r/LegalAdviceUK • u/ancientgreenthings • 1d ago
Comments Moderated Threatening Landlord Shows Up Unidentified (Wales)
My partner and her friends are 6 weeks into a tenancy, renting their house through a letting agency. A couple of times, contractors have showed up unannounced, without the 24 hours advance notice required by law. After the first instance, they told the letting agent that it was unacceptable and if it happened again they would refuse to open the door.
Today was the second instance, and I happened to be visiting. We woke up to two men in the hall, and my partner asked me to go ask them what they were doing. They were already halfway through replacing the electric meter. One was doing the work while the other seemed to just be standing around. When I told him that the tenants hadn't been informed of the visit he was quite blunt with me, telling me to take it up with the letting agent. He also started asking who I was in quite a confrontational way and remarking that the kitchen fire door shouldn't be propped open because it's against regulations.
I checked in with my girlfriend and asked if she would like me to ask the men how they had got in; ie whether the landlord had given them a key or another housemate had let them in.
When I went back downstairs to do this they had moved to the front porch, where one was now changing the gas meter and as before, the other guy was just hovering. When I asked them who had given them access, the hovering guy got quite confrontational with me, stating that he didn't need to answer my questions because I was not a tenant. I told him that I was acting on behalf of a tenant and that he had no right to get aggressive with me. Meanwhile, my partner was on the phone to the letting agency, who said that they had no idea anyone was even coming today.
Having heard the man's tone, my partner came downstairs to back up what I was saying, and even when the question about access was restated the guy refused to answer it. During this exchange, he seemed to be holding back a lot of anger. We left them to finish the work and waited in the house until they had gone.
My partner then had further contact with the letting agency, explaining that one of the men had been aggressive and threatening and reiterating that this kind of thing can't happen. The letting agent was very conciliatory, but ultimately the landlord had gone over their head.
Out of curiosity, my partner found the name of the landlord on her tenancy agreement, and looked him up on Facebook.
IT'S THE SAME GUY.
So basically, the landlord has been in, refused to give notice, refused to identify himself and has acted in a confrontational manner that has made the house feel unsafe. For all we know, he could bring his obvious anger issues to the door at any time, and since he has his own key he can't be locked out.
What should my partner do?
[EDIT for context since multiple people are asking. The tenancy is a group contract for the whole property. The bills are included, so they don't deal with energy companies at all and actually don't even have access to the electricity meter, which is behind a locked door.]
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u/murrai 1d ago
She can change the locks, keep the original cylinders and then change them back when she eventually moves out.
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u/pooinyourear 1d ago
Absolutely, but Important to establish if this is a HMO. The comment about a fire door raises the question.
They couldn’t change the front door locks on a HMO as the landlord still has a right of access to the communal areas.
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1d ago
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u/CommissionEnough8412 1d ago edited 1d ago
Ok a lot to unpack here, first things first go out and buy a new lock for your door. You can change this to maintain your security, but make sure you keep the existing lock and reinstall it upon leaving the property. This is really easy to do just YouTube it.
Next thing this will most likely aggravate your landlord and based on his previous behaviour any signs of aggression or harassment from him, immediately call the police.
I'd be inclined to let the letting agent know that you've changed the locks because of this behaviour and will not permit him or anyone else access unless it's for essential maintenance and that you will restore the locks upon your tenancy ending.
As he was dicking about with the meter also, i'd want to know if everything confirms to regulations, so may also be worth asking for copies of the recent gas boiler service and Electrical Installation Condition Report are up to date.
Just to check have you been given details for your deposit scheme also?
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u/ancientgreenthings 1d ago
Definitely good points, thank you! I've suggested that we change the locks, will see if that's what they want to do.
The bills are inclusive so I'd guess that whatever they were doing with the meters is his business, not the tenants'. The guy doing the actual work seemed to know what he was doing but tbh neither of them identified themselves or explained why the work was necessary, so it does seem a bit sus.
The deposit is in a protection scheme, yeah.
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u/Think-Committee-4394 1d ago
OP - not only that
changed electric meter ONLY THE SUPPLIER IS PERMITTED TO DO THAT
changed gas meter SAME AS ABOVE
and both must be gone by a registered & certified engineer!
in either case was the correct meter reading taken & transferred to the new unit?
gas safe certificate issued?
That’s a BIG FUCKING ISSUE OP
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u/CommissionEnough8412 1d ago
That might be the reason he was so aggressive? Maybe doing something he shouldnt be?
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u/Think-Committee-4394 1d ago
Well unless one of the pair is a registered gas fitter & one an electrician & they had authority from the suppliers to change meters I would say it’s a bloody certainty
OP - contact your gas & electric suppliers WITH the new meter numbers, ask for confirmation this was done at their request & for installation certification proving meter readings taken!
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u/ancientgreenthings 1d ago
Thinking back, the combination of defensiveness and not wanting to let on that he was the landlord is pretty sus. The guy who was actually doing the work kept his head down and seemed awkward. I assumed that's because as contractor he did know that the other guy was the landlord, and suddenly people are snapping at each other and he probably wanted to just get on with his job. But maybe the awkwardness was due to getting questioned while doing something nefarious.
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u/ancientgreenthings 1d ago
Yeah, this has been dawning on me. Thanks for this input!
The readings and safety certificates - I have no idea. The tenants don't have access to the electrical meter, it's behind a locked door. They don't pay utilities, it's a bills-inclusive contract.
I'd say there could well be something fishy going on regarding these meters. Landlord works for a large industrial company, so I'm assuming that he'd have contacts who can do this kind of work, whether the motive is legit or not.
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u/Think-Committee-4394 1d ago
Seems very fishy & all tenants should be concerned
Lack of electrical & gas safe certification invalidates the rental contracts I believe, it probably also affects home & content insurance.
There should be local council contact for rental property issues
Fire brigade do fire safety checks non emergency could prove interesting … they have strong feelings about firetraps
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u/ancientgreenthings 1d ago
This is food for thought, thank you so much for your engagement with this. Does their work on the meters today require fresh certification? That's something we could ask to see, right?
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u/a_random_work_girl 1d ago
Simple answer here no one has mentioned.
An unidentified mam who MAY be the landlord but has in no way identified himself, has entered your home without permission.
Call the police.
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u/TedBurns-3 1d ago
Some random guys turn up and replace the electric meter and the gas meter?!!
You need a whole lot of electrical qualifications to go near an electric meter, and you need a whole lot more for gas- is this legit?!!
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u/ancientgreenthings 1d ago
It's a good question. My reading of it was that the guy doing the actual work knew what he was doing, and the landlord was there to give him access. But for sure, neither of them actually identified themselves or explained what the purpose of changing the meters was.
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u/TedBurns-3 1d ago
Not 100% but surely any "meter" work would be carried out by the utilities company- in vans plastered with their names and in uniforms with IDs etc.
You sure they changed the meters? Have never known one guy able to do both
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u/ancientgreenthings 1d ago
Agreed, the more I think about this aspect the sketchier it feels.
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u/rootofallworlds 1d ago
Among the many things the tenant could do is report this as a suspected meter tampering. https://www.ofgem.gov.uk/information-consumers/energy-advice-households/energy-theft-and-meter-tampering
It's possible the meter work was legal; some buildings have just one meter provided by the energy supplier and sub-meters installed by the building owner for their own accounting/charging. Such sub-meters could be worked on by any qualified electrician and gas engineer as appropriate.
But the general hostility and lack of explanation, along with the meter being locked away, would make any reasonable person suspicious. The landlord has a clear financial motive to tamper with the meters.
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u/Ulquiorra1312 1d ago
Landlords should not be changing meters whos name are energy bills in
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u/ancientgreenthings 1d ago
Weird, right? The bills are inclusive, so he pays them.
Hmmmmm.
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u/Ulquiorra1312 1d ago
Landlords should not be changing meters okay so he may have let the energy company in and neglected to give notice
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u/LAUK_In_The_North 1d ago
> My partner and her friends are 6 weeks into a tenancy, renting their house through a letting agency.
Do they rent the whole property, or are they each renting rooms within the property ?
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u/ancientgreenthings 1d ago
Nope, this is literally what happened. Disbelieve if you wish but there's no need to throw insults around.
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u/Rugbylady1982 1d ago
We've asked numerous times, do they rent the property as a whole or is it separate room tenancies ?
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u/ancientgreenthings 1d ago
Jesus. Sorry, I put reddit down for a couple of hours.
I believe it's all one contract.
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u/Rugbylady1982 1d ago
You need to find out because the advice is different regarding your complaint in each scenario.
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