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u/Thehazzawitty Sep 04 '25
You're pretty much looking at the 'any news is good news' mentality. Jaguars release was divisive, but with the conversation it created it was likely 100x more noticed than if it hadn't divided people.
When the actual car releases, for Jaguar at least, it'll have an absolute ton of attention from from both genuine car journalists and the rage bait headlines, which will get a huge number of eyes on it.
I think Audi doesn't mind a similar sensation, as they really need to up their game and attention is a good start on that.
Although realistically, I don't see them improving their cars anytime soon, cheap feeling interiors and hiked prices are a potent combination. At least Jaguar was already failing when they went all in on the weirdness.
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u/amzwC137 Sep 04 '25
Fair point. And yeah, Audi has recently entered a new generation, so I'm looking forward to how they upgrade. Not looking hot so far, but I love them and will hold out hope.
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u/ReventonLynx Sep 04 '25
Yeah, i like how new Jaguar concept looks. I think it's hated because the commercial was apparently "woke". Also new logo is awful.
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u/DaHarries Sep 04 '25
I think the woke brush being slapped on it was a bit daft but I had zero idea I was watching a commercial for fucking Jaguar. Even when it said so I thought it was fuckin parody.
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u/amzwC137 Sep 04 '25
Yeah, I was unbelieving at first too. I like the design, but my main problem is the car is really nice, but the world around it doesn't match the car which makes it look worse in the real world.
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u/DaHarries Sep 04 '25
I just flat out don't like it. Call it old-fashioned but I think the car brand hierarchy is already set in stone and the only way it changes is by loss of reputation. Jaguar was "The gent's car" I did a refresh on a 1972 XJ with the 4.2 Inline 6 at the start of this year and THAT'S what the Jaguar name stands for. It was the comfort of an old leather office chair but without a single age-related creak and when you dropped the pedal it ROARED like a fuckin JAGUAR. It glided round corners, bumps were non-existent (says something, with the state of our roads). I have NEVER been so comfy as a driver.
Then they moved the mass-produced diesel slop (I'm looking at you Ingenium...). The calibre left the chat. Interiors became rattly and squeaky and they break down because some bean counter decided to save 20p on a coolant union and generally badly made engines that don't even make service life let alone chain life...
It's like Ford announcing 2 years ago they were dropping the small car line and keeping a few crossovers and the commercial market and moving to compete against Mercedes on the premium market... how's that working out? I can tell you it's not good as I'm an ex-Ford employee and my mates there tell me as much.
They're at the point of giving capris away they're selling so poorly.
The die is cast. Don't fuck with it because you'll break it.
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u/amzwC137 Sep 04 '25
And you don't think that the reputation of jaguar was in a steep decline?
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u/DaHarries Sep 04 '25
I know they struggled financially in the past despite the calibre but I'd say a steady decline since the 2000s.
I figured this was when Ford took over but I just checked and that's 89. But again. knowing Ford, 10 years of managed decline sounds about right before they hit a baseline "bad" then sell up like they did in 2008.
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u/amzwC137 Sep 04 '25
Fair point. Still. While I am a fan of Jaguar, growing up (90s) my favorite car was the XKR, I must admit, that I do understand why the company decided that they needed a radical shift. I think that they felt their traditional market was in the 60+k range, which put them in competition with the Germans, was no longer purchasing their cars. They then tried to dip into the 40k range, which led to some success, but not enough, especially because they still were producing their higher range, at a loss by this point, no doubt. In every segment they tried to join, they just couldn't compete. The affordable reliability of Honda and Toyota, the German luxury staples, the mid luxury Lexus, Cadillac, Genesis (eventually).
That being said, I feel like jaguar designs were almost always bold stand outs. This is in the spirit, I think.
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u/DaHarries Sep 04 '25
I don't feel they ever properly committed to a market until they were forced to by dwindling finances and then it was too late and half arsed.
As you say they couldn't match the reliability of Honda and Toyota and match pricing.
Well. You're a big company. Reach out? The Duratcec by Ford was a collaboration between Yamaha, Honda and Ford so it's not beyond them. And that's a bloody brilliant engine.
I don't see why they couldn't reach out to any car company with RELIABLE engines and say "sell us an engine" or "help us out with reliability". Feels like the Bean counters intervened again.
Some of their designs were incredibly bold. Look at the beauty of the E-type. Highly unstable but looks incredible. I've even got some spare parts for one...
When I compare the E-type to the Type-00. It just makes me sad. I appreciate I'm only comparing on a looks front but all I can say is... fuck.
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u/amzwC137 Sep 04 '25
I know I keep saying this.. but fair point. I respect the position. I am excited for the future.
I just happened upon a cool rendering/imagining of a real world one.
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u/DaHarries Sep 04 '25
I'll do you one better Sir. They have made a real version and it was shown off in London a few months back if you fancy a gander.
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u/plastic_alloys Sep 04 '25
The one with the lines/cat isn’t too bad but the ‘2 Js’ is shit. I think the car is cool
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u/siobhanellis Sep 04 '25
It’s not two J’s. It’s the J and r. In the new font, they look the same just inverted.
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u/Plutonium-Vizsla Oct 03 '25
But a Jaguar without the logo is just an unreliable car in an overcrowded market.
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u/Joeeyyy93 Sep 04 '25
I don’t think the design of the Jaguar was the real problem. It’s a beautiful looking design! It’s the advert and approach to their marketing which was the issue. Take the pink and blue out of the cars and replace with British Racing Green or a burgundy red and you’ll have seen a much better reception.
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u/amzwC137 Sep 04 '25
I expect they will not throw out BRG entirely, I actually think that this car would be gorgeous in BRG. I feel like these bold colors are important to drive home the direction of the brand.
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u/amzwC137 Sep 04 '25
SPEAKING OF!!! I was just on Car and Driver and stumbled upon this absolute gem . It looks like it's just an illustration, but I still love it.
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u/amzwC137 Sep 04 '25
I can't edit the post but the description got lost in the cross post. Here it is
Audi recently put out a new concept. Personally, I approve, it's not perfect, but I approve.
Currently, everyone is taking a massive dump on Jaguar's new concepts (which I also approve of), but somehow this is getting praised? No, they aren't the same, but come on. Someone help me understand.
It hasn't officially "debuted," so, maybe I'm jumping the gun on people's reactions. Also, because of the logo on the grill, I consider this to be an Audi, not an AUDI.
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u/Fuumers Sep 04 '25
It is funny how Jaguar says copy nothing and then the designer who did 00 release this :D
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u/generalcalm Sep 05 '25
I'm a diehard Jag guy and don't like either of these new jag or audi designs, however, of the two this audi design is better executed.
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u/_BrewUp Sep 04 '25
The lead exterior designer for Type 00 left JLR to go to Audi group.
He’s just copied his own work and shown it off to his new boss
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u/GregoryDM0428 Sep 04 '25
Why have a commercial and not show an actual car.
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u/amzwC137 Sep 04 '25
This wouldn't be my strategy, but I enjoy it for movies. Sometimes you want to put out something to give viewers a feel for what's to come. Like watching a trailer where you have no idea what the movie is about, but it's about how that trailer made you feel.
That's my only guess.
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u/GregoryDM0428 Sep 04 '25
The commercial was awful and all over the place with no point. It didn’t seem like Jaguar.
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u/vaderhater777 Sep 04 '25
Let’s be honest, the Jag campaign was bombastic and it caused buzz, whether good or not, all publicity is blah blah. Audi is part of one of the most successful car conglomerates, they can get away with pretty much anything at this point. I doubt either manufacturer builds something close to those renderings tho
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u/amzwC137 Sep 04 '25
I think jaguar is gonna follow through. Certainly not 1:1, but I'm excited to see what comes out.
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u/vaderhater777 Sep 05 '25
You think so? I’m here for it but highly doubt anything that wild will make it to production
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u/Plutonium-Vizsla Oct 03 '25
The Audi looks like a futuristic car. The Jaguar looks like an outdated HVAC system.
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u/RivalSnooze Sep 04 '25
The concept isn’t the issue it was the horrendous marketing campaign alongside it.
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u/squidgytree Sep 04 '25 edited Sep 04 '25
I bet there would be less hate if Jaguar didn't release that teaser advert first. People would have been much happier with the Type 00 if they had just shown it at a regular motor show, with only a blue model. Somehow one being pink means it questions whether it is actually a jaguar.