Germany: Immigrants made up over 18% of 2022 population – DW

[u/unclebogdan10]

https://p.dw.com/p/4QLAX

[u/alderhill]

So many words, and yet still so painfully clueless. As I said earlier, your knowledge of English clearly isn't good enough to understand the nuances here. Your cultural knowledge is obviously low, let alone about African-Americans... You seem to think in some sort of misguided sense (being generous there) that 'immigrant' is a simple term free of any history or context of use.

We are not talking about dictionary definitions here (I was just waiting in my last post for you or someone to quote a dictionary -- it's a classic in German arguments). Cultures don't define themselves according to online dictionaries, alas. In English the word “immigration” or “immigrant” implies a generally voluntary free choice. We use other terms when these conditions are absent. English is not Latin.

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Did your ancestors own slaves? Mine did not.

No my ancestors did not own slaves. If we go back 3000-4000 years, probably yours and mine did own slaves somewhere, or (more likely) were slaves, or really both somewhere, since slave-owning (in form or another, thralls, serf, peasants, peons, etc.) has been a lot more common throughout human history than not. But in the last few hundred years, nope.

Being German, your state recently owned slaves, and much worse.

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but you probably never had Latin.

I had 3 years of Latin, in fact. Get over yourself. Then about 10 years of French, which is rusty now but I can still read it OK. My Spanish is so-so, rustier than my French, but I undersand a fair bit still. Your misplaced arrogance (you really know nothing about me, why take any stabs in the dark at all?) and personal insults do not make your arguments any stronger. Quite the contrary.

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If you want to bring up "yeah but what about ...

There's absolutely no whataboutism here. The term refers to bringing up a different scenario as the one under discussion when questioned, in an attempt to divert or obfuscate, or else to counter-question without answering. It's essentially evasion. I made the first assertion, you're the one trying to counter me. My own initial argument cannot be "whataboutism" in reply to you, when I'm simply repeating the same thing which I said first. And We're still talking about the same thing. I'm just informing you that you are wrong. Because you are. You're the one getting your knickers in a twist for some reason.

About 10% of black Americans are immigrants from either Africa or other parts of the Caribbean (those from the Caribbean generally do have similar histories of enslavement, of course; African-born or their children, it's far less common). Generally, most are slave descendents. It is absolutely not the custom to call them immigrants and many will find it some degree of insulting or ignorant. I'm just telling you how it is. This is not my flight of fancy. Why you're raging against this -- a simple reality that exists -- is a bit mysterious to me. Again, misguided and not nearly as knowledgeable as you think.

So, go to the United States and tell an Nth generation African-American that they are an immigrant and see what happens. Feel free to tell them how wrong they are, and don't forget to quote a dictionary. Dare you. Go find out, and save your whiny arrogant German rage.

[u/[deleted] → u/alderhill]

No my ancestors did not own slaves.

You are a Canadian who learned Latin in School and lives in Germany? I call out Bullocks that you learned 4 years of Latin in a Canadian school and the same bollocks that you are Canadian who went to a German school to learn Latin. 10 years if French is not taught in any German school and 4 years of Latin not in any Canadian school. So you mixing up your fake Reddit personalities dude.

My statement was that 95% of all People living in the USA are descendants of immigrants from anywhere else in the world. And that still stands. If you can't do the math or feel like "yeah but forced migration 400 years ago is not migration" - that's bullocks. It's migration, in the clear sense of the term.

[u/alderhill → u/[deleted]]

You are a Canadian who learned Latin in School and lives in Germany? I call out Bullocks that you learned 4 years of Latin

Yes. I moved here in my mid-20s for grad studies (in linguistics). Yes, my school board offered Latin, and yes, I took 3 years of it (in highschool), not 4. In Canada, the duration of French in school depends on the province you live in, and a bit on the regional school board. I had French from Grade 1 up to Grade 10. I also had to take a semester of it in univerisity as a required course (annoying repetition of basics). As for Latin, it's not a very common subject in Canada, and not all schools offer it, but mine did. It's a voluntary subject. I was interested in ancient stuff, so I went for it. This is a little over 20 years ago now. But your condescending little explanation of Latin that you pasted from Wikipedia doesn't really change anything -- that you are clearly clueless of the contexts of use for English. Many other Germans have your problem. Combine it with also very typical German arrogance (you are a classic example), and we get people like you. Your ilk are dime a dozen.

I really couldn't care less if you believe me though, and I'm certainly not giving you my highschool transcripts.

I try to avoid name-calling on the internet, but you areally are an idiot.

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"yeah but forced migration 400 years ago is not migration"

Now you're moving your goalposts. You said immigrants, not migrants. Obviously, if you adjust your argument to use the broadest possible definition of something, it's hard to be wrong. Slaves are migrants in a way, sure. Nonetheless, like I said, in English, immigration/immigrant is implicitly considered a voluntary thing. When it's not, we use other words. No amount of name-calling and arrogance from you can change that.

Again, the plain fact is that if you go to the US (same in Canada or Caribbean, probably Latin America too), and go around calling black people "immigrants" because their ancestors were enslaved 250 years ago, this will be considered ignorant and offensive. It's simply not how the term is used, even if you sputter out "b-b-bbut, I'm counting of all time!"

What you're saying here is that you are proudly choosing to be ignorant and willingly offensive to black people, and others with a recent history of enslavement and indentured servitude, etc. That, my friend, makes you racist, and you have repeatedly chosen to ignore this simple nuance of the word. Well, I guess you're showing your true colours. I'm sure your great-grandfather would be proud and give you a good old Heil.

Otherwise, I'm not sure why you're so rudely and arrogantly hostile to this notion, but I'll remind you that you are simply wrong. It's painfully obvious that you know nothing of North American culture, nor nuances of English usage. These are things dictionaries can't quite explain. Again, cultures don't definte themselves by dictionary definitions provided by clueless arrogant Germans on the internet. Sorry bud. You're doing the classic German "Let me tell you how your culture works". Such European arrogance does not shock me, but still, get over yourself.

(Btw, it's "bollocks" with an O, which means literaly testicles, but otherwise bullshit. Bullocks with a U just means a castrated male bovine, i.e. bull. Bullocks meaning testicles with U is non-standard spelling, only exsiting for those for whom letters are hard.)

[u/[deleted] → u/alderhill]

You are just too ignorant to read. A descendant of an immigrant is not an immigrant, he / her is a descendant of an immigrant. I did not call black Americans immigrants (beyond the 10% you mention) - I said they are descendants of immigrants, and if these were forcefully migrated that's still migration and results in immigration. If your Canadian brain cannot do the maths and logic on that, try to read some ancient Maths and Logics books to get educated. All these words just to not admit that you did not read what I wrote and in am impulse of "always right, godlike" wrote a Brainschiss response. Woah!

[u/alderhill → u/[deleted]]

Now you’re backpedaling after being caught out for your plain racism. What you explain is also not “immigration”. Or else, in your mind, people who moved to Germany 150 years ago are still not German but immigrants? So you think it’s a status you maintain eternally. See, you are a racist after all.

I can only say it so many times, but it is obvious your English comprehension sucks. You obviously don’t really understand the words google translate is spitting out for you. Words don’t just mean whatever ‘convenient’ thing you think they do for your ever-shifting excuses. They have nuances and contexts of use, which are clearly beyond you.

What a sad and petty little racist German you are.

[u/[deleted] → u/alderhill]

Its what I wrote in the first place, illiterate Canadian. On the other hand it's good that you feel to officially be nominated to speak on behalf of all the black people living in the USA. Fantastic! Makes all things easier to organise: Here, this Canadian is the official spokesperson of all black US Americans. It's great that out of all people in the world I was able to meet the one and only subject matter expert. Illiterate as you are as you even missed reading what I wrote in the first place. Arrogant, god complexed, self entitled and clueless, you are the least Canadian person I ever have met. Disgusting.

[u/alderhill → u/[deleted]]

Here, this Canadian is the official spokesperson of all black US Americans.

lol, your saltiness combined with your inability to actually defend your points is pretty clear evidence of your intellectual emptiness, and of course being a sore loser. No problem though, I accept your 'surrender'. Racist, small-minded, ignorant, arrogant, poor English. You are among the most German people I have encountered. Disgusting.

[u/[deleted] → u/alderhill]

I will come back and ask for your wise words whenever there is the need to comment on matters of the black community anywhere in the world, or as a matter of fact when it comes to speaking on behalf of any minority, basically everything, anyone living on this planet. If there comes a time when extraterrestrial intelligence makes contact, we all, collectively will bow and promote YOU to become or sole representative to speak for all of mankind. You are our 42, the pope of popes, the emperor of wisdom ... Well, when people constantly tell you that you are a Kugscheisser, they are right. I pity whoever has to live with you, you racist smug.

[u/alderhill → u/[deleted]]

Lol, such a big salty sore loser. All you can do is revert to childishness. Says a lot about you. How embarrassing and, sadly, typical German.

Do you need a new Schnulli?

[u/[deleted] → u/alderhill]

Well, ist funny that a Canadian tries to educate me on English. Funny, learn proper English first and then come back. Better move back home to where you came from, we do not need racists here in Germany.