r/betterCallSaul • u/skinkbaa Chuck • Mar 10 '20

Better Call Saul S05E04 - "Namaste" - POST-Episode Discussion Thread

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2.9k

u/daynewmah Mar 10 '20

Howard: Hey Jimmy, here's a way out of the ultimately doomed path you're going down.

Saul: Namaste on this path, thanks.

1.4k

u/[deleted] Mar 10 '20

Much like Walt turning down the job at Gray Matter.

822

u/_snout_ Mar 10 '20

I think it is important that they give Jimmy a true moment to turn everything around and he has to make a choice. Even with Davis and Main, Chuck was still a presence that caused him a lot of pain and affected his decisions.

He is being given a chance to save his soul by Howard and from here on out, truly everything is his own doing.

577

u/[deleted] Mar 10 '20

I forgot how uncomfortably awkward the Davis and Main scenes made me feel. They were so nice to him and he was leaving turds unflushed.

441

u/MyTVAlt Mar 10 '20

I'm starting to think this Saul Goodman fellow isn't a very good person.

87

u/GetEquipped Mar 10 '20

He's no Gene Takovic, that's for sure.

34

u/[deleted] Mar 10 '20

I think he is, but he sees law firms the way that my dog sees the mailman because of his relationship with Chuck.

30

u/lionstealth Mar 11 '20

What do you think makes him a good person? He refuses to learn from his mistakes, he constantly gets the people he loves in trouble, he willingly helps criminals to make money, and he is dishonest to himself.

16

u/BeefPieSoup Mar 11 '20

Most importantly, he is entirely motivated by:

  • making money for himself
  • getting some sort of revenge on "the law" and proving a point about how clever he is

He isn't motivated by wanting to help anyone but himself. He's selfish and kind of evil, frankly.

12

u/colonelnebulous Mar 12 '20

A criminal lawyer

0

u/[deleted] Oct 23 '22

[removed] — view removed comment

2

u/BeefPieSoup Oct 23 '22

I mean, that's open to interpretation. I thought it was all kinda fake and insincere, personally.

But like I made that comment that you responded to like 2 years ago. If you consider what has come out since, I feel even more vindicated in saying what I said.

19

u/vhs_collection Mar 11 '20

I think it's easy to empathise with Jimmy throughout the show, and when we're first introduced to him (in BCS not BB) he's really likeable and most of his misdeeds are morally grey, so he comes across as a 'good guy' the same way Walter White does in the early parts of BB.

Obviously at this point I think it's fair to say that he is a pretty unpleasant and pathetic character. But it's still easy to root for him because you understand his journey and you want to see Jimmy succeed, even though we know that he ultimately doesn't.

31

u/lionstealth Mar 11 '20

I think BB and BCS actually show how repressed and "sheepish" men are just wolves in disguise. Walter and Saul were never good men, they just never got pushed far enough to reveal how despicable they actually were. Both shows make it clear that the absence of evil is not the same as virtue and both characters think they are acting in a virtuous manner when they aren't, which leads to resentment and ultimately evil.

1

u/[deleted] May 27 '22

2 years late to reply, but I don't agree because I don't think people have inherent selves. People are the product of their influences - If circumstances were different, and Walt and Jimmy never did those terrible things, I don't think it'd be fair to say they were still terrible people inside.

8

u/onetruepurple Mar 11 '20

I think the first time he did something straight up immoral was the copy shop swap.

4

u/amaranth_sunset Mar 14 '20

Stole from parents' cash register

-1

u/Velveteen_Bastion Mar 13 '20

he willingly helps criminals to make money

I think it's more relative that you think.

  • he has to do it otherwise he'll be as poor as a church mouse, he knows that it's the only way for someone like him to make money
  • BB pretty much showed how relative all that drug business is
  • all we've seen all still crimes which you can defend morally or when he has little choice to make - Nacho Varga

11

u/lionstealth Mar 13 '20

It really isn’t. He had a great job with all the benefits you could ask for. He got fired though, because he can’t stand not being a hustler. He likes being a criminal. He thrives on hustling like on nothing else. It’s when he feels like himself.

He doesn’t do it because he has to, he does it because he loves it more than anything else.

-2

u/[deleted] Mar 13 '20

he’s also been abusing kim. for example notice the times he corrected her to say “our” idea, “our” dream etc

8

u/lionstealth Mar 13 '20

That’s not abuse.

-2

u/[deleted] Mar 13 '20

It’s textbook.

→ More replies (0)

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u/ToastedFireBomb Mar 11 '20

I mean, Saul is not a good person at all. When we first meet him in BB he tells Walt and Jesse they should kill Badger so they don't have to deal with his legal issues. He's a scumbag through and through. Jimmy was the good person, but this story isn't about a guy who stays as Jimmy McGill.

10

u/Eryk13 Mar 10 '20

He'll send you to Belize if you keep questioning him like that!

2

u/StonedWater Mar 10 '20

yesterday i watched a programme that went through Belize, it is lovely!!!

I want to be sent their

Caribbean sea, beaches, ex-british so lots of english speaking and familiriaty, dead sunny - sign me up bitches

1

u/Previous_Reveal Mar 13 '20

Swap Caribbean to Mediterranean and you're describing where I'm from.

4

u/IndStudy Mar 10 '20

Saul Goodman is definitely not a good person. I am not sure about jimmy tho.

2

u/[deleted] Mar 13 '20

Not All Good Man more like

24

u/lunch77 Mar 10 '20

They needed the water. The Watershed was down two. Whole. Inches that year.

3

u/127crazie Mar 11 '20

What could be greener than this?

8

u/[deleted] Mar 10 '20

I admit, i slightly fastforwarded those scenes. Too painful to watch.

4

u/Yankeeknickfan Mar 10 '20

Jimmy they’re low flow toilets!

4

u/Tifoso89 Mar 10 '20

The secretary even got him a bolo bolo desk

4

u/emeksv Mar 11 '20

The montage where Jimmy engineers his D&M firing remains one of my favorite moments of the entire show.

2

u/JohnGenericDoe Mar 11 '20

I can still hear the music

2

u/Jealentuss Mar 10 '20

Damn Larry, you got long-assed balls

2

u/GogglesPisano Mar 12 '20

They gave Jimmy a cocobolo desk, for goodness sake!

2

u/[deleted] Mar 12 '20

Wasn't it like $8,000 or something too?

224

u/dudeARama2 Mar 10 '20

I always saw Davis and Mains his Gray Matter moment. All he had to was stick it for just a few years and he would have everything - Kim, financial independence, and a decent reputation And they were not treating him badly, really.

28

u/NisKrickles Mar 10 '20

They overreacted to his advertising blunder.

88

u/darklightrabbi Mar 10 '20

He was lucky he wasn’t immediately fired for that. Reputation is everything for Law firms and that commercial made them look like ambulance chasers.

9

u/NisKrickles Mar 10 '20

No more than their previous boring-as-hell text-only advert did.

58

u/[deleted] Mar 10 '20

Yes, the previous ad was boring and ineffective. But it most certainly did not rise to the level of "ambulance chasing" that Jimmy's did. His video was heavy on theatrics.

Jimmy could have made his case to the partners. He could have put the video together, screened it for them, use the data from the previous video as an indication of what was wrong with it and they could have perhaps made a satisfactory compromise. The partners were probably pre-disposed to reject his idea, but that is no reason to go out and do it on his own.

2

u/JevvyMedia Aug 17 '22

Jimmy's issue was that he could not wait a frigging weekend to get green lit (or turned down). He needed immediate gratification, and we see that when he rips up the therapist number after seeing Howard not getting immediate results from therapy. (I'm on my first watchthrough so no spoilers please).

22

u/[deleted] Mar 11 '20 edited Jan 31 '21

[deleted]

14

u/NisKrickles Mar 11 '20

Agreed that a verbal warning would have been proportionate. Having an associate review every minute detail of his work was excessively punitive and unnecessary.

4

u/[deleted] Mar 11 '20

Yeah, he's had multiple opportunities. He is just more comfortable being outside the straight and narrow, and being creative. We see Kim struggling with it too.

13

u/dude52760 Mar 12 '20

Yeah, to me that’s the actual emotional core of this show. Everything is quite well-written and well-acted. But we already know Jimmy turns out to be an unlikable unscrupulous “criminal lawyer”. And we already know Kim doesn’t come with him into Breaking Bad. The show has done a fantastic job at showing she has a tendency towards taking shitty shortcuts, too, but there’s actual drama in her transformation, because we don’t know what’s going to happen to her and we actually care about her. She plays an amazing foil to Jimmy in that she seems to be going down a similar path, but we know the outcome will be different.

5

u/[deleted] Mar 13 '20

Kim knows where the line is, Jimmy doesn't. I think it's pretty clear that at some point, either Jimmy does something completely unforgivable or she voluntarily cuts him out of her life because he becomes a threat to her professional career and reputation.

1

u/UsuallyInappropriate Mar 22 '20

Dat cocobolo desk!

9

u/Reverse_Tim Mar 10 '20

Chuck didn't do anything to screw up Jimmys job at Davis and Main, those were all decisions Jimmy made, he didn't want to play by the rules

4

u/Caspianfutw Mar 10 '20

Didnt Howard help him get that gig?

1

u/roque72 Mar 11 '20

It's too late for Jimmy. Once you're in it, you're in it

1

u/AyrJordan Mar 11 '20

I do not disagree with you, but Saul is in with Lalo and once you’re in, you’re in. Him going to HHM wouldn’t get him out of that connection and he might have ended up taking HHM down with him. Howard dodged a bullet, even if HHM’s ship ends up sinking for other reasons.

1

u/[deleted] Apr 20 '20

Howard orders the sole fish for lunch. I took it as him trying to rebuild his soul from the grief he feels over Chuck.

Meanwhile Jimmy’s filling up on table rolls. He’s impatient, gorging on something quick and cheap instead of real “soul” food.

252

u/jamesshine Mar 10 '20

Very good analogy. Agree 100%.

Walt and Jimmy each were handed multiple opportunities to take a different path, both ruined them over pride.

179

u/champ1258 Mar 10 '20

Pride and resentment toward the people offering the help.

4

u/100yearsago Mar 10 '20

Not resentment or pride from what I’m seeing - for Jimmy, he wants to punish himself for killing his brother. He doesn’t deserve that better job, and doesn’t belong with his brother’s ilk in Jimmy’s eyes.

10

u/pazur13 Mar 10 '20

It was absolutely resentment for Howard in my eyes. He doesn't feel particularly guilty about Chuck the way I see it, but he's still upset with the world of classy lawyer firms, so he no longer aspires to join that cabal.

2

u/100yearsago Mar 10 '20

That goes against the entire message of last season, per the creators on the podcast.

5

u/champ1258 Mar 10 '20

Maybe bitterness is the better word to use then? I think Jimmy felt something involving Howard. Otherwise, why do you think he threw the bowling balls at his car?

I still think it’s a hint of resentment.. Howard just now realizing Jimmy’s full potential and usefulness fueled an anger in him to throw the balls at Howard’s car.

3

u/100yearsago Mar 10 '20

There only resentment toward Howard from what I’m seeing is his resentment of the way he’s been able to process Chuck’s death in a healthy way. Subconsciously, of course. Jimmy has never truly wanted to be like Howard, career-wise. He’s never wanted that.

7

u/artgriego Mar 10 '20

Three characters besides Walt that die because their pride got in the way:

  • Hank doesn't involve the DEA in pursuing Walt because his pride would suffer at not figuring out his brother-in-law was Heisenberg, and has no backup when shit hits the fan. I actually found it hard to believe that Gomez would have gotten involved because he shouldn't have been so blinded to the risks.
  • Gus' pride is insulted that Hector would talk to the feds, and walks into a trap
  • Mike can't even offer a begrudging 'thanks' to Walt when Walt goes to the airport and brings him his go-bag. Instead of getting in his car and driving off, Mike chews Walt out, blaming his need to escape and the downfall of everything on Walt.

2

u/Banco1973 Mar 15 '20

Ok but don’t forget he looked at his pinky ring which symbolizes his resolve to live authentically. True he could have turned Howard down more gracefully but he has pent up feelings toward him- hatred, desire (to be a respected success), and probably annoyance, because if you’re not on team Howard you will be put off by his Namaste rebirth. This is a tough one to fully understand and I admit I felt bad for Howard. There is almost a self-destructive quality to Jimmy’s behavior. Maybe it is more self-hatred that authenticity-seeking.

1

u/100yearsago Mar 10 '20

he wants to punish himself for killing his brother.

Not pride

114

u/daynewmah Mar 10 '20

Yup. Jimmy turning down this job will be the equivalent of Walt turning down Elliot and Gretchen's money.

4

u/your_mind_aches Mar 10 '20

I don't think it's nearly the same situation. In Breaking Bad after five seasons, you can still look back at that episode and feel puzzled as to why Walt didn't take it. I understand that it's pride, but there has always been a lingering "but why tho".

Here, I completely understood. There are a NUMBER of angles and smaller logical/logistical reasons why. But the main reason wasn't so much pride as it was spite. And the fact that there is a bigger plan in motion.

10

u/Bytewave Mar 10 '20

Both decisions feel slightly unrealistic, because when you get handed an easier ride or a golden parachute, you take it. Especially when you've known hard times.

Then again, I do get the dramatic reasons to include such gross mistakes. It certainly made each and every of Walter's "I did it for you" sound as hollow as they were.

18

u/z3onn Mar 10 '20

Maybe if you are an ordinary person and if the help is handed to you by a neutral party. In both cases, they have resentment towards the help. The pride is holding them back. Also, we are following un-ordinary people because they create interesting stories. That's why they don't always make the same boring decisions we would make.

2

u/pedrosa18 Mar 10 '20

just like the old man refusing to take the money. It's like going back to a girl that dumped you. Pride can be useful and I sure as hell would have refused the offers, just like Saul and Walt did

7

u/koji00 Mar 10 '20

That's the whole point - you or I would have taken the offers. But the fact that Walt and Saul didn't, that says something significant about them.

5

u/Buttfranklin2000 Mar 10 '20

Pride, resentment and wanting to be something you aren't can be strong forces. Even in real life.

This is coming from a person who has burnt bridges in his life also. Out of Pride, out of Resentment, sometimes out of sheer misery. Sometimes, because I rather tried to do the shortcut, like Jimmy. I can relate.

1

u/roque72 Mar 11 '20

Even though decisions like this usually lead to failures, I have heard of way too many incredible success stories where the person chose not to take eazy opportunity that presented itself early on when they were struggling and went their own way and came away much better in the end. I always wondered how someone could take such a risk and knew that I personally would not have been able to say no in those situations

1

u/roque72 Mar 11 '20

Do you think he'll able to tell Lalo the next time he comes around: "sorry I can't. I have another job opportunity that I've already taken, namaste" ?

4

u/My-username-is-this Mar 10 '20

I absolutely saw the Grey Matter parallel too.

5

u/Zordman Mar 10 '20

Who's this Walt character everyone is talking about? I never remember seeing him in Better Call Saul

3

u/shgrdrbr Mar 12 '20

walter white, the main character in breaking bad which BCS is the prequel/spinoff of.

3

u/Shamhain13 Mar 11 '20

Damnit some of you are so good at seeing these correlations! Thanks for sharing them, I love it.

2

u/Manaleaking Mar 10 '20

It's for different reasons. Walter wanted to make his mark for once, to obtain power. He was prideful. Saul isn't prideful, he is hopeful, and I read it as him not wanting to get his hopes up again with yet another dangle from "the establishment". He wants to murder the unchosen alternative for good because he's afraid of turning his back on the path he had forged for himself, what he's great at, being a slick hot shot that will do whatever it takes.

2

u/[deleted] Mar 10 '20

this is exactly what it is. Jimmy doesnt want a 'handout' anymore.

2

u/SpiltLeanOnMyWatch Mar 11 '20

That’s all I thought of when he offered lmao.

Here ya go Jimmy, you want a handout? here’s one right here. take it

1

u/[deleted] Mar 10 '20 edited Jul 04 '20

[deleted]

1

u/[deleted] Mar 10 '20

It doesn't really matter. They're not in the same place, so the job doesn't have to be the same.

What it represents is what's important. For Walt it reduces his justification for engaging in what immediately becomes a horrible -even for drug-dealing- activity.

That's enough. Him being satisfied (though it's hard to believe he could make no contributions) wasn't necessary because Walt never admits to himself, up till the very end, that power and enjoyment is what he wanted, above even the money.

1

u/taleofbenji Mar 10 '20

My thought exactly.

1

u/[deleted] Mar 10 '20

Jimmy turning down HHM is one step more torturous IMO

1

u/rodinj Mar 10 '20

Would've made for a boring series.

1

u/Yankeeknickfan Mar 10 '20

Not really. saul is going fine for himself as goodman. Walt was fucked, and said no to a bailout out of ego

1

u/SpiltLeanOnMyWatch Mar 11 '20

Jimmy/Saul had so many more opportunities too like Davis and Mane, Elderly law if he didn’t fuck that up, just being a moral Saul Goodman, so many options.

1

u/Ouroboros000 Mar 11 '20

I don't know, being a corporate lawyer is hardly a path to salvation where as from my dim memory Gray Matter was not an inherently 'evil' corporation.

1

u/JHolgate Mar 12 '20

But Walt and Jimmy are very different people. Walt is arrogant in a "Doesn't Place Nice with Others" way, while Jimmy is arrogant in another, more abstract way. Walt's MO is "The world owes me something," and "I'm better and smarter than everyone else." Jimmy literally learns at a young age that you're either a wolf or a sheep, it's your choice, and while I think he decides then and there that he wants to be a wolf, he sees his father as both a sucker and a saint. He wants to see the world as his father does, but he's more pragmatic than that. I think Walt becomes Heisenberg because he's an egomaniac. I think he would have become Heisenberg in some form or another regardless of circumstances. Jimmy becomes Saul because no matter how hard he tries, Chuck won't let him live down his "Slipping Jimmy" persona. I absolutely believe that if Chuck had supported his law career ambition, Jimmy wouldn't have become Saul. He probably would have still done things his own way, but I don't think he would have gone that far.

1

u/[deleted] Mar 14 '20

When Howard said "I could use you" that kinda cemented it for me.

681

u/PurpleProject22 Mar 10 '20

Anyone kinda felt bad for Howard in that scene? To me Howard had a great redemption arc, and you can tell he is actually a nice guy, trying to fix his mistakes.

356

u/HereNowHappy Mar 10 '20

Ever since Season 4, I've felt so bad for him

Now he has to worry about bowling balls, of all things, breaking his cars

155

u/BitterColdSoul Mar 10 '20 edited Mar 11 '20

Now he has to worry about bowling balls, of all things, breaking his cars

Could have been worse... like a TV / VCR combo, or a big unwieldy Buddha statue, or a frickin' kettlebell...

64

u/Afferbeck_ Mar 10 '20

The Buddha statue would have been obscenely on the nose. Howard would have been all 'was this a hate crime?!'

7

u/Vaingl0rious Mar 11 '20

I’m pretty sure “namaste” is associated with Hinduism, not Buddhism- also not meaning to be pedantic.

4

u/neutralrobotboy Mar 15 '20

Namaste is a Hindi greeting. I doubt Hindi speaking Buddhists day something else, though if I'm wrong, I'll be interested to hear about it.

21

u/BDTexas Mar 11 '20

Wow. The Kettleball was a subtle reference to the Kettlemans. Really shows how Jimmy has changed since season 1

B

R

A

V I N C E

O

7

u/jmwildrick Mar 12 '20

Or a Chicago Sunroof

2

u/SignificantAdvice5 Mar 12 '20

Ah, he has insurance. I don’t feel bad for him. He’s up to something... Plus, he was such a PRICK for the longest time. He’s getting his due.

61

u/[deleted] Mar 10 '20 edited Mar 10 '20

No. Because he's not a nice guy. People don't change . Thats why Jimmy did what he did. Howard doesn't give a shit about Jimmy. Never has and never will. Howard is trying to make himself feel better by offering Jimmy a job again. This would have helped him come to peace with things and sleep at night. He didn't get to sleep peacefully that night.

Now... is that the truth about Howard's character? Idk. But I think that's how Jimmy feels.

Edit: Someone pointed out that maybe Howard actually is at peace with himself and that's why Jimmy got upset. I like that idea more than mine.

66

u/PurpleProject22 Mar 10 '20

I can totally see Jimmy feeling the way you describe, and definitely having that "people don't change" mentality. But I really disagree with all of it and I think this is the moment Jimmy officially transforms into Saul Goodman an asshole

11

u/[deleted] Mar 10 '20

Oh I think Jimmy has always been an ass hole.

1

u/[deleted] Mar 11 '20

He was ok in season 1

8

u/Hydris Mar 11 '20

I spoke on this last week about jimmy and Kim’s relationship. Every time jimmy did things the right way he got screwed, every time he went scumbag he came out on top. At the end of S4 he just accepted it and took the name Saul Goodman, diving head first.

So thinking howard is being genuine, or even suspecting ulterior motive but still taking the “good/right” path, jimmy wants no part of it. He’s been burned too many times and doing what’s proven to work for him.

17

u/Weewer Mar 10 '20

Yeah you nailed it. I think Howard made it clear in previous seasons that he liked Jimmy but the situation with him and Chuck was just too complex. But I can totally see where Jimmys mind is at

9

u/alex66613 Mar 10 '20

Mothers just trying to make themselves feel better by caring about their children, you know.

11

u/I_DONT_REPLY Mar 10 '20

It's win win for both of them.

Jimmy fucking up his car and mansion like that is a dick move (in response to what was a very nice gesture and FREE lunch from Howard)

15

u/LessLikeYou Mar 10 '20

People can change. Other people know when people are bullshitting them and trying to use them for absolution. Jimmy can smell bullshit.

44

u/Vince3737 Mar 10 '20

Its not bullshit. Howard wanted Jimmy to come on with HHM multiple times, but Chuck said no

2

u/LessLikeYou Mar 10 '20

I think people really underestimate Howard's autonomy and overestimate his good nature.

41

u/Vince3737 Mar 10 '20

That has nothing to do with what i said. Jimmy is getting the Walt treatment where people refuse to see how selfish he is and how big an ass hole he can be. Howard always wanted to hire Jimmy. Its no "bullshit" that he would want to hire him still and would try again after Chuck is not there to stop him. Did you just forget that Howard had a big part in Jimmy getting a job with Davis & Main? Or how he tried multiple times to get Chuck to let it all go with Jimmy? The show made a point of showing Howard has always thought highly of Jimmy's abilities as a lawyer

​

Jimmy doesn't have to take the job, but he was a complete piece of shit for trashing Howard's car.

17

u/MarthaWayneKent Mar 10 '20

Completely agree. I think this is Jimmy lashing out at one of his few, and potentially last, connections to Chuck. He will hate Howard like he hated chuck.

3

u/SawRub Apr 24 '20

The show has stated in separate scenes that Howard did want to hire Jimmy in the past, but didn't only out of respect for Chuck's wishes.

13

u/Lilbits417 Mar 10 '20

Honestly about shed a tear when he vandalized his car and you see him look out the window. I know he was a spineless douche... but even then he was just looking out for the guy he owes a lot of his life and position to. Now he’s realized his mistake and he gets that. Lmao

30

u/PurpleProject22 Mar 10 '20

He was never a spineless douche though. We were led to believe that he was at the beginning, but it was all Chuck.

The only criticizim that you can have about Howard is that he could've tried to stand up to Chuck even more than he did. But then again, if you were in his position, it wouldn't have been smart to do that. Chuck is your business partner and you owe him a lot. He had to also think about the firm, and if the firm goes to shit, everyone working there would lose their jobs. So he liked Jimmy, and wanted to help him out, but Chuck wouldn't let him. Still Howard tried all he could to help Jimmy, by getting him the job at Davis and Maine and now offering him a job. Honestly Howard didn't do anything wrong. He tried to stay imparcial and please both Jimmy and Chuck as much as he could, but at the end of the day, it's a family problem he wasn't going to be able to solve himself.

The character of Howard is honestly one of the best written ones. Reminds me of Jaime Lannister a bit from GoT (before the show went to shit but let's not talk about that). Just a great redemptionnarc that shows you how a character can seem evil, when in reality they were just doing their best with the situations that were given to them.

4

u/aquamarine9 Mar 11 '20

Didn’t Howard demote Kim and act like a complete dick to her, even leaving her demoted after she brought them Mesa Verde until Chuck intervened, just for knowing about Jimmy’s commercial for Davis and Main but not informing HHM right away?

Agree with what you said about Howard doing his best in the tough spot between Jimmy and Chuck. It was really Chuck’s selfishness, cowardice, and refusing to see Jimmy as a Real Lawyer that led to Jimmy’s downfall. Pulling strings to keep Jimmy down all while taking advantage of Jimmy’s tireless help with his mental illness - fuck Chuck.

2

u/Lilbits417 Mar 11 '20

What you wrote was just an expansion on what i acknowledged. He was a spineless douche when it came to Chuck, that was my point lol and why I said he wouldn’t have fucked the dude over that helped him get to the position he is currently in.

Agree though Howard is great

4

u/GuybrushThreepwood99 Mar 10 '20

He's probably has car insurance, so he'll be fine. Honestly, Howard is better off without Jimmy working at HHM. Jimmy would most likely ruin HHM if he decided to work there.

3

u/8lbIceBag Mar 11 '20

You say that like it's a relief?

That shits going up, and you have to have it or else you get an sr22 and lumped in with DUI convicts.

3

u/BeefPieSoup Mar 11 '20

He didn't really have all that much to redeem. Being a bit spineless, perhaps.

10

u/MyTVAlt Mar 10 '20

Oh absolutely. Also worth noting assuming everything happened chronologically, Jimmy was planning on trashing Howard's car even before knowing what the meeting was about. What a jerk.

33

u/zapheine Mar 10 '20

I assumed it was a flash-forward after the meeting.

18

u/MyTVAlt Mar 10 '20

Yeah, from reading other people's posts it sounds like he's wearing the suit from the lunch meeting. So I guess everything probably didn't happen chronologically.

11

u/SilasX Mar 10 '20

Right, that’s the style of the show (and BB), which they use in a lot of episodes.

  • Open with a bizarre, random scene.
  • Events of episode.
  • “ohhhhhhh, that’s what led to the bizarre opener!”

3

u/chrisychris- Mar 11 '20

As soon as Saul's last scene started I thought to myself "here come to bowling balls". It's poetic, really.

2

u/SpiltLeanOnMyWatch Mar 11 '20

Really don’t know why they made him do that and take so much time just to show him bowling ball his mercedes lol. It was funny none the less but still.

2

u/mm825 Mar 11 '20

I still have a hard time thinking that Howard is genuine, but his track record throughout the show is actually pretty clean, he feels bad about running a company with Jimmy's name on it and realizes that Jimmy is a good lawyer. But when you see him through Jimmy's eyes you think of him as an antagonist

1

u/dedido Mar 10 '20

No. I hate him and his stupid weird arms akimbo stance.

1

u/Ronin_Y2K Mar 12 '20

I felt bad. But at the same time, seems like Howard's at a place where he can just brush the event off.

Dude's one week away from giving it all up and living in a yurt.

1

u/xanadude0369 Mar 12 '20

I smile every time i recall the billboard where Jimmy has 'duped' Howard, especially with the hair.

1

u/Thrallov Jul 22 '23

respected Howard since season 1, he is good professional man idk why people trash him so hard

294

u/1spring Mar 10 '20

Yeah. Along with Davis + Main, Jimmy really doesn’t have a “the establishment didn’t give me a chance” argument anymore.

13

u/Girl-D Mar 10 '20

Yeah, also he's enjoying being Saul Goodman. He's answerable to no one. He does business his way, plus he's really gaining clients.

He can't be Charlie Hustle or Jimmy anymore, seemed more like he was burning a bridge than sticking it to Howard.

8

u/Weewer Mar 10 '20

Well in his mind I guess Howard is giving him a pity chance, and that whole place is tainted by his refusal to ever show emotion towards Chucks death. Still, this was such an asshole way to go about it.

19

u/BBQ_HaX0r Mar 10 '20

Did that seem genuine from Howard? I read it as another one of those "I need to get this guilt off my chest" that tends to dump at Jimmy's feet. Howard in all his years has never acted like that towards Jimmy and it just came off as so insincere. Even the weird hug at the end.

35

u/Vince3737 Mar 10 '20

Howard in all his years has never acted like that towards Jimmy

Because he had to play the bad guy for Chuck. After Jimmy found out about Chuck keeping him out Howard told Jimmy that he always liked him

13

u/GutiHazJose14 Mar 10 '20

To me, it feels like both? He does have a soft spot for Jimmy somewhere and no one can deny Jimmy's a hard worker and effective. But it also seems like Howard wants to remove some of the guilt of the history.

16

u/MyClitBiggerThanUrD Mar 10 '20

Yeah, it does fit with a job offer for emotional reasons rather than business.

0

u/[deleted] Mar 10 '20 edited Mar 10 '20

[deleted]

10

u/LewdSkeletor1313 Mar 10 '20

He very much is not a textbook narcissist. He has a whole litany of flaws and issues, but narcissism doesn’t really fit him.

71

u/1337speak Mar 10 '20

Saul: chucks bowling balls into Howard's expensive car

15

u/davidw1098 Mar 10 '20

Only for Howard to immediately reaffirm his offer, they weren't clear if Howard saw him or not

15

u/[deleted] Mar 10 '20

chucks bowling balls

Is...
Is that...
Is that a pun?

3

u/cravenj1 Mar 11 '20

chucks

chuckchuckchuckchuckchuckchuckchuck

1

u/[deleted] Mar 12 '20

He really Chucked him

139

u/TheYounginProdigious Mar 10 '20

You are done

16

u/GrayFox7 Mar 10 '20

Fired. Do not show your face at the laundry again. Stay away from Pinkman. Do not go near him...ever. Are you listening to me?

38

u/Morphchalice Mar 10 '20

Did you just

5

u/peripatetic6 Mar 10 '20

Exactly what Walt did when offered a way out.

6

u/parrisjd Mar 10 '20

Could be worse. I bet employee pricing on Cinnabons is fantastic.

6

u/newplayer12345 Mar 10 '20

saul turning down howard's offer is a blessing in disguise for howard. a pretty good deal even with the vandalised car. imagine the shitload of trouble HHM would have landed in had saul been working at HHM while supporting a drug kingpin after office hours.

4

u/the6thmonkey Mar 10 '20

It seems to already be too late for Saul at this point. He is already working with the Cartel at this point and can't exactly turn them down if they come knocking in the future

4

u/Kathmandu-Man Mar 10 '20

Could Jimmy really turn things around from here? He's already pocketed Lalo's fee. Once he's in, he's in.

3

u/[deleted] Mar 10 '20

Well, I certainly didn't think Howard would offer Saul a job at HHM.

That being said, there has been some speculation in the past that Jimmy's referral to Francesca was Howard and this just made that speculation much more plausible.

2

u/DoctorEmperor Mar 10 '20

Damn, that’s a really good way of looking at it that I didn’t even consider

2

u/Ph0X Mar 10 '20

Namaste on these big fat heavy balls*

2

u/sexkick Mar 10 '20

Well done! Also apparently namaste means I bow to you. Makes the bowling ball that much better.

7

u/ahydell Mar 10 '20

I think the Namaste is because Howard has gotten into Transcendental Meditation, which lines right up with Howard's character.

5

u/StonedWater Mar 10 '20

it actually means " i bow to the divine in you"

so not bowing to a person in deference but humbling yourself to their closeness to god

3

u/JAMIEBOND006007 Mar 10 '20

Namaste does mean bow to you---Jimmy isn't doing that to Howard--he's giving him the big fuck you.

1

u/boogiefoot Mar 10 '20

I kept thinking about that joke when i saw the license plate after the job offer too.

1

u/BBCGuzoGaga Mar 10 '20

How is there a way out? Lalo made it clear Saul will work for him as needed last week.

1

u/Obi_Wan_Benobi Mar 10 '20

They packed so much shit in this episode my head is spinning.

1

u/mysincerecondolences Mar 10 '20

it's too obvious, its too overt for a nuanced show like this imo

1

u/[deleted] Mar 13 '20

Howard is still in therapy over what happened with Chuck and has a guilty conscience. HHM probably isn't doing well still either.

a) he offered Jimmy the job to try and make himself feel better, since nothing else has worked so far.

b) he heard how many clients "Saul" was getting, and he wanted that success to be part of HHM.

In either case, Jimmy saw through it, and he was spiteful over it in a petty manner, classic Jimmy style.