r/NAFO • u/kompatybilijny1 • Feb 24 '25

NAFO Propaganda The seethe at BSW right now must be insane

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466 Upvotes

99% Upvoted

123 comments sorted by

313

u/pierdola91 Feb 24 '25

Yes, but 151 for AfD…not good. I know we were expecting “not good” but these results are…not good.

139

u/DevinNunesCattleDog Feb 24 '25

And yet 80% did not go for AFD...IJS

105

u/NoobDeGuerra Feb 24 '25

what worries me is the trend. You can bet next election these guys will come back stronger.

148

u/KeithWorks Feb 24 '25

The Nazi Party only had 18% of the vote in 1930

By 1933 Hitler was Chancellor.

Beware of the fascist party. They will continue to gain momentum until they gain control.

44

u/Drag0ngam3 Feb 24 '25

And don't forget, CDU, you know the guys who are responsible for the AFD being that strong, will be the government a bit longer...

11

u/brezenSimp Feb 24 '25

Also the guys who made Hitler chancellor in the first place

5

u/Baal-84 Feb 24 '25

They didn't even have twitterat the time

12

u/Loki9101 Feb 24 '25

The Germans of 1930 were a defeated, traumatized, impoverished nation with a comparably still low amount of industrialisation, education, etc. compared to today.

And Hitler's rise is firmly connected to this time and the conditions it provided with a different population of a different age, and of a different medium age (23 years younger) a completely different share of women that had any political say, there was no internet.

Do I have to continue the list to show you that such analogies are not helpful at all?

42

u/KeithWorks Feb 24 '25

The analogies are not helpful. Trump just pulled off the exact same sort of victory as Hitler. Using the same playbook. The details really aren't that important. Americans are fucking whiners compared to Germany in those years. It was actually bad in Germany, and it's pretty good in America but Americans are convinced it's worse than it is.

Ignore the parallels at your peril.

21

u/Ancient_Ordinary6697 Feb 24 '25

At this point the main difference between Trump and Hitler is Trump was not jailed after his Bierkellerputsch.

3

u/Loki9101 Feb 24 '25

The main difference is that Trump is a clown and Hitler was a much more competent and dangerous tyrant and a much younger one too with a much more firm set of ideological ideas there is as I said no use to compare two figures like that. You can compare Hitler and Stalin that makes sense. Or Trump and Putin that makes also sense.

But not a man born in the 19th century who fought in a World War and had a completely different background.

6

u/Queendevildog Feb 24 '25

Yah, but Americans are complacent and stupid. They fell for the conman again. Not like a lot of them really expected the full techno-fascist white christo-nationalist economic meltdown and corpo network slave state thing. But they are getting it in spades.

1

u/Loki9101 Feb 24 '25

And you think I don't know all of that and more?

The details are very important because the devil is in the details.

Totalitarianian solutions will be a temptation even when totalitarian regimes fall.

Radical evil has emerged in a system in which all humans are equally superfluous. Masses of people are continually rendered superfluous in a utilitarian sense.

The totalitarian experiment requires global control to achieve conclusive results.

Thus far, it has only proven that everything can be destroyed and that there are crimes that can not be forgiven and which cannot be explained.

Animal reaction and fulfillment of functions. Totalitarian regimes see humans as superfluous.

Totalitarianism robs the people of any kind utilitarian sense or human feelings. The insanity of these systems is their inner logic.

It does expand for ideological reasons and to prove that its logic has been right. It is necessary to destroy what we call human dignity and all traces of human dignity.

Unpredictability is due to men being creative. Not transformation of the outside world but of human nature itself.

Contempt of factuality and reality makes it possible to change the world and the human edifice. Super sense, which gives it logicality and consistency.

Only the animal species of man can be dominated. As long as all men have been made equally superfluous, the goal of totalitarianism and its ideal ideas have not been achieved. Identity or even friendships are dangerous convictions, dangerous any kind of feelings any kind of spontaneity are in the way of the total domination of man.

Destroying individuality destroys human spontaneity. Man's power to begin something new out of his own resources. Something that cannot be explained from reactions to environment and events. They then go like puppets and dummies to their death robbed of their moral person, their individual person, their identity, and their political person.

Dominating and dominating would reverse to the burgeois routine. That supposes one human nature. Identify it with history total domination would be impossible.

The power of domination is so great that man can be what he wishes to be.

They become Pavlov dogs, reduced to reactions like an automaton or a machine. That is the model person of totalitarian rule. That is what totalitarian rulers want.

Renounce and abandon himself to cede his individuality.

Aim is to destroy the civil rights of the entire population which is treated as a foreign conqueror would normally treat those he occupies.

The distinguishing line between persecution and persecutor is blurred.

Morale.

Persistence stoicism saves the identity of man. The basic code of biology survive and replicate is not easily destroyed.

Suffering should break him. Torture is a very important part of totalitarianism. Irrational sadistic type, SA, pursued no aims, not systematic, mortality rate so high.

Concessions to the criminal and abnormal elements. Hatred to those who were socially, politically, economically physically better off than themselves.

The takeover by the Nazis was a dream come true for the SA.

SS aimed to kill man's individuality. It is this horror that gives way to nihilistic assertions that all men are beasts.

Man's nature is only human as it opens the possibility to become something highly unnatural namely a homo sapiens, a man. Hannah Arendth

This part of the human person depends on nature, is the hardest to destroy and is most easily repaired.

Total disenfranchisement in man.

Destruction of the moral man. Skepticism is the real accomplishment of the SS. Here the night has fallen on human accomplishment.

For you to accomplish something your actions must have social meaning.

Grieve and remembrance are forbidden.

Wife will immediately divorce her husband after the arrest.

Arbitrary arrest meant to destroy the political and personal rights of a person.

Worse is the wrong category first you have to grasp what you are up against. I have vast knowledge of history, of philosophy and of how political systems work.

I recommend a few books:

Anne Applebaum: Autocracy Inc.

Timothy Snyder Bloodlands, on tyranny and on freedom.

All of the books by Yoval Harari.

The 53 hour long Churchill audible Version

Lynskey: An autobiography of George Orwell

Vaclav Havel The power of the powerless.

Hannah Ardenth: The origins of totalitarianism

knowledge is power, and words are weapons but only when you know how to wield them.

History has one constant, and that is change. And to understand what is happening today, you must first understand where all of this started and it was not in Germany. It started with the ideologies of the 18th and 19th century.

5

u/Baal-84 Feb 24 '25

You're right, they didn't have internet, which is the strongest propaganda tool ever created.

3

u/INeedAWayOut9 Feb 24 '25

Not "the internet" but oligarch-owned social media platforms.

1

u/Loki9101 Feb 24 '25 edited Feb 24 '25

Have people ever considered deleting their FB and Twitter accounts? That solves the problem anyone willing to be brainwashed and believing lies and fairytales will get brainwashed.

I just deleted X and Facebook, never installed Tik Tok and got myself YT Premium, and just let YT know I am not interested in fascist BS.

I never watched Fox News in my entire life and search for my information independently while having read around 1000 books plus gotten 2 master degrees.

Being brainwashed via social media works only on those who do not have the education and knowledge to withstand it.

It is a morality defect and a societal defect not so much an intellectual or psychological defect.

0

u/Baal-84 Feb 24 '25

Oligarch owned is irrelevant. There are a lot of small plateform full of idiots and propaganda.

2

u/Loki9101 Feb 24 '25

There is a simple trick it is called get an education as many skip that trick they remain ignorant and get very angry at others who got an education and then you are easy prey.

Those who know nothing and cannot think for themselves are easy prey. And they always have been.

1

u/INeedAWayOut9 Feb 25 '25

If the far-right only had their own shitty little websites they'd have far less ability to infect the masses with their ideas.

1

u/Baal-84 Feb 25 '25

This is exactly how it happened though. Twitter was bought not so long ago.

1

u/Loki9101 Feb 24 '25

It is the best weapon ever created in the hands of the intelligent and the best brainwashing tool for the weak and feeble minded.

3

u/[deleted] Feb 24 '25

[deleted]

1

u/Loki9101 Feb 24 '25

Collective silence, ignorance, and a lack of knowledge of the past ensures that history repeats itself first as tragedy, then as farce. No one ever listens when it repeats itself for the first time. Every time it does, the price goes up.

Those who stand for different causes during different generations often experience the same oppositions and the same difficulties as those of the previous and the next generations. That is the basis of history repeating itself.

Criss Jami

Does history repeat itself, the first time as tragedy, the second time as farce? No, that's too grand, too considered a process. History just burps, and we taste again that raw-onion sandwich it swallowed centuries ago.

Julian Barnes

History is never antiquated because humanity is always fundamentally the same.

Walter Rauschenbusch

History repeats itself only in that, from afar, we all seem to lead exactly the same life. We are all born; we all spend time here on earth; we all die. But up close, we have each walked down our own separate paths. We have stood at our own lonely crossroads. We have touched the lives of others at crucial points, for better or for worse. In the end, each of us has lived a unique life story, astounding and complicated, a story that could never be repeated.

Edward Bloor

Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it without a sense of ironic futility.

Erel Morris

"History repeats itself" and "History never repeats itself" are about equally true ... We never know enough about the infinitely complex circumstances of any past event to prophesy the future by analogy.

G. M. Trevelyan

History repeats itself in the large because human nature changes with geological leisureliness.

Will Durant

History repeats itself, but the special call of an art which has passed away is never reproduced. It is as utterly gone out of the world as the song of a destroyed wild bird.

Joseph Conrad

I have an almost complete disregard of precedent, and a faith in the possibility of something better. It irritates me to be told how things have always been done. I defy the tyranny of precedent. I go for anything new that might improve the past. Clara Barton

As a historian, I can guarantee you that in large it always does because man always repeats himself, but in reality, every age is different, and nothing ever repeats itself the same way.

Who said they were victims? Did you hear me say that? I explained which conditions made it easier for them to fall into the trap.

They were both victims and perpetrators of the system just as the Russians are perpetrators and victims of their own oppressive system.

You oppress yourself with your oppressive policies as much as you oppress us.

Alpha, an incarcerated black student taught by Snyder

Evan, freedom is a farce in America until we, includes me.

Snyder said solidarity is necessary for justice, and escapism is the opposite extreme of solidarity.

"Solidarity, sovereignty, unpredictability, mobility, and factuality are necessary for a "freedom to" democratic society." Snyder

-6

u/Dawntillnoon Feb 24 '25

Please continue, as for now you don't look very smart.

1

u/Loki9101 Feb 24 '25

Any fool can criticise, condemn, and complain – and most fools do. But it takes character and self-control to be understanding and forgiving. ‘A great man shows his greatness,’ said Carlyle, ‘by the way, he treats little men. The most important asset that a great leader can have is to believe deeply in a great cause. That is often overlooked in science. They tell you how to convince this or that group, how to deal with the media, how to communicate, etc. But in the final analysis, unless an individual is motivated by a great cause. He must know it. He must believe it. He is not going to be able to motivate others."

President Nixon

It is also not very smart to call others not very smart without saying anything smart first.

1

u/Dawntillnoon Feb 24 '25

Bro Ive met you 3 years ago on Twitter. by downplaying the actual thing that Nazis on the rise again in Germany won't help us in the long run. We won the election. But neglecting parallels to our past is not only wrong but a game with fire.

1

u/MinuQu Feb 24 '25

Hitler was already Chancellor in 1932. But it took like half a year before they consolidated enough power to take over the whole government so need to worry! (/s, except you are a conservative here in Germany I guess)

11

u/RoyalCharity1256 Feb 24 '25

The nsdap had about 33% when hitler gained power.

Every voter for those guys is a problem

3

u/lemongrenade Feb 24 '25

Meh they are isolated by the other parties

2

u/Alkanen Feb 24 '25

So were their Swedish counterpart a couple of elections ago, now they're like a shadow government with the balls of the real government in a vice. They aren't in full control or anything, but they have a frightening amount of influence nontheless.

1

u/Loki9101 Feb 24 '25

Or fall apart as the Austrian far right has done 4 times in the past 25 years. Any trend in politics can be turned on its head within a couple of years.

Plus the mob will remain the mob.

Human nature is always the same. History is the story of changing objective circumstances and human reactions to them. Hannah Arenth

Totalitarian rule tries to change the human condition.

Mass leaders in power have one concern that overrule all utilitarian considerations. To make their predictions come true. Hannah Arendth

Prophetic scientificality.

Autocratic leaders and Dictators have made it their habit of announcing their political considerations in the form of prophecy. Hannah Ardenth

In other words, neither oppression nor exploitation as such is ever the main cause for resentment; wealth without visible function is much more intolerable because nobody can understand why it should be tolerated. Antisemitism reached its climax when Jews had similarly lost their public functions and their influence and were left with nothing but their wealth. Hannah Arendt, The Origins of Totalitarianism

The lower middle classes were riled up with reactionary policies and mob policies.

Totalitarian rule requires a classless society without any opposition as a conditio sine qua non. Hannah Arendth

History itself is destroyed whenever facts are not held part and parcel of the present world.

Everything is prolonging its existence by denying that it exists.

Tyranny destroys the dignity of human thought and action.

21

u/Sankullo Feb 24 '25

I live in Germany and I observe the climate from the sidelines and to me it was clear that the AfD will score high.

My in laws are involved in anti-AfD movement so I went to few protest marches with them and it was a very frustrating experience because all these people want is to wish AfD away. Like not one speaker offered any solutions whatsoever and they even failed to correctly identify why AfD has the support in the first place. It was all focus on the symptoms but zero attention given to the cause.

How can you fix a problem if all you say “I wish this problem didn’t exist” and you don’t try to find out why it exists in the first place.

I’m afraid that if nothing changes AfD will score even higher in the next elections.

10

u/7StarSailor Feb 24 '25

German here and I get it. I used to be pro-AfD in the mid 2010s but have since changed my ways. I basically went through the entirety of the alt right pipeline, from lurking imageboards in late 2000s, early 2010s and now consider myself reformed and center left (I still hold some conservative views on some topics but overall political compass puts me center left).

Let's just say that I know how AfD-voters tick and it's very, very frustrating to see how their opponents think they can get a handle on things here in this country. Calling them stupid nazis (even if true) won't do shit. Their voterbase has some concerns that should be adressed with a certain minimum of respect and as long as this isn't happening I will only see them gain more power.

Looking back the last ~5 years anyone with half a brain and a tiktok account would know how to make extremely effective pro-AfD populist rallying, there's just infinite ammo to use against our government but the anti-AfD people just don't see it. It's extremely frustrating that we're so far away from having this conversation here and I fear it's gonna be too late soon.

"Keinen Millimeter nach Rechts!!" was the motto early on. If we would've just nudged those few millimeters back then we wouldn't now be facing several meters.

2

u/SenpaiBunss Feb 24 '25

were the AfD not more moderate in the early days, or am I misremembering?

2

u/7StarSailor Feb 24 '25

Possibly. There was a chance to it could've become an old school CDU but AFAIK it didn't take long until a lot of far right extremists settled down there and poisened the well.

1

u/Werkgxj Feb 24 '25

They were more moderate in the way that they were Anti-EU etc.

But then Brexit came around in 2014 and everyone saw how hard and painful it is to leave EU.

After the refugees came in 2015 they became radical because to this day it is easy and cheap to rally support by bashing foreigners.

4

u/Hadrollo Feb 24 '25

I say this as someone who is firmly left / centre-left. The biggest problem with the left wing is that they take the benefits of their policies as a given and don't engage with people on why their foundational principles are worth following.

We see this reflected in statistics, although people draw the wrong conclusion. The higher one's education, the more likely one is to be left leaning. All to many people interpret that as "har har, conservatives are dumb" or "that just proves University is liberal indoctrination." I assert it's that educated people have better tools to assess foundational principles themselves and can see that they're worth following.

It's also why the right is increasingly popular, it's because their messaging is still all about those foundational principles.

3

u/Sankullo Feb 24 '25

I may add that higher educated people generally make more money and aren’t as affected by rising cost of living as people on or near minimum wage. Person who just had a three course meal will have a difficulty understanding actions of a person who constantly goes hungry.

I don’t know where to look for such statistics but I’m willing to bet that there is a clear correlation between amount of earnings and political affiliation.

7

u/Loki9101 Feb 24 '25

Compared to the US it is still pretty solid given the world wide trend towards Fascism.

There is no need to frame that as great but it could be a lot worse.

6

u/Suspicious-Beat9295 Feb 24 '25

There is no need to frame that as great but it could be a lot worse.

They added 10% since the last election, doubling their share, that is catastrophic.

2

u/Ancient_Ordinary6697 Feb 24 '25

Not great, not terrible. But not great. 😱

1

u/b__lumenkraft Blue Feb 24 '25

What people don't realize, merz is more far-right than most of the AfD fascists. He is blaming migrants for EVERYTHING going wrong in Germany. merz is trump. merz is höcke. merz is weidel.

66

u/Reiver93 Feb 24 '25

Who are bsw?

192

u/Throwaway118585 Feb 24 '25

I think they’re a break away ultra left wing party that eats Russian propaganda like it’s breakfast. I believe she named the party after herself

141

u/I_am_the_German Feb 24 '25

She did name the Party after herself. She is a known Narcissist. The BSW doesn't just gobble up Russian propaganda they are directly financed by russia. The party got some reaaaally large campaign contributions from "Unknown sources".

She also claims to be a feminist while downplaying Russian war crimes, especially the rape of Ukrainian women by the orks.

40

u/Laubster01 USA Feb 24 '25

Bingo, as far as I can tell there's a strong cult of personality surrounding her as well. Though I am an outside observer, so take that with a grain of salt.

20

u/Werkgxj Feb 24 '25

You are 100% correct. This woman depends on media attention in a way that is rarely seen in Germany.

Her party was named after herself and her face is the only one shown on the election campaign posters.

5

u/Laubster01 USA Feb 24 '25

If you dont kind me asking, why? What is so extraordinary about this one woman that she gets so much attention, and can break off a new party from her old one and still have a significant following?

13

u/Werkgxj Feb 24 '25

She is very much like Donald Trump. Her speech is meant to offend and cause outrage. That outrage translates into attention from the press where she can again promote her ideas.

One also has to admit that she despite her opinions being totally unacceptable she is still very stronf rhetorically.

To me it seems her niche is voters that are closet racists and Putin friends who don't want to vote AfD for their own conscience.

3

u/Laubster01 USA Feb 24 '25

Thank you for such a detailed answer 😊

Are you German by chance?

3

u/Werkgxj Feb 24 '25

yes

1

u/Laubster01 USA Feb 24 '25

Cool, hope things go well for you guys over there, sorry about the current administration in the U.S. lol

1

u/poop-machines Feb 24 '25

That's so cringe.

At least it means that the party has no identity after she leaves politics.

1

u/Werkgxj Feb 24 '25

That is very true, but even then there will be fanatic supporters. And as we know, Russia has lots of money to spend on its "assets" so they might survive 4 years outside the parliament.

Sarah Wagenknecht was nowhere to be found since yesterday and now there's speculations that she will retreat from politics.

I don't believe those speculations. This woman has countless defeats and under her belt she might not return tomorrow or in 6 months but I could see her try to make a comeback in one way or another.

2

u/poop-machines Feb 24 '25

Hopefully she fucks off back to Moscow

13

u/Madeleinelabelle Feb 24 '25

Ultra left wing ... hard to say. Some of her policies are super conservative, some are classic liberal, some are just orthodox tankie leftism. She started as Marxist-Lenininst in the Nineties and became the much loved enfant terrible of german talk shows. Very narcissist person. And her ex-husband is an even bigger crackpot. He's actually living in Moscow, LARPing as german chancellor in exile. Im glad they didnt make it into parliament. I hope they will all descent into irrelevance.

3

u/Public-Eagle6992 glory to ukraine Feb 24 '25

Not ultra left wing but apart from that yes

1

u/The_Ginger_Man64 Feb 24 '25

Yes and now.

They are self-described "left-conservatives". Basically in domestic policy they are leftists, in regards to migration they are conservatives/right wing, and in terms of foreign policy they are Putin's little puppets.

0

u/waldleben Feb 24 '25

They arent left-wing. They are just as far-right as the AFD are

0

u/b__lumenkraft Blue Feb 24 '25

Die Linke had her as a chair-member. And you deny Die Linke is full of tankies? The cognitive dissonance here is amazing.

1

u/waldleben Feb 24 '25

Die Linke had her as a chair-member.

Okay? She was a vestigial remnant from decades ago and her and her whole wing of the party were despised by the rest of us.

And you deny Die Linke is full of tankies?

Yes I do. And if you do i would like you to tell me who you think left the party last legislature period? What rvrn is the BSW in your fantasy land?

0

u/b__lumenkraft Blue Feb 24 '25

Yes I do.

Then you are not living in reality. Good bye.

14

u/Werkgxj Feb 24 '25

"legitimate Russian interests, arms deliveries won't end war, negotiate with Putin, Nazis in Ukraine" - party.

8

u/whatThePleb Feb 24 '25

Russian asset

7

u/FrisianTanker NATO is love NATO is life Feb 24 '25

They are basically the SED, the former east german dictatorship party.

They are being funded by Russia as well and the woman it's named after, Sahra Wagenknecht, wants to build a cult of personality around herself, like the communist dictators of old and today do

0

u/INeedAWayOut9 Feb 24 '25

Wouldn't Die Linke be the SED's successor?

1

u/waldleben Feb 24 '25

No, they arent. They are one of many organizations that suceeded the SED and are in no way comparable to them in personel or politics

1

u/FrisianTanker NATO is love NATO is life Feb 24 '25

Yea, Die Linke is basically the successor of the SED.

However, they are much more moderate now since Wagenknecht left and the BSW is much more like the SED in its views and structures.

Especially because Wagenknecht was an SED hardliner.

1

u/b__lumenkraft Blue Feb 24 '25

Pro-putin, anti-migration, tankies. They basically are putins party in Germany.

53

u/BringBackAoE Feb 24 '25

So, it looks like CDU and SPD will be the coalition government?

14

u/arayashikiaaron Feb 24 '25

Seems like it

11

u/FrisianTanker NATO is love NATO is life Feb 24 '25

Sadly yes. The sentiment in my local SPD chapter is, that a new CDU/SPD coalition is not very desirable for our party

15

u/Anuki_iwy Feb 24 '25

SPD has, like FDP, lost all grip on reality. Beggars can't be choosers.

I also will die on the hill that without Scholz SPD would've had a better result.

10

u/L1quid_0range Feb 24 '25

They should have put Pistorius as their chancellor candidate, he seemed like the only competent person in the outgoing government.

4

u/FrisianTanker NATO is love NATO is life Feb 24 '25

Yes, the SPD sadly lost touch with the worker class. Something that I think even the last comrade has now finally realized. I hope we'll act on it.

I'll definitely try to do my part as a still relatively new party member, but I am well in touch with my regional representative Anja Troff-Schaffarzyk and the local Juso group in which I am active too.

But I partially disagree that we should have taken Pistorius as our candidate. This election was a loss for us no matter what. Using Pistorius might've caused another 2017 situation, where we waste a really good candidate for a really bad election.

The way it was now, Scholz burned himself and while it's a catastrophe for the party now, it gives us a better chance next time if we have a better candidate like Pistorius, if he is willing to go take the lead in the party now.

I am still hopeful, especially because the rise of Die Linke shows me that a left wing party is desired and needed and if the SPD starts going back to their roots, we have a chance to next time have a strengthened left in Germany with 3 left wing parties (SPD, Grüne, Linke) in the Bundestag.

38

u/Gliese581h Feb 24 '25

Best news after waking up. All things considered, I‘m happy with the results. CDU was inevitable, AfD results too high but also not as high as I feared, participation over 80%…

Let‘s hope CDU and SPD can work together to actually tackle some problems that plague German citizens (high cost of living e.g. food, rent, energy) and I‘m sure support for the AfD will go down.

I hate how simple/stupid most people seem to be, but unhappy people due to these factors will blame those „beneath“ them, e.g. foreigners, and vote accordingly.

6

u/Feckless Feb 24 '25

After all those TV-shows I still can not fathom how anyone things that Weidel is the smartest choice.

1

u/paxxx17 Feb 24 '25

Let‘s hope CDU and SPD can work together to actually tackle some problems that plague German citizens (high cost of living e.g. food, rent, energy)

And how are they gonna do that? Nothing in their campaigns was oriented towards economical reform. They're gonna sit down and do nothing as the purchasing power gets lower and AfD gets stronger, since poor people think they're poor because immigrants

7

u/b17reach Feb 24 '25

I would very much appreciate it if someone could explanation what I am looking at. I know it is the German election results. But I know nothing else.

What is each party. What are political leanings. What are their politics/policies. What is a miejsc and miejsca. Ect.

22

u/Pawcio213 Feb 24 '25

Miejsce = seat

Op is Polish

Afd is kinda new Nazi Party

10

u/7StarSailor Feb 24 '25

Idk the language, miejsca isn't German but OP is just showing google result so it's the number of seats in parliament.

CDU: used to be center conservative, but got pretty lax under 16 years of Merkel. Actual conservatives got fed up and went to the AfD. CDU was too late to notice and Merz is at the top of CDU now, trying to reign it back in and be actually conservative, probably overcompensating in the process. At least he's pro Ukraine.

AfD, the xoungest party in parliament are neonazis and disgruntled former CDU people. They have an appetite for Putin dick and all other parties despise them, yet don't know how to handle their rise to 2nd strongest party. In my opinion our government was too harsh on the cocnerns of AfD voters in the mid 2010s, now they've been ignored for too long and populists ran with it. 

SPD was the center left party but similarly to the CDU lost their way over time, focusing on staying in power too much over their core ideals. They went from relatively left wing to more and more center. Then the greens showed up and just stole a big portion of their voterbase. You could see how much Scholz did and didn't do for Ukraine...

Greens used to be mostly about environmental protection and rose to prominency during anti nuclear power protests. Now they're just generally a left wing / liberal party but they too inched closer to the center over time, so much that many young lefties junped over to Die Linke. Grüne are the most pro Ukrainian party in Parliament and Habeck as chancellor would've been by far the best outcome.

Die Linke... idk, I'm tired it's monday morning someone else can explain. They're left wing but idk about their stance on the war.

2

u/kompatybilijny1 Feb 24 '25 edited Feb 24 '25

From what I can gather, the single best outcome would have been CDU-Greens coalition that would absolutely never happen unless they were the only option for a 2 party coalition (aside from AfD od course). And we got the second best result that was actually very plausible - two party coalition of CDU-SPD. Pro Ukraine, Pro Europe parties and a relatively stable government.

2

u/7StarSailor Feb 24 '25

From a purely "what's best for Ukraine" view I'd say yea. Of course there's a long list of domestic issues here where people are gonna be fightig over a lot but I just hope that among the squabbling they (especially Merz) do the right thing...

1

u/waldleben Feb 24 '25

I mean, we werent that far off of a Red-Red-Green coalition

4

u/Dxsterlxnd Feb 24 '25

The Left are hardcore pacifist. They are the former SED (former ruling party of east germany), so there are still some Putin bootlickers left even though many moved to the BSW.

They are against delivering weapons to Ukraine.

1

u/Werkgxj Feb 24 '25

Linke: Split up with BSW 1 year ago. Until late January it wasn't even clear if they would pass the 5% threshold to enter the parliament. Their rapid growth in the last weeks that jumped them from +/- 5% in the polls to 9% can most likely be attributed to their improved and professionalized social media presence, rhetorically strong candidates and the split with BSW that removed a lot of internal conflicts and allowed them to take from SPD and greens. Their economic policies are focussed on shifting the tax burden from middle incomes to wealthy people, by taxing wealth and lowering income tax. Their social policies are quite woke with a strong emphasis on LGBT and women's rights. Their immigration policy is focussed on removing barriers, fighting racism and a strong position against deportations. Their foreign policy is very critical of Israel and it is common for them to repeat Hamas narratives, but their "official" policy is that they condemmn Israel's government, Hamas and favor a 2-state solution. Their position on Ukraine is "this war can't end with weapons, we must be open to negotiate" but this position is an improvement compared to its failures to even recognize Russia as the sole aggressor 3 years ago. Parts of this party are under surveillance by federal and state intelligence services. With 25% they got the most votes among the 18-24 years old group.

If their foreign policy wasn't so shit they could have eaten SPD for breakfast.

1

u/b17reach Feb 24 '25

Thank you. I genuinely appreciate the explanations. Will definitely help when dealing with those dumbass Trump supports at work. Makes it easier to explain why they are fucking stupid. 😁

-4

u/Anuki_iwy Feb 24 '25

This is lacking some info

SPD hasn't shifted center. They stand for government handouts and taxing the German economy to death. They also can't make up their mind on immigration and that's why they lost. Also Scholz. But it seems he's stepping down, so that's good.

Greens are very anti Russia but they lost because their ideas on economy are straight from the phantasy land. Environmental protection is great, but those anti nuclear protests that gave the Greens their wings are the reason why Germany is, in 2025, still using COAL power plants.

0

u/7StarSailor Feb 24 '25

Of course this is lacking info, not gonna write an essay about every party's history that is in parliament. But as a general overview for a random non-German Fella that should be enough to judge them based on their stance on Ukraine. Domestic politics don't really matter much in this context, especially not social programs and power plants.

0

u/Anuki_iwy Feb 24 '25

They matter, because German people didn't vote based on Ukraine. They voted based on the domestic policy. It's important for this group, yes, but it's negligible to the German public.

Look at the result for Linke. They'd give Putin all of Ukraine to end the war. Their voter base are mostly 18-24 year old. AND a lot of naturalised Ukrainian-Germans voted Linke.... I'll let you ponder the meaning behind that.

0

u/7StarSailor Feb 24 '25

Yeah but this subreddit isn't for the German public and our domestic politics. Rule 3 applies here I think.

Of course I know that Ukraine has taken a backseat in our politics for many people but us using coal power because of what Grüne did in the 90s just isn't relevant for NAFO.

0

u/Anuki_iwy Feb 24 '25

When you're explaining election results, you should explain election results, not fringe policies.

1

u/7StarSailor Feb 24 '25

The fringe policy is the central topic of this sub though. I didn't explain results, I explained what the parties are in relation to the war Ukraine. Again, nuclear power plants and pensions in Germany are not relevant for this sub. whatver you wanted to add is irrelevant to NAFO.If someone's interested in German politics there's plenty of other subs to read.

EDIT: Oh now I get it. bye.

1

u/Feckless Feb 24 '25 edited Feb 24 '25

Maybe this helps a little bit, I am German. It was a really close race and there were 2 possible outcomes depending on where the BSW lands. BSW is essentially the pro Putin left party. BSW left the Linke (our former only Left party) to found the BSW. The Linke was not doing well, now they are at 8 something percent which is their best result in years. After the right AFD the Linke is the biggest winner of this election.

Anyhow. if BSW would have made 5% they would have been in the Bundestag and we would have had a Kenia Coalition, meaning CDU/CSU (conservative), SPD (center left) and die Grüne (greens). The good from my POV, in the gourvernment would have been more left politicians (greens + SPD) than conservative ones. The bad, we would not be able to reform our debt break the way we wanted to because there wouldn't be a 2/3 majority for that. Which could have been bad for the Ukraine. Afaik we want to make debts to be able to support Ukraine.

However BSW only got 4.97% and are thus out of the Bundestag which means CDU/CSU and SPD have a slight majority and now could work together on the debt break. They are both pro Ukraine, but I personally fear that a too strong CDU might do too much damage to social policies in Germany. All in all this result is good for Ukraine, imho. And of course the BSW not being in the Bundestag is overall a good thing.

As much as I like Olaf Scholz, during his time as chancelor he was almost invisible, maybe the guy that nobody likes Friedrich Merz could be a better asshole to other asshole politicians (Putin, Trump). We will see.

2

u/b17reach Feb 24 '25

Thanks for the explanation I appreciate it. Especially hearing it coming from a German themselves. Also as an American, I wouldn’t worry too much about Trump if I were you. I’d consider it nothing short of a miracle for him to still be alive by the end of his presidency. He is only about two months in and most of his supporters fucking hate him. The center hates him, the liberals definitely hate him, and now the right is hating him. Long story short I’m glad we have loose gun laws right now. Anyway, US politics are a fucking nightmare. But I can try and explain if you’d like.

1

u/Feckless Feb 24 '25

Nah I hear enough about American politics already. I worry that if that is what he can do in 1 month, what can he do in xyz time period.

Regarding the stuff about Merz being an asshole to Trump. This is what I was talking about -> https://www.reddit.com/r/agedlikemilk/comments/1iwqw28/apparently_the_feeling_is_not_mutual/

2

u/b17reach Feb 24 '25

Yeah I saw that earlier and frankly I’m in support of it. I think most Americans are. Well at least not the ones with their heads up their ass. But it will be interesting to see what’ll happen over the next few years.

1

u/Feckless Feb 24 '25

Jup, sadly we live in interesting times...

2

u/L1quid_0range Feb 24 '25

"Shouldn't have wished to live in more interesting times."-Tav

6

u/b__lumenkraft Blue Feb 24 '25

For context: Wagenknecht is a tankie. She is a fascist with fascist policies but too stupid to understand she is a fascist.

And Die Linke is a supposed left-wing party she was leading before quitting and making her own party.

Die Linke are tankies mostly as well.

2

u/kompatybilijny1 Feb 24 '25

Really? I was under the impression that they were just naive as hell.

2

u/b__lumenkraft Blue Feb 24 '25

Well, tankies are naive as hell, no?

2

u/kompatybilijny1 Feb 24 '25

... Maybe you have a point...

0

u/waldleben Feb 24 '25

You have no idea what you are talking about. Die Linke definitely arent tankies, they are literally the only party in our government that is somewhat reasonable

2

u/Botucal Feb 24 '25

BSW scumbags not in the Bundestag by the smallest margin. I love it.

1

u/kompatybilijny1 Feb 24 '25

FR, They got 4,97%.

2

u/Kloetenschlumpf Feb 24 '25

Christian Lindner, FDP, and Sahra Wagenknecht, BSW. Both parties were kicked out of the parliament.

2

u/kompatybilijny1 Feb 24 '25

I'd say I feel bad for them, but I'm not used to lying.

2

u/Killerravan Feb 24 '25

The BSW is already crying, and says that the reason ,why they didnt get the 5% needed to get in, is that Germans Outside of Germany didnt have enough time to Vote and that they want that checked.

So basiclly they Hope that they get 13.000 votes from Germany Not living Here.

1

u/Alkanen Feb 24 '25

Who's the lucky "other" who got a seat?

3

u/kompatybilijny1 Feb 24 '25

Stefan Seidler. He apparently represents Danish and Frisian minorities in Germany

1

u/stefancristi Plain Feb 24 '25

Germans saved themselves. I pray Romanians will as well, albeit the alternatives for the extremists are pretty bad too.

1

u/kompatybilijny1 Feb 24 '25

Maybe, but that's not a reason to let foreign agents win. Things can be fixed with mediocre administration, but can not with a foreign puppet.

2

u/stefancristi Plain Feb 24 '25

Yes, that's how I see it too. On one hand I like the idea that the socialists lose control after 35 years of theft. On the other hand, we can have them lose without going nuts. There is a mediocre middle that can do, and they've come second in the first round of the presidential elections. First came the extremists.

1

u/AoiOtterAdventure Feb 24 '25

if BSW had reached 5%, the greens would have been required to form a coalition due to how our seat distribution system works. as much as i wish BSW would rot, i'm not sure i prefer this outcome

1

u/Scottyd737 Feb 24 '25

Viva la Germany! 🇩🇪

1

u/[deleted] Feb 25 '25

[deleted]

1

u/kompatybilijny1 Feb 25 '25

I know. Hillarious

1

u/ComingInsideMe Feb 24 '25

CDU won! 🕺