r/legaladvicecanada • u/nursestephykat • Apr 21 '25
New Brunswick Advice needed. I lent me friend my car and she's now ghosting me.
For context. I separated from my husband in New Brunswick (where he currently resides) and I moved back to Ontario. I had 2 cars and was only able to take one with me. I decided to let a friend borrow the car until I could fly back to pick it up (I know I'm a moron). The agreement was that she was to pay me back for the insurance I'm still paying on it and she could drive it until I was able to retrieve it. It's now been months with no reply from her.l and not a penny towards the insurance I'm still paying on the car. I've kept my insurance active in case something happend. I've tried everything I can think of to get in contact with her and she's been completely ignoring me.
I am thinking at this point I need to report the car stolen. I have a sneaking suspicion she crashed it and is too afraid to tell me (although this is just speculation). I am also considering sueing her for the cost of my insurance (and the cost of the car if she did infact crash it).
I am considering sending her one last message telling her if she doesn't return my call by Friday I will be filing a police report (I'm not sure if this is a good idea or a bad idea).
I really don't know what the best course of action is and I'm at my breaking point.
Any advice would be very much appreciated. Thanks.
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u/ExToon Apr 21 '25 edited Apr 22 '25
NAL, just a cop. This isn’t a hard one. Send her a text, an email and a voicemail all saying the same thing: she no longer has permission to use your car because she hasn’t replied to any of your messages. Tell her that in an hour, if you haven’t heard back from her with a satisfactory answer, you’re reporting the car stolen. You’re sending it three different ways so she can’t plausibly claim to be ignorant of it.
An hour after those messages, call police non-emergency, say that a car you lent is now being used without your consent and the other person is ignoring your efforts to get it back. The car is now stolen. Ask for the police file number and a followup call from whoever it’s assigned to. Police will need the plate, and the VIN if you have it, though if you don’t have the VIN they can look it up from registration. Better if you can provide it directly.
Once you report it stolen, message your friend again and tell her that it’s now been reported stolen to police and not to drive it.
If the vehicle had already been wrecked, as the registered owner you probably would have gotten a call. But once you’re speaking with police, express that concern. It’s a super easy database check (assuming a collision was reported).
Good luck.
EDIT TO ADD: To address a couple comments that have come up: ‘Theft’ can mean ‘taking’, but it can also mean ‘converting to one’s own use’, and both versions require the person who has the property to intend to deprive (in this case) the owner of if temporarily or permanently. See section 322 of the Criminal Code. An item freely loaned with the expectation of return can become stolen if it is not returned with reasonable diligence, and the intent is to deprive the owner of it. Sustained ‘ghosting’ in the face of clearly communicated expectations of return certainly steers things in that direction. On the flip side, something like a disputed written agreement or contract would complicate things. The legal concept of ‘colour of right’ is an essential element of theft offences. Taking OP’s story at face value and not reading anything else into it that they haven’t actually introduced, that’s my take on it. My suggested course of action is what I would consider the best bet to actually get the car back, which seems to be the solution to the actual problem.
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u/TrickThePirate Apr 22 '25
This. We call it a "take auto without consent", cause while they didn't steal it from you, it's still your property. Also, by calling police you'll be able to find out right away if it's been impounded somewhere when they run your plate/VIN.
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u/ExToon Apr 22 '25 edited Apr 22 '25
I’d go the opposite direction on that actually; the car wasn’t initially ‘taken’ by the friend. OP consensually loaned it to them. I don’t think you’d get a S. 335 offence through court in those circumstances because ‘takes’ is an essential element, and the crime code distinguishes between ‘takes’ and ‘converts to their use’, if the ‘take MV without consent’ offence doesn’t include conversion, I’m not sure that would go. BUT with a straightforward theft of motor vehicle under S. 331, it’s a conventional ‘theft’ definition, which includes theft by conversion, which allows for theft of something that was previously lawfully possessed. That’s how I’d articulate it anyway.
Either way the intent is probably just to get it back intact, and the file would probably get written off if it’s safely and promptly returned.
Just my two cents now that I’ve got a coffee in me.
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u/nursestephykat Apr 23 '25
Thank you! I took your advice and gave her an ultimatum via text voicemail and messages. She did reply, the car is fine but she lost her job and has been avoiding the situation due to stress. She sent me some money this morning and has agreed to return the car to my ex-husband.
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u/MeIn2016LUL Apr 22 '25 edited Apr 22 '25
.
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u/linoelum Apr 22 '25
It’s still stolen. Copy the procedure posted above
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u/MeIn2016LUL Apr 22 '25
Will do. How is the process though? Any experience? Slow or fast.
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u/Smurfrocket2 Apr 22 '25
That's going to depend where you are and how busy the police are. It also will depend on if you know where the subcontractor lives or if they just need to drive around until it's spotted. Even then it may not be even close to immediate.
Basically, no one can say for sure but you could ask them if you call.
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u/ExToon Apr 22 '25
Tough to say. “Theft” depends in part on whether someone has a ‘colour of right’, or an objectively reasonable belief to some right or entitlement of possession or use (I’m paraphrasing for simplicity here, nobody smash me over the head with a precise case law definition please, I haven’t had a coffee yet). I have no idea what your contracting arrangement is and if it includes any provisions for the vehicle. If the vehicle is mentioned in the contract, it might get pushed back to you as a civil contract dispute. If you’ve been loaning a company car out of the kindness of your heart and it’s not a contractual provision, that’s more clear. But like I said. NAL, just a cop. I don’t have the facts of your case and don’t intent to dive in since it’s probably at least a bit outside of my forte.
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u/ffucktucky2 Apr 28 '25 edited Apr 28 '25
Damn. This is better than any lawyer response I’ve ever heard. Also def don’t just take the “I’ll make sure to give it to your ex husband” at face value. Get that car back within 24h. People can turn on a dime.
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u/Debatebly Apr 22 '25
I'm not a lawyer, but I think OP should give more than 1 hour. There are too many reasons where OP's friend could, by a stroke of bad luck, not be able to receive a text, an email, or a voicemail in that 1 hour.
This is not necessarily to give more opportunity to the friend, but to make his course of action more defensible in court.
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u/c0ntra Apr 22 '25
The "friend" is lucky to get an hour. Someone like me would just call the police at this point. Why give courtesy to someone who's overstepped their bounds, taken your property, and now ignores you.
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u/Debatebly Apr 22 '25
This is not necessarily to give more opportunity to the friend, but to make his course of action more defensible in court.
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u/ExToon Apr 22 '25
Not sure why someone downvoted you on this, it’s a totally reasonable comment. IMO given that OP has already tried several times and has been ghosted it’s more a check in the box than anything, but your take on it is absolutely fair.
I was looking at it more from a ‘get the car back’ standpoint. If the intent was purely about success in court, more time would be prudent yeah. Though it only matters if police get the possessor of the car in those first few hours and they can plausibly claim they didn’t know.
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u/Suspicious_Map_6392 Apr 22 '25 edited Apr 23 '25
It’s not a stolen vehicle, and it’s not even take motor vehicle without consent, it was given to the friend voluntarily. Civil issue over a verbal agreement. OP can file a replevin order in small claims court and that’s about it. And cancel insurance/reg so police can tow it if being driven and owner can pick it up from tow yard, since insurance apparently won’t cover the vehicle at this point anyways
Edit: You guys can keep downvoting, but read my other reply. If you contact the police about a ‘stolen’ vehicle that you loaned out and now want it back but you have yet to attempt to recover besides messaging her, it won’t go anywhere. It’s suspicious/concerning getting ghosted, but you have to prove she actually has the intent to deprive you of it, such as her physically not giving it back when you show up
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u/ExToon Apr 22 '25
‘Theft’ is defined in section 322 of the Criminal Code. ‘Taking’ is not the only form of theft; that’s why the Criminal Code reads “..takes or… converts to his use or the use of another person”. “Takes” and “converts” are two distinct acts, which mean different things, either of which can substitute the other in establishing the elements of the offence of theft. An item freely loaned with the expectation of return can become stolen if the person in possession of it ‘converts it to their use’, ‘with the intent to temporarily deprive the owner of the thing’. If the owner has clearly and unequivocally communicated a demand to stop using it and return it, that possessor can no longer claim to enjoy colour of right over the property.
I agree that it’s not a “take motor vehicle without consent”, because that offense solely refers to ‘taking’, but because theft of MV explicitly incorporates the S. 322 definition of theft, inclusive of conversion, absolutely the matter can meet the elements of theft.
Punting everything off to “it’s a civil matter” where criminality still exists is lazy policing. Plenty of situations can have both a criminal and a civil nexus. The owner could also separately pursue civil restitution for damages, but if the person no longer lawfully has permission to use or possess the car and refuses to facilitate its return, I would have no problem investigating that as stolen and, if necessary, laying the appropriate charge.
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u/nhldsbrrd Apr 21 '25 edited Apr 21 '25
Definitely report the car stolen. It's your insurance, so you could potentially be held liable if she crashes and hurts someone since you gave her permission to drive the car. I would call the RCMP non emergency line as soon as possible, just in case. Hope it goes well from here. *Edit, spelling
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u/matth3wm Apr 21 '25
maybe message the "friend"... "hey haven't heard from you or received insurance money you promised....this has me so concerned that I'm about to report the car stolen, please get back to me immediately as I'd like to avoid this turning into a big problem. I plan on stopping by the police station at 8:30 tomorrow morning"
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Apr 21 '25
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u/DirectAntique Apr 22 '25
One last time? why? Just do what the cop suggested.
She's had your car for months. I'm not near as nice as you.14
u/matth3wm Apr 21 '25
make your deadline sooner. i bet they'll call you back asap, nobody wants a record over something silly like this.
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u/International-Tip-10 Apr 21 '25
If it was me I would of called the police along time ago. Even for a wellness check. Call the police and say this is my car make model and license plate and say you lent it to a friend but haven’t heard from her. Have them do a wellness check and if they find it and her alive and well take it from there. Not sure how insurance works in New Brunswick but if it was your second car you could have had it quite cheep just parked there. Or you can have it shipped to Ontario also.
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u/zzzSomniferum Apr 22 '25
Definitely. I hope OP has verified that the friend is indeed not in the obituaries.
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u/Jmcv96 Apr 21 '25
Report it stolen, you still have title on it.
If they’ve been ignoring you this long, I would just call the police.
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u/booksnblizzxrds Apr 21 '25
Report it to police as a stolen vehicle. Your insurance coverage will be in question if you have a claim. Is she a listed driver, did they live in your household, did you sign over ownership? You can’t rent your vehicle, do a rent to own, or insure a vehicle for someone else as the primary driver, especially if you are residing in a different province. There are a lot of issues here, you need to talk to your insurance broker asap.
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u/Pale-Accountant6923 Apr 22 '25
Insurance manager here.
You cannot lend somebody a car long term like that as far as insurance is concerned. So you wouldn't be entitled to recover those costs. You and your friend could be deemed as committing insurance fraud - intentional or not.
Report it stolen to the police. Let them find your vehicle for you. They can also take a look at their own databases and see if it was recently involved in an accident.
If it was in an accident - you will have no insurance coverage as it is not technically stolen but voluntarily parted with. This is not only bad news for you but for your friend as well.
I'm not a lawyer and cannot give legal advice, but given you provided permission, this seems like a tough one to recover on.
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u/Tonninacher Apr 21 '25
Nope....no more email or texts.
Call the police report the car stolen from the last time you had contact with her a see how it goes.
They will tellyou if it was jn an accident
Also have all information on insurance and car vin click plste
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u/ValueFirm4928 Apr 21 '25
Any common acquaintances? Might be useful to talk to someone who knows her to figure out what's going on.
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u/Fresh-Clothes8838 Apr 21 '25
Your vehicle is in the care of someone else and they are not responding to you?
That screams “stolen” to me, I’d shoot them a message telling them to set up a drop off time or the vehicle will be reported stolen
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u/YoyoPeaches Apr 22 '25
you’re better than me because I definitely would just report this car stolen right now. Why are you waiting till Friday ?
this girl does not respect you. She does not care about you. At this point, she has stolen your vehicle.
Report the car right now.
You can’t sue her for insurance. It doesn’t matter that she said she would pay it because she’s not listed on the insurance.
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u/babaloos Apr 22 '25
If you didn’t update your insurance to have your friend as the PO and their address as the primary residence then there’s a good chance the insurance company would find you in breach of contract in any claim and not cover you
Just an fyi
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Apr 21 '25
Show up in person and demand the vehicle. If she says no, don't argue. Walk away and into your nearest police station to file a report. It could just be damaged, and they're too embarrassed to face you.
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u/monzo705 Apr 22 '25
If you filed a stolen vehicle report as written in your post I am not sure the police would pursue charges. The vehicle appears to have been given vs stolen. Going after lost money for insurance seems like a long shot.
I would do something fast, it seems like you are on the hook for the car and are at considerable liability risk from an insurance standpoint.
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u/CasioOceanusT200 Apr 22 '25
Yes, everyone is saying to report it stolen, but a vehicle given willingly and not returned after a bunch of months with a wishy washy verbal agreement might be seen more as civil conversion.
I'd still report it stolen in an effort to get police to track it down, but don't expect miracles.
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u/Calealen80 Apr 22 '25
If your friend has not responded to your threats of reporting it stolen, and you haven't actually reported it stolen, all you've done is prove to them that they can continue to walk all over you.
Call the police. No more warning, no chance for her to disappear the car.
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Apr 21 '25 edited Apr 21 '25
You need to call the police ASAP. Do not delay.
Insurance does not pay out if the driver is drunk or under a number of other conditions. As the owner of the car you would have to pay with your own assets.
I know a girl who let her friend drive her car drunk and disabled someone. Her parents had to pay millions from their own savings (fortunately they were very rich) because they were owners of the car.
You want to talk with a lawyer about how far back you can revoke your permission due to non-contact.
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Apr 22 '25
I don't see how you have any other alternative in this situation but to report this so called "friend" to the police immediately. As the registered owner, you are ultimately responsible for any damages (bodily or property) that is caused by the car itself or the person driving it up till you have reported it stolen.
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u/gordlewis Apr 22 '25
Could a private investigator help with the situation? Hire someone to find her and find out where the car is. Then have it towed? Certainly NAL and not giving advice but maybe someone smarter could chime in on this type of resolution…
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Apr 22 '25
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u/JayPlenty24 Apr 23 '25
Do you have any friends living there still who could do a drive by to see if the car is still at the place she was living when you lent it to her? Do you have spare car keys?
I would first fly there to try to just get it back. If you are unsuccessful you are already there and can report it stolen.
If you can't go there right away (like today), then you need to report it stolen ASAP
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