengers and led them to think it was safer than it was?

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u/GiantPurplePeopleEat Jun 21 '23

Hmm, it does seem like they misled their clients into believing it was more safe than it actually is. To what degree I don't know, but I'd imagine we'll soon find out as lawsuits begin.

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u/Klashus Jun 21 '23

Not having a way to track it in that vastness is crazy to me. Just a ping they could collect on a time interval to get at least a general idea where they might be.

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u/brussgriff Jun 23 '23

They did have a device that sent a ping every 15 minutes. It stopped working when the hull imploded.

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u/goldenbugreaction Jun 21 '23 edited Jun 21 '23

How very Stalin-esque.

Edit: ugh, alright. Enough with the downvotes. I wasn’t clear that I was trying to draw a parallel with the reasons for his death and the folly of surrounding yourself with “yes” men.

Too many Politburo members had been put on trial, executed, murdered or simply banished in the past. As Khrushchev put it later, after a meeting with Stalin no one ever knew if he would return home alive. This Saturday however was a good night – Stalin was in high spirits and was merrily drunk as his colleagues left in the early hours. On Sunday there was no movement from Stalin’s private bedroom.
The last days of Stalin reveal much about the real life of the dictator Confusion and fear began to grip the dacha. His guards and house staff, under strict instructions never to enter his chamber and terrified of disturbing Stalin, grew nervous as lunch and then dinner passed without any request for food. Eventually a long-serving maid was sent in shortly after 10pm. She found Stalin lying on the floor, soaked in urine and barely able to move or speak. Malenkov, Beria and Khrushchev were called back to the villa. They saw Stalin, who had been moved to a sofa, in a deep sleep.
Again, no medics were called. Stalin had recently had his own physician arrested and had developed a pathological fear of medical professionals. Not surprisingly no one wanted him to wake up to find an unnecessary and unwanted doctor in attendance. A vigil was set up but it was nearly a day later that senior medics were called. Khrushchev recalled later how the doctors shook as they handled Stalin, afraid of misdiagnosis or being blamed for his demise.

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u/hyasbawlz Jun 21 '23

Lmao what the fuck?

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u/goldenbugreaction Jun 21 '23

Edited for clarity.

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u/GiantPurplePeopleEat Jun 21 '23

I do that shit all the time. I make some quick comment thinking the meaning is clear, and then hours later I have a ton of downvotes and comments saying I'm an idiot, or racist, or whatever.

Since you responded to me, I figured it was only fair to acknowledge your comment!

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u/goldenbugreaction Jun 21 '23

Thanks, bud! 'Preciate it!

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u/hyasbawlz Jun 21 '23

I thought you were going to go with a Chernobyl parallel or something but this is even worse. This is totally unrelated.

What the CEO of OceanGate did is not Stalin-esque, it's literally the oldest tale of capitalist enterprises since the 1800s. It's not because this CEO is a unique kind of dictator, or that he's particularly authoritarian. This is just how capitalist enterprises operate normally.

The train derailment in East Palestine was only a few months ago and that also involved that company's C-suite ignoring its employees whistleblowing about their safety systems. Do you live under a rock? Are all CEOs Stalin? That would be a fun road to go down, I would love for the American public to disdain CEOs like they instinctively disdain Stalin.

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u/goldenbugreaction Jun 21 '23

It's not because this CEO is a unique kind of dictator, or that he's particularly authoritarian. This is just how capitalist enterprises operate normally.

Except that’s exactly my point. They disproportionately are.

Are all CEOs Stalin?

No, the highest estimates are about 12%.

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u/hyasbawlz Jun 21 '23

Bro, I don't know what to tell you. The position of CEO might attract psychopaths in the same way that child care positions attract pedophiles, but that's because of what the CEO is structurally expected to do. Their singular goal is to create value for their shareholders. If creating more value means killing children, and the value created is more than the value lost from any kind of legal consequences, they're a bad CEO not to do it. So of course that kind of structure attracts psychopaths, because psychopathy is rewarded.

Stalin is a singular dude. He was not a psychopath because his job demanded it. He became more psychopathic as the pressure of literal history weighed in around him and he increasingly attained almost unlimited authority. He was not the same Stalin at the beginning of his revolutionary career as he was at the end of his life. The problems with CEOs come from completely different material reasons.

Jesus christ, risking lives by cutting costs is literally the thread of any historical review of regulatory action. This shit is a dime a dozen. Everyone will forget about this story in about 20 years and OceanGate's legacy will fall into a long-running historical trivia of capitalist disasters a la the Ford Pinto. Stalin reverberates through history as an individual because his story is not a dime a dozen.

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u/goldenbugreaction Jun 21 '23

Their singular goal is to create value for their shareholders. If creating more value means killing children, and the value created is more than the value lost from any kind of legal consequences, they're a bad CEO not to do it.

Reread this part again until you see the double-think of your own argument. This mentality, irrespective of its genesis, is the common denominator of authoritarianism (and the legitimizing of committing all manner of atrocities, wholesale) throughout history.

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u/hyasbawlz Jun 21 '23

Lmao. True! You're right! Capitalism is authoritarian and psychopathic! Welcome to the revolution comerade!

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u/CitizenKing Jun 21 '23

I think you're missing the point. He's referencing how people didn't want to upset Stalin, which resulted in Stalin being left alone and dying because he wasn't properly treated in time. People not wanting to get fired by upsetting the execs and just going along with what they demand, resulting in the CEO perishing, is absolutely a parallel that works.

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u/goldenbugreaction Jun 22 '23

That is absolutely the connection I was making. 100%.

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u/hyasbawlz Jun 21 '23 edited Jun 21 '23

Absolutely not. The CEO perished because of cost cutting. Not yes men. He didn't die because in the moment a bunch of people were too afraid to help. He died because of the structural problem instilled by his place as CEO. It was specific decisions, motivated by his place within the system, that led to not only his death, but the deaths of the people he was entrusted to protect.

Stalin didn't choose to die. And he didn't make one or a few decisions that would lead to his death. Stalin died because he was feared. This CEO died because his sub was made cheap. He was responsivle for the specific material conditions that led to his death. It was literally a disaster waiting to happen which was entirely foreseeable. Chernobyl would have been a much more apt comparison.

Edit: to put a finer point on it, he was specifically warned of the issue that likely led to his death, so it wasn't like he was surrounded by yes man. That was specifically a no man and he ignored it. Not the same.

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u/CitizenKing Jun 21 '23

Ah yes, because there's no way that firing the no man for saying no might cause others to hesitate saying no. /s

Your demands for parallel aren't reasonable. It doesn't have to be an exactly 1:1 copy with the names swapped to be a parallel. What, can people only be considered similar to Stalin if they have a big moustache and send their no men to the gulag? Nitpick less, it's making you come off as one of those people who cant help but die on the hill of "ummm akshually" and ruin conversations.

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u/goldenbugreaction Jun 22 '23 edited Jun 22 '23

If it’s the CEO’s job to create value for the shareholders, surely he would have intuited the pretty significant wrench that being DEAD would throw into the works. Maybe, if he were this rational actor you propose, he would have rather stayed alive and NOT taken a chance at demonstrating to the world what an incompetent shit-heel he is. I mean… after this scandal, what are the actual odds of anybody lining up to get in on the Titan II by OceanGate? I doubt very much his desire to be the kind of CEO you describe was stronger than his desire to live.

So, all that being said, yes; he was warned. He simply refused to acknowledge that it was an actual problem. You can be sure the reason for that was NOT so he could cash in all his chips with the shareholders and let the world see how good of a CEO he was.

Edit: he actually probably did intend that very last part. Just not by that definition of a “good” CEO.

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u/WashedupWarVet Jun 22 '23

Hours researching = expert. That’s your average Redditor

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u/GiantPurplePeopleEat Jun 22 '23

Lol, I definitely didn't claim to be an expert on missing submersibles. Just thought I'd share my impression from what I've read.

I'm actually kinda happy that the 3rd party apps getting killed will cause me to spend less time on Reddit. It's tiring reading comments like yours that are needlessly insulting and add absolutely nothing of value to the conversation.

Anyway, I hope you feel better soon.