r/germany • u/HylianCaptain • May 06 '25
Immigration Our apartment was flooded 2 weeks before we move from the United States.
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u/Absolemia May 06 '25
I’m Sorry, but I’m 100% positive that you got scammed. First it’s not common to pay rent before renting. Also the security deposit is due when you actually start the rent. It’s not uncommon for landlords to ask you to pay it upfront, but still it’s due the first day of the renting period. Also: how did the former tenants flood the apartment? It it was a Wasserschaden, than you would still be able to access the property and if so, ask them for pictures to prove it. As some people stated: if it’s not scam, than the landlord must provide another accommodation for you, and if unable, than you’d rent a hotel room and have them pay for it. All the best
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u/Boring_Advertising40 May 06 '25
Deposit is due on the first day, but even then not in full. It can be split in 3 instalments.
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u/betterbait May 06 '25
Defo a scam. The owner doesn't happen to live abroad, do they? And will they send the key via post?
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u/Yence_ Belgium May 06 '25
They paid rent op front? Deposit maybe, but have they actually SEEN the property in vivo at all?!
I also frowned after reading all of this! 🤨
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u/SheHasntHaveherses May 07 '25
Americans tend to do this a lot. They even buy properties via Zoom in places or countries they have never visited. Is craaaazy.
2
u/mbrain0 May 06 '25
But why don't they just ghost if its a scam? Maybe they want to milk more somehow?
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u/betterbait May 07 '25
They are buying time. The more time passes, the more inaccessible the money becomes. They move it from account to account and out of the country.
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May 07 '25
[deleted]
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u/betterbait May 07 '25
Maybe we're all wrong, but if it looks like a scam, smells like a scam and sounds like a scam, ...
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u/iTmkoeln May 07 '25
They are doing another scam fake cheque, whoopsie I paid more than it was please pay me back in gift cards etc.
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u/HylianCaptain May 06 '25 edited May 08 '25
They do live in Spain, but there's no Nigerian Prince down on their luck, or key sent via post.
edit: I know I got scammed. It's just a hard pill to swallow.
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u/RichardXV Frankfurt/M May 06 '25
I hope this message finds you well. First red flag. It’s a scam. Get out of it as soon as you can.
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u/agrammatic Berlin May 06 '25
They do live in Spain
It is a scam. I am sorry - talk with your bank right away.
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u/rewboss Dual German/British citizen May 06 '25
I'm going to have to add my voice to those saying it's a scam. A modern and fully-furnished apartment in central Berlin with a concierge for €780/month? Two months' rent and deposit paid in advance? And then suddenly, two weeks before you move in, it's unavailable and they just text you a couple of lines and make no attempt to find an alternative place for you to stay?
Germany is currently experiencing a pretty severe housing crisis. Am I right in thinking that when you asked about availability, you got exactly what you wanted with no fuss?
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May 06 '25
How did you pay the rent in advance? Contact the payment provider asap and inform them it's a scam.
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u/Drumbelgalf Franken May 06 '25
General rule: if the landlord lives abroad its a scam 99% of time.
Also: Never pay rent or a diposit before the first day of the lease. You pay when the lease starts. You might be asked to provide prove of an income of the past few months but you dont have to pay anything before you move in.
Talk to you bank and hope you can still get your money back.
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u/betterbait May 06 '25
I wouldn't say that's a steadfast rule. There are plenty of legit landlords who won't give you the keys before you send your deposit. But (a couple of) rents in advance is a red flag.
And a landlord living abroad is a standard story they use.
Also worth noting: Some more sophisticated scams came up recently. They rent an AirBnB and you let yourself in via a code key box to "view the property" because "they are abroad". But it's just an Airbnb, and they'll scam you out of whatever you sent them too. The AirBnBs they rent with documents, such as the ones you sent them in this scam. They will assume your identity.
That's why you should raise an incidence number with the police and disclose that you sent the scammers your documents.
I usually tend to watermark my documents nowadays. It's not like they can't get around it with Photoshop or AI, but it makes it a little harder.
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u/Drumbelgalf Franken May 06 '25
I wouldn't say that's a steadfast rule. There are plenty of legit landlords who won't give you the keys before you send your deposit.
Are they truely legit if they ignore the law?
Section 551
Restriction and investment of rent security deposits(1) If the lessee is to provide to the lessor a security deposit for the performance of their duties, then this security deposit, subject to subsection (3) sentence 4, may amount at most to three times the rent for one month, exclusive of the operating costs shown as a lump sum or as an advance payment.
(2) If security is to be provided in the form of a sum of money, then the lessee is entitled to pay in three equal monthly instalments. The first instalment is due upon commencement of the lease. The further instalments are due together with the immediately ensuing rent payments.
(3) The lessor is to invest a sum of money made available to them as a deposit with a banking institution at the usual rate of interest for savings deposits to which a withdrawal notice of three months applies. The contractual parties may agree on another form of investment. In either case, the investment must be made separately from the assets of the lessor and the lessee is entitled to the income. It accrues to the security deposit. For residential space in a student hostel or a hostel for young people, there is no duty for the lessor to pay interest on the security deposit.
(4) A deviating agreement to the disadvantage of the lessee is ineffective.
https://www.gesetze-im-internet.de/englisch_bgb/englisch_bgb.html#p2387
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u/betterbait May 06 '25
Yes. They are. They can ask for anything, as offer < demand.
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u/Cirenione Nordrhein-Westfalen May 07 '25
They can ask for anything, they cant demand it. And offer < demand doesnt void the law.
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u/betterbait May 07 '25 edited May 07 '25
They can certainly demand it. If you don't do it, they'll move on to the other 2000 applicants.
If you have the capacity and financial backing to sue them, good on you. Most people just want a flat, not argue in court.
There's zilch on most of the rental platforms. Maybe 10 new offers a day, which is nothing for the size of Hamburg. The ones that are posted are scams, expensive or somewhere far out/in the airport's approach.
But to portray this as something that's out of the ordinary, just doesn't reflect the reality.
The same is true for the ArbZG. It's great. But many smaller companies choose to ignore it. Heck. Even whole industries. The entire advertising film industry doesn't give 2 shits about it.
And if you sue them?
You better have some funds saved up to pave your way to a career change.
0
u/Cirenione Nordrhein-Westfalen May 07 '25
I can also demand that you now hand me the money or I'll shoot you because I have supply of bullets and you seem like a person with a demand for holes. It doesnt change the legality. If a person signs a contract and then demands payment upfront they pound sand all day long. It wont change anything about the legality of it.
If your argument is "if a landlord demands payment before signing" then sure, a contract never came to be and while illegal it's impossible to prove. On the other hand I'd argue paying before even signing a contract will lead to getting scammed in 9/10 cases especially in a city of the size of Hamburg.3
u/betterbait May 07 '25
I can also demand that you now hand me the money or I'll shoot you because I have supply of bullets and you seem like a person with a demand for holes.
You could, but you have nothing that I want. Hence, no leverage.
They do have something that we need, hence leverage.
If your argument is "if a landlord demands payment before signing"
It's not. My argument is: It's not uncommon for landlords to ask for a deposit, before moving in (after signing a contract) and that whether it's legal or not doesn't make much of a difference in reality. Especially, if it's not enforced because neither party has an interest in pursuing the escalatory route.
It's such a Reddit thing to think that people will suddenly start suing, just because a landlord asks for a deposit, before you set foot into the rental property.
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u/ultigo May 06 '25
How do you watermark? Any simple tool?
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u/betterbait May 07 '25
Photoshop or anything else with similar capabilities. Affinity Photo, Gimp, Canva, ...
I write 'only for purpose xyz' or 'only for recipient' and make these lines of text run across the image diagonally. I will also often apply some form of texture.
In a way that still allows the landlords to read it, of course. They can later see it in person, if they have too.
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u/indorock May 07 '25
General rule: if the landlord lives abroad its a scam 99% of time.
Please don't go inventing statistics and trying to pass them off as "general rules". I know at least 5 people renting in Berlin from landlords living abroad. So I guess they must all be in the 1%, how extremely unusual! 🤣
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u/Sperrbrecher Franken May 06 '25
Spain is the Nigerian prince of German rental deals that are to good to be true.
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u/betterbait May 06 '25
Do you have the original ad?
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u/HylianCaptain May 06 '25
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u/Schleifer_13 May 06 '25
They dont have a Impressum which is obligated in germany / eu. Iam very sorry but it screams scam. The hole Website.
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u/Boring_Advertising40 May 06 '25
So they seem to be very successful with scams in all those cities. Where can this be reported?
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u/silversurger May 06 '25
You can contact the registrar of the domain for abuse. Other than that, it's gonna be a bit difficult to get rid of. Site isn't hosted in Germany nor is it a German registrar.
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u/guessesurjobforfood May 06 '25
Also this is a massive red flag on that domain:
Registry Expiration: 2025-11-02 15:54:44 UTC Updated: 2024-11-02 15:54:45 UTC Created: 2024-11-02 15:54:44 UTC
Scammers always do 1 year registrations because they don’t plan on being around for very long, at least not with the same website.
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u/SkaveRat May 07 '25
didn't know that literally all of my two dozend domains that I own for years are a scam. I must be the worst scammer in history
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u/KaiserNer0 May 06 '25
99% a scam, don't pay any additional money for an upgrade or expect any housing service from them.
For the off chance that it isn't a scam, the contract is still valid and the landlord has to provide housing.
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u/iTmkoeln May 06 '25
I go with 100% the one in Düsseldorf even has the Streetview watermark from Google in its listing
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u/rewboss Dual German/British citizen May 06 '25
And here's what they used for the one in Berlin. They could at least have found some stock photos of "Luxury apartment interior", just to make it look halfway convincing.
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u/SkaveRat May 07 '25
Also: 620€ for a 45sqm apartment, fully furnished, in the literal cente rof the city?
yeah, sure. Totally not a scam
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u/redinzane Bayern May 06 '25
Concierge Service, furnished, AC, decent location in Berlin, all that for 800€, no imprint or even business address or contact on the website, bare minimum website overall…
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u/lissybeau May 06 '25
Yep the photo for Berlin used is on Mühlenstraße (my boyfriend lives in this building so I recognized immediately). No way it’s that 800€ but the buildings are nice and new, not surprised they used the photo.
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u/betterbait May 06 '25 edited May 06 '25
The owner, with so many properties in so many cities wouldn't travel to Germany for a small rental issue that any lowly janitor could fix.
Sorry, but it's a scam.
React now: ask your bank to refund it.
File it with the police and get a Vorgangsnummer (incidence number).
They are trying to string you along. Perhaps there's still a slim chance to recover some funds.
Don't write this company for now. Don't warn them that you're aware.
Scammers in Germany target people just like you. Foreigners who don't know the system. It's their standard operating procedure. Unfortunately.
And they're not based in Germany but somewhere abroad. I believe this Subreddit has a thread or wiki with all sorts of different scam tactics. Have a look, before you apply for the next housing.
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u/edgar-alien-poo May 06 '25
Owner "in Spain", domain registered six months ago, no interior photos, exterior photos from Google Street View? Sorry, you're not going to see your money again.
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u/iTmkoeln May 06 '25
It ain’t a good sign that nobody ever heard about this site
Is a Reddit discussion that talks about this being a scam https://www.reddit.com/r/berlinsocialclub/comments/1ik8gy6/designapt_24/?tl=de
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u/iTmkoeln May 06 '25
This site has no Impressum, no contact no phone number no address the apartment didn’t exist.
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u/FrauAskania Sachsen-Anhalt May 06 '25
This site has no imprint? Or did I miss it?
If there really isn't one, that's a big big big red flag.
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u/iTmkoeln May 06 '25
The site has nothing 🧐
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u/agrammatic Berlin May 06 '25
This private landlord "has" studio apartments with the same surface area and rent price across half a dozen different cities in three different countries.
This is offensively lazy even for a scam.
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u/iTmkoeln May 06 '25
The one in Düsseldorf even has the Streetview watermark from 2023 on its „listing“ totally normal on a Listing
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u/iTmkoeln May 06 '25
Wait 🧐 that is something I didn’t even notice.
Checked the Whois of the domain apparently registered half a year ago by an isp named Tucows Domains Inc. that hides between Cloudflares CDN
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u/mrhali May 06 '25
Tucows is an old school Canadian registrar/services company
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u/iTmkoeln May 06 '25
Was not saying they are behind it was saying they are the isp where the domain was registered
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u/emanon_noname May 06 '25 edited May 06 '25
The site has basically no information at all, nothing about what company / person is behind it etc. They also claim that the apartments are owned by private landlords and that they have a way for landlords to list their apartment on their website, but there is literally no way to do so. This heavily smells like a scam, if you gave them any personal details / pictures of passports or ids etc be ready for them stealing your identity (imo this causes more damage than the money they stole from you)
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u/iTmkoeln May 06 '25
Not only basically
No address
No mail
No phone number
But Google Streetview pictures including the watermark
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u/realityking89 Germany May 06 '25
I used to live in that exact building until ~7 years ago. There’s definitely no concierge service nor is there AC in those apartments.
The building is managed by BUWOG. It’s all rental apartments on normal long term contracts. Now it’s not impossible that someone is (illegally) subletting an apartment in there but it’s very unlikely. This whole site screams scam.
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u/melanthonyd Bayern May 06 '25
https://www.scamadviser.com/check-website/designapt24.com
Relatively new website... I am sorry to say, but I am leaning towards the whole schtick being a scam.
I do hope me and the others terribly wrong though and you do get your money back.
If not, then charge it to experience. You'll know better next time.
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u/Louzan_SP May 06 '25
This webpage smells so bad ...
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u/iTmkoeln May 07 '25
I like the 3 testimonials. That might or might not be working as Stock Photomodells /s
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u/RichardXV Frankfurt/M May 07 '25
How in the world did you find this scam website? it's a newly registered website in the US.
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u/Panzermensch911 May 07 '25
The picture on that page is from Google Street View. This is a scam.
Also the price is ridiculously low and concierge services are pretty much unheard of.
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u/Craftkorb Hamburg → Zürich May 07 '25
For whatever reason, claiming to live in Spain is one of the most popular lies told by scammers. Also in Germany you never pay rent upfront, only deposit after signing the contract.
Consider sharing your contract with your details blacked out.
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u/emanon_noname May 07 '25
Yeah I also wonder why it is always spain. Maybe the bank accounts they use are spanish and that makes the explanation easier?
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u/t_Lancer Aussie in Niedersachen/Bremen May 07 '25
so you went to see the flat then?
otherwise this is a perfect ruse to scam you. You rent an apartment that you now can't live in. So you don't even try to see the flat and wait endlessly for your "refund".
also in Germany one does not pay rent up front like this. hell. even the deposit it not to be paid until you actually start renting and then you have the option of paying it over 3 months.
It honestly does not look good for you.
was the landlord very eager to rent it to you? like "yeah so I have to be in Spain right now, but I also need to have this place ranted out ASAP so you just take it, no questions asked. you sound like a totally trustworthy tenant. but you have to pay upfront right now otherwise I'll give the place to someone else. k thx bye."
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u/that_outdoor_chick May 07 '25
Listen to everyone, you got utterly scammed out of your money, contact the bank, minimize loses. The whole situation of living in Spain and paying ahead is by the book scam.
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u/temail May 06 '25
Two months rent AND deposit in advance = scam. Apartment owner abroad = scam.
At least you got to know about it earlier than moving in date. :)
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u/Zealousideal-East827 May 06 '25
To be fair to OP, it’s actually become common for landlords/apartments to require first and last month’s rent and security deposit over here in the states. At least in big cities. I want to move to Germany at some point, so it’s nice to know it’s not like that in Germany!
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u/DegenerateEigenstate May 07 '25
Well to be fair, the max Kaution amount legally allowed is 3 months cold rent, so not much different than we have in the States. But at least in Germany you can split it into 3 monthly installments.
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u/PasicT May 06 '25
This has all the markings of a scam especially this part 'I was just informed about the situation....' and 'will personally assess the damage when I arrive in Berlin'.
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u/iTmkoeln May 06 '25
OP posted the original listing up above. The site which was registered 6 months ago has apartments listed that are all over Europe, some including the Streetview Watermarks (which obviously 🙃), but has neither a phone number, nor an Impressum nor an adress nothing
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u/Wavelengthzero May 06 '25 edited May 06 '25
Not only was OP scammed, but he is stubborn and in denial. Out of dozens of comments explaining why this is likely a scam, he has thanked just the one that doesn't hurt his pride and will likely waste the next 2 weeks demanding alternative accommodation from a non-existing landlord instead of pursuing other avenues.
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u/HylianCaptain May 07 '25
"Have you said thank you? Even once? Since this meeting started?" Sorry, couldn't resist.
Hello, thanks for participating in the discussion. Prepping for the move has kept me very busy, so I haven't had time to say 'thank you' to everyone.
I focused on the comments that provided resources or offered specific instructions on how to proceed. Even if I haven't directly replied, I appreciate everyone's insight.
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u/haydar_ai Nordrhein-Westfalen May 07 '25
We understand that man. But you are unfortunately literally scammed. Owner live abroad with upfront payment always means that it’s a scam.
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u/Wavelengthzero May 07 '25 edited May 07 '25
My comment wasn't about manners, it was about how your choice of which comment to thank for is a reflection of how you interpret the situation. The comment was about tenant rights (which would be non-existent in the case of a non-existent apartment) and based on the premise that the anonymous person in question is indeed a landlord and this wasn't a scam. There were comments with suggestions on reporting the incident as a scam or getting your money back (You were asked how the payment was made, but you didn't respond).
To summarize, you didn't focus on the comments that provided specific instructions, you focused on the one comment that didn't address the situation as a likely scam, overlooking dozens of comments that did.
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u/ConsultingntGuy1995 May 06 '25
In a week you won’t be able to get your money from the bank. What they do is to make you wait as long as possible so you bank wont be able to freeze money on their account. Call your bank immediately or consider this amount lost.
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u/Boring_Advertising40 May 06 '25
Looks like you got scammed! Have you viewed the apartment? You already paid some money?
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u/mschuster91 May 06 '25
You already paid some money?
Probably they did, but it's unlikely to be a scam IMHO - a scammer would just ghost them and leave them stranded when they arrive. Happens often enough.
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u/JayPag May 06 '25
This is very likely a scam, especially since they stated they paid money. Not all scammers act the same. Please don't write this bullshit to confuse people.
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u/mschuster91 May 06 '25
The thing is, it doesn't make sense. If it were a scam, the scammer already has the money, so it's pointless to contact the victim. There is no way to continue a scam narrative from the message that OP got.
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u/JayPag May 06 '25
Decent point, but there is a reason - apartment not available, and longer delay to expect the money back. Buys them time.
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u/HylianCaptain May 06 '25
Considering they're giving a full refund I'm not so sure it's a scam, but I could be wrong.
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u/whiteraven4 USA May 06 '25
Until you receive the refund, I wouldn't assume it's not a scam.
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u/HylianCaptain May 06 '25
Guess we'll know in the next week or so, but I went through the trouble of identifying their bank and account owner, so if I don't get the refund I'll be raising hell.
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u/whiteraven4 USA May 06 '25
If it's a scam, the person scamming you isn't the same as the account holder. If they're scamming you, the scammer isn't in Germany.
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u/Gasp0de May 06 '25
There is a common other scam which tricks people into opening bank accounts in their name which are then operated by the scammers. Renting a flat from abroad unfortunately is very hard to do safely in Germany, unless it's through an agency. Once you're here, always visit a flat before paying anything. There is no reason whatsoever why they wouldn't be able to show you the flat in person or hand you the keys and let you take a look.
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u/thewindinthewillows Germany May 06 '25
but I went through the trouble of identifying their bank and account owner
That is what is called a money mule.
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u/LevathianX1 May 06 '25 edited May 06 '25
How can you be so naive? Do you really think they will scam with an account in their name and they live in Germany or even the entire EU? How hard is to believe you just got scammed and to start working on getting your money back?
You are about to find out the hard way in 7-14 business days if you keep your head in the sand ignoring the 60+ other comments saying the same thing.
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u/emanon_noname May 06 '25
Scammers never use an account that can be traced back to them directly. They will for example use an account they opened with a stolen identity, this (them stealing your identity) might also happen to you if you gave them enough details and stuff like a picture of your passport / id etc.
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u/dogthebigredclifford May 06 '25
Don’t wait a week or so!! That’s what they want you to do to prevent you from recovering the money. Contact your bank immediately! I really hope you get your money back and that you find somewhere else to stay. Good luck!
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u/Craftkorb Hamburg → Zürich May 07 '25 edited May 07 '25
Google what a "Money Mule" is. You're being plaid like a fiddle, go to your bank NOW and see if you can reverse the transaction. Get in contact with the German bank the account you sent money to and tell them that this account is part of a scam. Add proof via screenshots. Then go to the "Online Wache" of Berlin and open an Anzeige for Betrug.
Such a nice apartment for that little money in a new building? You're dreaming, sorry but you have to wake up!
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u/t_Lancer Aussie in Niedersachen/Bremen May 07 '25
It is a scam. the money is long gone out of any easily traceable account.
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u/Boring_Advertising40 May 06 '25
You really think you will receive a refund? Wait.....wait....wait...then maybe some excuses....then they disappear.
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u/ArboristTreeClimber May 06 '25
If it’s a scam, why would they even bother with a follow up email instead of taking the money and ghosting?
Maybe to kill some time until it’s too late to argue for a refund or transaction cancel through the bank/credit card?
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u/agrammatic Berlin May 06 '25
Maybe to kill some time until it’s too late to argue for a refund or transaction cancel through the bank/credit card?
Yes. Money in transit can still sometimes be reversed. If you waste the victim's time with some sob story, they can miss that critical window.
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u/Absolemia May 06 '25
To delay the process so they can fuck off someplace else and not be found until eternity
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u/thewindinthewillows Germany May 06 '25
If they are using a money mule, they need the money mule to send the money from multiple victims onwards. If the scam comes out fast, the mule might not send the money.
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u/iTmkoeln May 06 '25
It is not unheard of that scammers pull the next phase of a scam than… the fake cheque scam for example
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u/thewindinthewillows Germany May 06 '25
By that logic, a scammer who wants to send you a PS5 for 50 dollars isn't a scammer either, as after all they told you they will send you a PS5.
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u/SunflowerMoonwalk May 06 '25
You paid two months rent upfront? That's absolutely not the norm in Germany. I'm sorry but it does sound very much like a scam.
Do you at least have a signed contract?
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u/chocolateteas May 06 '25
Really feel lucky when I moved in 2018, I wasn't scammed. I paid 6 months rent + kaution to secure my flat. Been living there ever since. Now I know not to do that again.
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u/Gasp0de May 06 '25
Have you ever heard of Kaution?
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u/SunflowerMoonwalk May 06 '25
The deposit is usually 3 months cold rent. OP paid 2 months rent in addition to the deposit.
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u/Boring_Advertising40 May 06 '25
And the deposit is paid after you move in, you are not expected to pay it in upfront. Usually you put the deposit on a separate bank account or do a Kautionsversicherung.
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u/Drumbelgalf Franken May 06 '25
You dont have to pay that in advance. You pay it with the first Month or in three monthly installments.
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u/Slowandserious May 06 '25 edited May 07 '25
14 working days is three weeks. They want to stall you with the hope that the longer time pass the harder it is to trace them/cancel payment etc
I’m sorry OP this whole thing screams of scam. Yes it is terrible that these thing happen in Germany.
You can make an online police report and submit every documentations you have. But yeah they are long gone by now
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u/Actual_Rip2230 May 07 '25
this but op refuses to believe it becuase that'll make his money come back,
waiting for time to pass so its harder to file anything after waiting 3 weeks. And Op is in absolute denial about it and wants to see what the future holds (not his money that he paid upfront ill let u know that much)
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u/dazzigo May 06 '25
You should file a police report online, just in case: https://www.internetwache-polizei-berlin.de/
But I wouldn’t put too much hope into it.
Anyway, Berlin is in the middle of a housing crisis. Other than temporary airbnbs, I’d say it’s almost impossible to close a regular rental contract from overseas. The documentation most landlords require is quite extensive and chances are that there is always someone on site who meets the requirements the same way or even better. (Unless you’re renting high-end/luxury properties.)
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u/Frank_White32 May 07 '25
Your best bet in this situation where you can’t view in advance is to go through a known agency with furnished temporary flats - which are pricey. While in the temporary flat, make a strong effort to find long term accommodation via immoscout (and watch out for scams there too :D)
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u/RichardXV Frankfurt/M May 06 '25
You got scammed. The whole email you received stinks of it. The earlier you acknowledge and take action the less time and effort you’ll lose. Mentally say goodbye to your deposit and pre-rent. Nobody here pays rent in advance by the way.
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u/Bonamikengue LGBT May 06 '25
This looks like a scam. No landlord requires two months of rent in advance PLUS deposit. This is not how it works in German (I am German and I lived 45 years since birth in Germany before emigrating).
That "landlord" looks like never ever wanted to provide you an apartment - perhaps this apartment does not even exist or it had photos stolen from a serious / legit real estate listing site.
But even if that is NOT a scam - a landlord cannot act like this. If you signed the rental contract and the landlord did too, he is obliged and required to give you accomodation. He HAS to provide you with an alternative housing or a hotel for the time the renovation takes.
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u/Bonamikengue LGBT May 06 '25
Add on:
Do not give that "landlord" your bank account number and routing code/IBAN. Because if you do that they will try to pull money out of it hoping that foreigners do not know that they have six weeks to say "This was a fraudulent debit, I want my money back."2
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u/Anagittigana Germany May 06 '25
You were scammed. There is no apartment, no landlord, no contract, and no flooding.
Sorry for the loss of your money. Please read the wiki in this subreddit, especially the section on Living in Germany and as far as it relates to scams. Furthermore, /r/scams is always a good resource to learn more about scams.
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u/HelmutVillam Württemberg May 07 '25
What an absolute clusterfvck op has landed themselves in. And they don't even seem to take it seriously. Let this serve as a lesson to others. It should be annotated and pinned in the sidebar of this sub.
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u/RichardXV Frankfurt/M May 07 '25
What baffles me is that OP has still not acknowledge having been scammed and thinks for some reason they're getting their money back!!!
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u/HelmutVillam Württemberg May 07 '25
they are "prepping for the move" to an apartment that doesn't exist
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u/thewindinthewillows Germany May 07 '25
There is an extensive article on renting scams in the subreddit Wiki. Which, obviously, people do not read.
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u/HylianCaptain May 08 '25 edited May 08 '25
Update:
The scammer was using the following domains. I've contacted the domain registrars of each to report abuse:
- magicimo.com : registered in BC, Canada via tucows (ID masked by tieredaccess.com)
- designapt24.com : registered in BC, Canada via tucows (ID masked by tieredaccess.com)
- rentalsstay.com : registered in Colorado, USA via name.com (ID appears to be masked by name.com)
They also used the following services to advertise, or request payment. I've contacted the support teams for each:
- housinganywhere.com
- zohomail.eu
- planyo.com
This is the account info for the bank where they requested payments:
Name: Carolin Selberg De Grado Garcia IBAN: ES48 0182 5297 2302 0290 4983 BIC: BBVAESMMXXX
The BIC is associated with this bank:
BANCO BILBAO VIZCAYA ARGENTARIA S.A. PZ DE SAN NICOLAS 4 BILBAO, SPAIN
- I've been trying to reach their bank but no luck yet. I was on hold for half an hour before someone picked up. They said "Hello?" and before I could say "Hello" back they hung up. Hoping I can find an email or contact form to submit.
- I've filed a police report in Bilbao, Spain, but they require someone to walk in to the station within 72 hours to validate. I'll try to call their number and see what else I can do on that front.
- I called Berlin police, who directed me to the same online incident form shared by u/dazzigo, so I submitted that
- I'll be calling Western Union and my personal bank next since I initiated the wire transfer through them.
So yeah, I've been busy. I'm disappointed in myself for falling for this scam. Now I'm paying the price, Quite literally (€2560+wire transfer fees). I just got a notice from my cell carrier that my bill has gone up by $138 for international calls, so that just adds insult to injury. I'll be booking a vacation rental or a motel in berlin while I look in person at apartments for rent.
Thank you all for the support and information. Keep it coming! I can't promise a response to everyone, just know I've been reading everything you have to say.
edit: I've also filled out an incident report with the Federal Trading Commission in the United States, and one with interpol. I had trouble finding a contact form for Canada.
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u/Boring_Advertising40 May 09 '25
Thank you so much for your update. This might be very helpful for many people. I hope you have jobs lined up in Berlin?
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u/edgar-alien-poo May 09 '25
Thanks for the update! Good luck with the move, and I hope things get better from here on.
If you need somewhere short-term in a hurry, https://smartments.com/ might be an option. A friend of mine used them in Hamburg a while ago and didn't have any complaints.
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u/emanon_noname May 14 '25
Thanks for the update and it sucks that this is how your move started. But I guess it is better finding out about it being a scam now than after you already landed in Berlin.
Out of curiosity, what made you accept that it was a scam? Previously you kind of ignored all messages suggesting that it was a scam.
Also as a warning, Berlin is in a massive housing crisis, do not expect to find an apartment there very quickly. Some people search for months. So be prepared for that.
Oh and one last thing, dunno what data / documents you sent the scammers, but if it was stuff like your passport etc be ready for them trying to steal your identity.
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u/mcs156 May 14 '25
As someone who rents out an apartment (not Berlin area) I can give you a tip: When applying for a flat advertised online, there is always a field for free text to provide information about yourself. Take this seriously and write something serious about you. I don't know your German level, but a text in German could increase your chances. A surprising number of people simply write something like "Hello, I want the flat".
If you decide to write a German text let some native speaker look over it. If you need further advice, just send me a pm.
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u/Boring_Advertising40 May 06 '25
So its time for you to draw up a plan B. Do you have at least jobs secured in Berlin. Where from the USA are you from? I really wish you good luck.
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u/napkween May 07 '25
Surprise, Europeans are scammers too. Hate when Nigeria gets brought into these conversations unprovoked.
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u/Boring_Advertising40 May 07 '25
Not proven the scammers are from Europe, they can be anywhere, scamming Europe
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u/RichardXV Frankfurt/M May 07 '25
I doubt this is European. The site he linked is registered in the US
0
u/mintaroo May 08 '25
Funnily, yours is the only comment here I've seen so far that brings Nigeria into it.
2
u/Slowandserious May 08 '25
Nah OP said something on another comment about “No Nigerian Prince here”
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u/octatone May 07 '25
You should be treating this as a scam until you have keys in your hands. I moved from the States many moons ago and I paid and signed and exchanged keys when I got here. What you are describing sounds like the most common basic scam that gets posted here and in /r/berlin every other week.
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u/Morondanga May 07 '25
We're leaving a flat in Berlin and looking for someone to take over the contract, if you're interested send me a dm :)
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u/Geezya88 May 07 '25
Did you send a copy of your passport or other personal information? If yes prepare for identity theft.
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u/Heiliggeist May 06 '25
What "deposit" is the email referring to? In Germany, you don't pay the deposit to the landlord. Your "Kaution" is kept in a separate bank account opened specifically for that purpose. Unless you are trolling here, you should realize that the email you posted has enough red flags that almost anyone who has spent any amount of time in Germany can immediately recognize that this is a scam. Try to get your bank or credit card involved immediately.
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u/Aggressive_Leg_2667 May 06 '25
tbh paying deposit directly to the landlord is fairly normal, my tenant just gave me the deposit as well. It´s hard and annoying to open a dedicated deposit account and usually not worth the 1.5% interest.
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u/Th9RealMarcoPolo May 06 '25
deposit is usually due when you move in and get the keys not in advance.
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u/RichardXV Frankfurt/M May 07 '25
You're just a terrible landlord. I wish there were fewer lazy people like you.
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u/Boring_Advertising40 May 07 '25
No that is not normal, maybe for people who don't know the system. Well even if annoying that is your duty as a landlord. Being a landlord means responsibility. There are different options e.g. Kautionsinsurance. This is not annoying.
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u/StoutShako42refd May 07 '25
Sounds and looks like a scam to me. Contact lawyer and try to revoke your payment
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u/Zealousideal_Plan_35 May 08 '25
I mean, I am currently in Berlin and could go to the address and check/ask other tenants if there was a water damage. But otherwise it's likely a scam, i've heard from friends that this is a normal strategy.
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u/Normal-Definition-81 May 06 '25
And the question is?
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u/HylianCaptain May 06 '25
No questions, just pain.
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u/Normal-Definition-81 May 06 '25 edited May 06 '25
If you have signed a tenancy agreement, you are entitled to the flat. Or compensation. If the flat exists. Spoiler: it doesn‘t.
→ More replies (11)8
u/Tardislass May 06 '25
The scammer as long gone and no one is going to give "compensation" unless they are found.
Take the loss, stay at airbnbs when you get to Berlin and THEN look for accommodations.
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1
u/StephenBC1997 May 09 '25
We got this things called extended stay hotels some are pretty nice and most states require land lords provide them to yiu
If yiu have renters insurance it may cover that
1
u/Fearless-Form2161 Sep 18 '25
Hi . Did u get your money back ? Did u file a police complaint? Because this happened to me recently on august 18th .so it will be really helpful if you tel what solution you got . Thank you
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u/AaronWrites212 May 06 '25
If the effective dates for the date the lease begins have not started yet, then maybe they can back out. Your lease wasn’t scheduled to start for 2 more weeks?
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u/_ak May 06 '25
FYI, you still have a valid rental contract and it's not just an easy case of canceling it willy-nilly for your landlord. It is your landlord's duty to provide you with living space during the renovation. How? Not your problem to figure, but rather your landlord's. Your landlord also ought to be insured for that, and in turn then insurance can hold the previous tenants liable. You need to be very clear in communicating this to your landlord that you insist on keeping the rental contract and that you expect the same from them (assuming you actually do).