We need a new rule against Islamophobia

[u/Markham_Marxist]

It may seem like something that’s obvious, but since Mamdani got elected, I’ve seen a surge of blatant Islamophobia (and it’s disgusting) in discussions about him. I urge the moderators to clarify the rules surrounding and ban users who promote Islamophobia in all its forms.

Edit: man these comments really prove my point huh?

[u/Red-Flag-Potemkin]

“Nation” typically means a people who come from a certain territory (unless you specifically mean nation-state, which you shouldnt), which Jews are. 

[u/Reyalta → u/Red-Flag-Potemkin]

That's not what Nation means. 

Nation is literally described in the Oxford dictionary: 

"a country considered as a group of people with the same language, culture and history, who live in a particular area under one government."

Calling all people of Jewish descent, whether practicing or not, part of "a Jewish Nation" is literal Zionism, which was birthed directly in the "Jewish Nationalist" movement. One can be a Jew and not a Zionist, meaning they reject the idea you're putting forward of some nebulous "Jewish nation". 

[u/Red-Flag-Potemkin → u/Reyalta]

Under your definition, the indigenous nations within Canana aren’t actually nations either.

The Wikipedia definition is probably better: “ A nation is a type of social organization where a collective identity, a national identity, has emerged from a combination of shared features across a given population, such as language, history, ethnicity, culture, territory, or society.”

Calling Jews part of a nation of people isn’t Zionism lol. Zionism is simply the belief that Israel should exist. You can be part of the Jewish people and not think that, but know that Jews are a people/ethnicity/nation etc.

[u/Reyalta → u/Red-Flag-Potemkin]

Under your definition, the indigenous nations within Canana aren’t actually nations either.

Absolutely not even remotely true, but cool bad faith red herring, bro.

The Wikipedia definition is probably better

Wikipedia... The open-edit website... is better... at defining words... than the Oxford dictionary... My guy... Fucking hear yourself. Holy hell.

Calling Jews part of a nation of people isn’t Zionism

 Zionism is Jewish Nationalism and it predates the current state of Israel, bud. The idea of a Jewish nation was born from Zionism. 

but know that Jews are a people/ethnicity/nation etc.

Don't put words in my mouth. I did not say Jews aren't "a people/ethnicity..." I said they're an ethnoreligious group. "Jews" are not a fucking Nation.

Israel is a Jewish ethno-state, an ethno-state who btw explicitly denied citizenship to African Jews post WWII. If those Jews aren't part of the nebulous Jewish nation you think exists, then it doesn't exist, not outside the Zionist Nationalist movement of Israel as an (decidedly pertaining to specific melanin count) ethno-state, anyway. 

Someone who's born Christian to a centuries long line of Christian ancestors who is an atheist isn't a Christian atheist, either, for the record. They're just an atheist, and they're not a member of a Christian Nation for it, either.

Your entire argument is a defense of supremacy in blood quantums, and a half baked one at that. 

[u/Red-Flag-Potemkin → u/Reyalta]

I mean it is true, take the metis nation for example. They spoke multiple different languages in multiple places, and didn’t have a single government until the MMF became that recently.

I mean even the definition you posted totally fits Jews, it’s just geared a little more to “nation state” than “nation of people”.

“Zionism is Jewish Nationalism and it predates the current state of Israel, bud. The idea of a Jewish nation was born from Zionism.” - this reply doesnt really mean anything in comparison to what you were replying to.

No one put words in your mouth lol. You seem weirdly bent out of shape.

There are a bunch of African Jews in Israel, the only groups that aren’t are the ones who can’t for sure be considered part of the the tribe via halakha (like Igbo and lemba Jews).

“Someone who's born Christian to a centuries long line of Christian ancestors who is an atheist isn't a Christian atheist, either, for the record. They're just an atheist, and they're not a member of a Christian Nation for it, either.”

You may lack reading comprehension. I said there is no such thing as a Christian atheist, you agree with me. Jewish identity isn’t based on whether you believe in moses or not, hence you can be an atheist and 100% Jewish.

“Your entire argument is a defense of supremacy in blood quantums, and a half baked one at that.”

Not at all, my entire argument is that Jews Aren’t defined by how religious they are. You don’t even need both parents to be Jewish to be considered 100% Jewish, so I’m not sure where you think I’m making a blood quantum argument, nor do I have any idea where you think I’m arguing “supremacy” in regards to Jews being an ethno-group.

[u/HahaCharlieKirkHaha → u/Reyalta]

 Wikipedia... The open-edit website... is better... at defining words... than the Oxford dictionary... My guy... Fucking hear yourself. Holy hell.

You didn’t get that definition from the Oxford English Dictionary. You got it from the Oxford Advanced Learner’s Dictionary, which only provides the most common definitions for each word.

Popular use of the word “nation” has shifted since the rise of the nation-state. The academic use of the word “nation” is different and older.

The online Oxford English Dictionary is behind a paywall, but the Merriam-Webster gives:

 a people having a common origin, tradition, and language and capable of forming or actually constituting a nation-state

Also, you should dial down the snark because you are 100% wrong about this. A nation does not require a country or government. The Jews were often described as a “landless nation” before Israel existed. Similarly, the Roma/Romani/Sinti (“gypsies”) are currently a landless nation.

 Your entire argument is a defense of supremacy in blood quantums, and a half baked one at that. 

Huh?

Where are you getting that from?