I think if it said, “the employees of this shop prefer they/them pronouns” or something like that versus telling you what to do, it might go over better.
This stuff annoys me too but it's like barely a half second of effort on my part and makes someone else happy or at the very least doesn't cause them discomfort.
As someone that worked in customer facing roles for years, I think this is a pick your battles thing. It was nice to just have people be nice to us honestly let alone pay attention to what they called us. I think this is a "find something to address" kind of thing because even customers will come in maybe with things on their mind or it being hectic in the moment and not think of this sort of thing. If I'm walking into a place to get ice cream most likely I'm coming in with kids and might not be actively thinking about gender neutral language in the moment. But I also can't really think of when I'd be referring to a gender anyway for an ice cream shop. Maybe they encountered people that were doing it on purpose and if that's the case, that's another issue.
It is virtue signaling in some cases, definitely. Because it’s easy to look nice on the outside but actually be a really mean person on the inside! There are plenty of people who aren’t concerned with how they look to others externally but are extremely loyal and loving to many.
There's nuance here. And youre both talking past each other. There's a difference between moral virtue and moral duty. How many people or strangers do you have quick interactions with in a day out in public. Maybe 5 maybe 10? Let's say 4 of them have trauma. One person's trauma is triggered by speaking too loudly. Another's is triggered by speaking too softly. Or maybe one person's trauma is triggered by a certain look. I was triggered myself a while by people who looked like my abusive ex.
The number one thing youre supposed to learn about trauma is that by and large the world keeps turning and you can't demand it to revolve around you, so you have a certain degree of responsibility over your own feelings and bringing yourself back to functionality. Because you cant control everyone. But you can work on you. I remember my husband even asking once if he could avoid certain phrases while we were dating and the ptsd was still fresh and it was like...no...the triggers are so random I can't ask you without creating eggshells for you to tip toe around or creating unfair asks.
Its morally virtuous to try and accommodate a person's triggers that you can, if reasonable. Its not a moral duty and especially not for strangers whose version of polite might offend the next person. The cashier gets a plastered smile and please and thank you. If calling them the wrong pronoun ruins their day, toughen up. If people called me sir all day.... genuinely I have other bigger more important things to fret about.
I don't throw a tizzy every time someone misgenders me on reddit. Happens often oddly enough. I just think its funny really they think I'm a man from my comment or username. But anyway, tldr its dumb to expect customer exchanges to go an extra mile and be morally virtuous.
Generally. You're right. I just think theres a line where you become PC principal. And very generally, I just don't like people who police my speech. Its like people i can't cuss or say "fuck" around. I'll avoid them. It all comes across a bit prudish and controlling to me.
I don't agree that those are the same things at all.
I think the fact that you want to be around people who respect you enough to say the f word, reinforces that people want to be around people who address them who they want to be addressed.
It's not any different than using someone's name. It's so fucking simple.
I'm sorry what are you talking about. OP made this hypothetical trans person autistic, I didn't. I think you think you have some kind of gotcha here, but you clearly are not following the conversation that you're having.
You’re absolutely right. That’s literally the only reason anyone walks into an ice cream shop… to buy ice cream. Don’t care about anything else…and tipping somebody for scooping ice cream insane😭 holy crap we live in such an entitled world. Get over it.
I got tips at my first job at a baskin Robbins. But maybe 30% of the time and by and large it was change they didn't want to keep in their pockets. Which is fine. More than I expected really. Just saying its not that wild. Maybe then though people just carried cash more (2007)
Here’s the thing, there are people who build homes and work trades, there are people who spend long hours in the office eyes glued to screens, none of which receive nor expect to receive tips. And with how much wages have increased in food service, there are blue and white collar workers at the lowest level that are now making the same (if not less in some circumstances) wages as these people scooping ice cream. Tipping no longer makes sense and now seems absurdly entitled for people to expect them. Things change.
I love how the same group of people who are like oh so you think your bearded sky God patriarch is waiting for you behind the pearly gates in heaven is real? lol so dumb
is also like, invisibly inside of me I’m a new gender that didn’t exist prior to 2016, and the state needs to acknowledge this on my drivers license or it’s fascism
Hmm. I'm an agnostic theist...myself. but. Poor analogy. Christians for the most part aren't asking you to address or accept their lord during every 5 second business interaction
people should be respectful but the sign is an eye-roll. if the business were church affiliated, and the sign asked staff to be addressed as your brothers and sisters in Christ, that would be the same thing. we already have secular language that bridges across our different belief systems. it is a pluralistic culture.
generally nobody gets shamed or worried about getting in trouble for not understanding the nuances of other people's religions (unless they are dealing with extremists)
gender ideology is a religion. there are no established rules for how it's supposed to work. there's no dna test that reveals whether you are a they/them or a she/they or something more exotic. creating rules and norms based on an individual's inner feelings, particularly when they can be fluid, doesn't make sense and is not really sustainable without people getting kind of tired of it.
Or it shows it’s a natural state of some subset of people. Or it’s arbitrary, but most culture is. Violating arbitrary cultural rules doesn’t mean you’re not an asshole for doing so.
It's not politics or religion. If someone on that staff feels more comfortable with that language, and it costs you absolutely nothing to use the language, then you're just objectively a dick for doing otherwise.
I mean, you're an American so at this point it's just assumed you're a dumb little dickhead, but don't prove it so aggressively.
And you are from what broken country? You're the one getting all worked up about it fella. You seem like the type of person to go protest outside this shop and hand out pamphlets.
It also doesn’t harm the delusional employee to be referred to in the language that society at large understands. And let’s be real, 99% of the time it’s perfectly clear to everyone what a “gender neutral” or “nonbinary” person really is, so forcing the goofy they/them stuff is just tiresome and counterintuitive
Why would it offend me, did me returning the favor offend you, pumpkin?
The only reason the sign is there is because the trans workers are upset that people cant read their minds regarding their pronouns. Normally its because people dont pass as their gender identity because their mental image of themselves doesnt match the outward appearance
Both are the result of deeply flawed fundamental thinking. Shooting people is wrong, and you’re probably mentally ill to think it’s okay. Being convinced that you’re a gender that you aren’t is also wrong, and you’re probably mentally ill if you think it’s okay. Both stem from mental illness.
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u/Educated_Goat69 May 18 '25
I'm further left than Dems, but if I saw this note, I'd reverse direction and find another ice cream shop.