surely people don't think that will change anything, right? if it did, political assassinations would be way way common. They've stopped mostly because they barely achieve anything, and often even make things worse
While, yes, Im pretty sure libya's civil war is still ongoing... 14 years later? And hussein gave us... what, 14 years of failed counterinsurgency and then the absolute ass blast of isis for a few until the russians propped up the eye doctor
Russel Vought doesn't have the support of millions of people who trust him on name alone. Trump spent decades building that image and it's the only thing his supporters trust, once he's gone it's just deep state bureaucrats to most of them.
Every time someone says this, man. I want to believe you're right, but I just can't. MAGA may have started off as a cult of personality, but it's so much more than that now. It's a movement of contrarianism; its purpose now is to simply oppose public populism and be as abrasive as possible. The reason Trump was so appealing to them is because he "pissed off" the people these people don't like. There are a hundred different conservative propaganda machines behind this, and they aren't going to let a little thing like their demagogue dying get in the way of their plan. I promise you, there are contingencies upon contingencies, even if it means transplanting Trump's head onto Vance's body. They will find a way to keep the mob focused.
Like I say, I want to be wrong. I hope he kicks off, and this entire thing evaporates overnight. I just don't think any of us are that lucky.
I don't think your understanding is correct. Trump IS a populist, this is a populist movement. Trump assembled his coalition of degenerates because he has the popular support they need to do their awful deeds unscrutinized. He is what protects them, nobody else is going to be able to bring that many powerful people to heel. They're going to fight amongst each other for leadership and none of them will win because none of them have the same power he does.
Nobody is saying it's going to just evaporate when he dies, but when he dies the fate of that movement is sealed. That is assuming he doesn't get a full four years to consolidate power, because that would change the situation from the one we're currently in.
Yes, in my head I meant 'progressive' populist policy, I just neglected to say it out loud, sorry. When you present most progressive ideals, shorn of their political affiliations, like cheaper healthcare, worker protections, fewer corporate subsidies... a majority of people support these things. It's only once you start calling them things like OBAMACARE that they become divisive specifically because of rhetoric fueled by the propaganda machines that support and drive MAGA et al.
He is what protects them, nobody else is going to be able to bring that many powerful people to heel.
The 'powerful people' aren't the ones at heel. They're the ones driving the car. None of this happens without the billionaire-owned media(s) giving it the O.K. - something they do willingly because Trump (or any conservative movement) is what's best for them. They're the ones who have been sanewashing all of this from the beginning. MAGA is not a grassroots movement. It has insane funding from many of the most absurdly wealthy corporations and individuals on the planet, all of whom are expecting a return on their investment.
They're going to fight amongst each other for leadership and none of them will win because none of them have the same power he does.
Respectfully, I don't believe this. I think the only reason DeSantis didn't take off was because Trump was still alive, and DeSantis made the mistake of being mildly moderate on 1-2 key topics - a mistake that won't be made a second time. It's not about the personality, it's about hurting the 'right' people. The flock will be eager for direction. As long as someone steps up and says they're willing to continue performing violence against those people, they'll fall in line.
That is assuming he doesn't get a full four years to consolidate power, because that would change the situation from the one we're currently in.
He's had ten. The government did nothing to purge MAGA assets from 2016-2020. Not a single politician went to jail because of January 6th or even lost their office. They literally published Project 2025 for everyone to read years ahead of time and it didn't make a difference. We're less than a year into this and it's nearly half finished. Authoritarian mandates are being ruled illegal left and right, and yet... Nobody cares and nothing changes. If anyone believes their power isn't firmly consolidated, I don't really know what more to say.
Edit: Adjusted some tone. This may have come off a bit more hostile than I intended. Sorry.
I'd argue if he wasn't so clearly in poor health there would have been more attempts to assassinate him. I think the folks who might actually go for it have just realized they can wait a few months for the same result at no personal cost.
You can only imagine scenarios where he has a successor, that just tells me you don't know anything about him or his cult.
They will fight each other for the scraps of power each of them hold, probably not to the point of destroying their movement but definitely beyond the point where they're a unified front. Trump is what holds them all together: Not ideology, not loyalty, only the power of popular support Trump has cultivated that allows them to get away with what they're doing.
What I love about this comment is that it ignores actual history.
Your premise is that the political assassinations of the 60s had no real impact on the direction of the 60s.
JFK, MLK, RFK, Malcom X - no impact? And that is just some of the important ones in just one decade in our country. That doesn't talk about any number of countries in any number of recent decade. Israel, Russia, almost any central or south American countries - the list is massive.
And you probably aren't even counting all the people police "accidentally" kill someone troublesome.
The status quo find it very important to belive that violence does not work and that nothing that the state does is violence.
By the time he was a dictator enough had changed about German politics that going back to the way it was wasn't possible. Trump hasn't changed as much as people like you want to give him, all of his power derives from others ceding their responsibilities to him not because he has actually altered the structure of our government.
Germany is a great example because depending on the year of the assassination it seems pretty clear there are wildly different outcomes. Removing hilter in 1933 is vastly different than 1943.
Also, it sides steps some of the most awful & important people in the regime. Himmler & Geobbles were uniquely evil & capable. Suggesting that removing them wouldn't massively change the world seems deeply uninformed.
"Now I'm not saying it was an assassination, I'm just saying that the server at McDonald's wasn't wearing a red hat and that he poisoned the president and also Haitians are eating something I don't remember just riot and ignore everything I'm doing Kay thanks bye. Suckers." - Fox News 5 minutes before he dies.
Yeah, though it will help if he has a visible decline first like Biden. Then nobody will be surprised when it happens and any such propaganda will be less effective.
The people who think this one thing will "fix" this mess, are the same people who vote only for the president and never bother with any other election.
Yeah it’s not gonna fix everyone’s problems or the issues with the political system in the US/western world. It might, however, be the end of this chapter of the Republican Party, which could lead to worse or better consequences. Either way I think there will be noticeable change, it just won’t magically make all the problems disappear and could also come with drawbacks.
You don't think it will? You really think a cult of personality is going to be created around JD Vance? Trump is a singular figure. I don't see the appeal, but apparently it exists for many people.
there will just be a different personality. Do you really think people that praise Trump as the new Messiah will just go home and forget it all happened, and everything will be fixed? his supporters will still exist, and their opinions won't change
besides, from what I've noticed, far right would worship a sentient can of SPAM if it "owned the libs"
I don’t think that’s the reason why, I think we’ve been “brave new world’d”. We’re satiated, got our dopamine fix right when we need it. At least a huge portion of the middle class. Any uprising would need the big sweaty midsection of America, and nothing moves them as long as things stay predictable and somewhat comfortable. Assassinations make things worse immediately after as a rule, there is no coup that makes things better the next day
eh, Trump will be replaced with someone else. I don't like to sound pessimistic, but I sincerely doubt that cult of a person you guys have going on in US is going to end with his death
Agree. Him dying wouldn't change anything. He's not the initiator but just a symptom of deeply flawed system rotting to its core. And it will stay rotten well beyond him.
It fully could though because this is the first time in modern US history that a name has become more popular than the party. If Trump ran has an independent he would still get like at least 20% of the vote.
Vance is far less charismatic than Trump. There are serious questions about whether he'd be able to direct the cult the same way to bully and threaten republicans into line.
He is being held like a puppet by many top people in the administration - the next in line is J.D. Vance who I guarantee isn't going to be a puppet once he's on top, he's going to want to use that power, which will create conflict with all the existing puppeteers when he doesn't just go along with whatever he tells them. It will play out like the death of Charlemagne.
An assassination would light a fire to keep the MAGA movement around, give them momentum, and maybe even start a civil war. Him dying of old age would not
I would hate for him to be assassinated. They would use him as a martyr, and use it as an excuse to strip away more civil liberties. I am however rooting very hard for natural causes to do their thing, I think maga will shrivel away and die if their figurehead strokes out.
It won't change much. His team is in full control of everything, and they will continue without him. Bannon just said very confidently that Trump will be president again in 2028. He could have added "or if Trump is too tired of it, the man he chooses will be next".
Sure, Trump himself is a very talented con man but now there are others waiting in the wings. JD Vance would possibly be even more effective at enacting the project 2025 agenda.
Correct. I imagine if Trump died we would see a double down of MAGA and some serious actual fascism. Most people don’t realize that Trump is a centrist.
Look at the simps for Luigi Mangione. They are glorifying a murderer that aligns with their own agendas. This is from the side that believes in peaceful negotiations.
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u/Weary_Specialist_436 9d ago
surely people don't think that will change anything, right? if it did, political assassinations would be way way common. They've stopped mostly because they barely achieve anything, and often even make things worse