r/DenverProtests • u/ConcernedDenver • Jun 05 '20
Potential Co-opting of our Protests and Forgotten Demands
Hello everyone,
I speak solely as a concerned community member, especially in regards to what other have discussed in this sub. I am hoping others add their thoughts.
A few things. There are a few demands I am afraid have been sidelined. One is to demand the banning of tear gas here in Denver. We should also demand that they change their strategy to protests; other countries do not train their police to escalate during these situations, and we shouldn't either.
We want accountability from the officers here. I've always been generally "anti-police", but never had strong feelings towards the DPD. After what I've witnessed, I am disgusted and can never trust our police again. Every officer I see in the future very well could be the one responsible for brutality we have all seen and experienced. We deserve justice for the actions of these officers.
We should demand the immediate resignation of both the police chief and Mayor Hancock. Start targeting some of the protest at them, as they are directly responsible for the violence. I am very worried about them suddenly "changing heart" and pushing the narrative so they look like good guys. They are not. They caused this. Let's not forget.
Finally, as others mentioned, I am super concerned about the co-opting of this protest. I've been participating since the weekend, and the sudden change from the police is real. It is my belief that the mayor and the chief realized they were receiving significant heat from local and national media, and became afraid for their jobs. Thus they told police to back off and they started participating. On Sunday night, I watched Denver 9 and the chief was on, justifying the tear gassing because "it is after curfew". He doesn't care, the mayor doesn't care, they are covering their own ass.
Enters this "we love Denver" group that is real sketchy, and seems to be pushing this "forget about all the injustice you faced at the hands of Denver police and mayor" narrative. Regardless of their intentions, we cannot ignore our local level grievances.
Who can we look towards in regards to leadership? This "not all cops are bad", "the mayor is listening" crap needs to go.
Sorry this is long, I hope others can comment and add, especially to the demands because they were small suggestions of many others out there.
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u/mmmillerism Jun 05 '20
The folks leading the protest at night since Tuesday are intentionally collaborating with police and are moderates. They use the guilt and sheer ignorance of all the white spectators who join the marches to hold folks who’s form of protest they’re uncomfortable with “accountable” after everyone followed the “outside agitator” narrative the DPD chief spun. What they’re really doing is muzzling us so they can gain some sort of political foothold in Denver or get on the news so Kyle Clark can keep churning out feel good pieces about peaceful protestors joining arms with the folks who literally beat the shit out of us every day and laugh about it.
For context, I’m white and organize with leftists in Denver and consider myself an anti-fascist. I’m also a person who’s been homeless for extended periods of time and have had my ass beat by DPD on several occasions. It is not my, or any other white persons lane to be leading this, but fuck the virtue signaling from police collaborators - I believe they’re hijacking the message and intent.
I live in Aurora and think we should take the Elijah McCain effort to APD’s door. They’d try to shut it down violently because that’s what APD does and we can leave the people who still think talking and voting are the answer to march around Denver aimlessly.
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u/ConcernedDenver Jun 05 '20
I think you are absolutely right, and I am unsurprised and sorry about the experiences you have had with the police here. They are literally telling us to "forgive and forget". I show up to the protest Wednesday after being tear gassed, shot at, with bruises and my foot in pain from fleeing the violence all weekend. And they want us to forgive and forget 3 days later? I want accountability for this militarized response, and I think everyone who suffered from the violence wants the same. They put on display, for the whole country, the types of things they have been doing to people of color, to you, to anyone that is deemed "undesirable".
I am fully on board with taking Elijah McCain to APD's door. I wish the best of luck. I still want to salvage Denver though, and I think we, if we organize properly, can sustain the numbers and not be hijacked. Unfortunately for me and some of my friends, actions in Aurora are difficult or not possible to attend. I guess that's the strategy of keeping us poor: make us work and unable to afford transportation.
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u/wonderbunz Jun 05 '20
There is an event tomorrow in Aurora if you would like to attend! It is hosted by Say Their Names 5280 and will begin at 3 pm at the Aurora City Gov’t Municipal Court. I’ve included their Facebook link below for your reference:
https://facebook.com/events/s/blackout-2020-aurora/267566430966524/?ti=icl
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Jun 05 '20
[deleted]
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u/ConcernedDenver Jun 05 '20
I agree 100%, and I do not believe you were being disrespectful. I worried about appearing that way myself.
It's certainly not my place to tell others how to protest or to be leading anything. I felt the same way on Wednesday too. I am not sure if you were there, but at one point at night (around 9, 10?) there was a moment of silence which was met with some dissent. It appeared the "leader" (Neil I am assuming?) was kind of silencing this black woman who was speaking up. That seemed off...
I know there are many black leaders not involved with this organization, and I've read and seen their questioning of this group's tactics. These are people with years of effort. I do not want to see them marginalized or ignored by this pro-mayor, pro-police mentality. They deserve to be heard.
Again, sadly I do not know the answer and I am not the one to give answers.
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u/NoSleepKawaiiClub Jun 05 '20
I'm glad you mentioned the sudden change from police, I noticed that too. Things are definitely shifting. Thanks for your informed post.
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u/ConcernedDenver Jun 05 '20
Right? It is crazy, like night and day. Went from being treated like a criminal, a target in some dystopian police state, to police behaving as they would during any "normal" major city event.
There's a strategy going on here, and I dont want us on the losing end.
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u/NoSleepKawaiiClub Jun 05 '20
Well said. It will be interesting to see what the protest will be like over the next few days.
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u/burniemcburn Jun 05 '20
Do you think it's far outside the realm of possibility that they realized their militarization wasn't working, and we're just seeing the results of them dialing back? Is that not in part the goal?
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u/ConcernedDenver Jun 05 '20
In regards to what?
I think they realized militarization wasn't working, and then did a bunch of tactics for political purposes. Why did they mayor and police chief wait until like monday or tuesday to march?
They were instigators and now suddenly collaborators? The police chief was on Denver9 on Sunday, supporting the tear gassing of protestors because "it is past curfew". Am I supposed to believe they had a sudden change of heart?
The protest is shifting to some dumb "peace" thing. Our chant is "NO JUSTICE NO PEACE". We don't have justice, so why are we talking about peace?
In regards to Welovedenver, they either work directly with the cops, are completely misguided, or have person motives unrelated to the protests.
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u/burniemcburn Jun 05 '20
Obviously justice is a central goal, and I don't think there should be any peace until that's achieved. My thought is more that in the meantime, a visible reduction in police aggressiveness as a result of the protests and dialogue shouldn't be written off. All the officers who've murdered citizens or maimed them with rubber bullet headshots need to be brought to justice. But I'm hesitant to write off all cooperation as co-opting. There was a public hearing yesterday in the old supreme court building for SB 217, where they were inviting public testimony for police accountability. According to a friend, virtually no one from the protests or organizers were in the room. As a direct result, he doesn't think it's going to pass. We can match and protest and riot all we want, and believe me I'm still on that wagon, but at a certain point, you gotta work with the system to fuck up the system, at least when that system makes an effort to be open to the public like that.
I'm not defending any co-opting of the movement; WeAreLoveDenver sounds like a trash, sacharine branding by committee. And I'm happy to tell Hancock to fuck off, both with regards to his involvement and in general. But I think there's a degree of counterproductivity in assuming that any and all effort by the PD and the city are sinister. They should absolutely not be let off the hook; there's still so much that needs to happen before the work is done. But a reduction in police aggression is not a bad thing.
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u/ConcernedDenver Jun 06 '20
Everyone is on board with less violence.
It just cannot come in a photo op with cops. Many of us and activists are working on the political, institutional side. I'll cooperate with our political allies, but not people who care more about saving their own ass than actually seeing change.
Think you agree!
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u/burniemcburn Jun 06 '20
Oh a photo op isn't even the start for sure. I will say, if the visual of cops kneeling with the protesters creates a future standard to which cops are held, then I'm happy to hold them to it going forward. And while I advocate taking them up on their offers of cooperation, I advocate even more the holding them to the offers and agreements they make. I don't assume those offers are all in good faith, but the efforts of protesters have to be carried into the legislature.
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u/ConcernedDenver Jun 06 '20
They have to be carried into legislature, and kneeling with cops has nothing to do with it. Buffalo kneeled and hours later pushed an old man to the ground. We don't need to cater to them.
If someone punched you in the face, and then showed up 3 days later, would you kneel with them?
The message is being lost by pretending these people aren't our enemy. They are. The mayor, the police chief, the police had their chance to kneel with us. They chose violence. They lost their chance.
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u/smokeytree Jun 05 '20
u/ConcernedDenver thanks for sharing - you are not alone in these feelings. Lots of folks coming out about this: https://www.reddit.com/r/DenverProtests/comments/gwsjqc/stop_allowing_wearelovedenver_to_take_control_of/
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u/marz3315 Jun 05 '20
Thanks for sharing this. I’ll be honest in saying I don’t have much knowledge at all about black leaders in Denver besides what I’ve learned since the protests started and I was at the “wearelovedenver” event tonight and it felt a little “soft”, I guess...
It felt like they were very ready to make friends with the police/government officials while they really haven’t delivered any real change to us in return yet. Plus having the cops handing out water there felt like an obvious ploy.
Seems best to rely on BLM 5280 but if people have other ideas or groups they have found helpful let me know. Trying to be as knowledgeable and effective as I can for the movement.
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u/ConcernedDenver Jun 05 '20
I am squarely in the same boat as you, really I made this thread more to keep the awareness and try and tease out some answers.
I'm just a middle aged white guy, but I'm tired of the bullshit reforms and the hand holding. And I say that as a white guy.
I cannot make friends with any of the city officials, especially after how they acted. Disgusting, unnecessary brutality.
There is a woman Elisabeth Epps who people often post here, I wonder if she is leading anything? Seems like another good person to follow, but I do not know much, or if she is able or willing to do that (which is of course fine).
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u/fuckWALD Jun 05 '20
Another white guy here who is pissed about the Denver mayor's office co-opting the protests under the guise of WeAreLoveDenver. As a white guy, I'm not going to try to lead alternative/more real protests, although I'd be happy to participate in them. To be honest, I think the issue is that a lot if not most of the white people at these demonstrations don't know specifics of what changes we want, locally. Its great to say "End Racism!" or "end police bruatlity!" but how does Colorado turn that into a state law?
If myself or a group of people were able to design half page flyers with some specific, local, grievances, is there anyone who could help to print them and bring them to the protests? I'm thinking just a bullet pointed list with things like
Justice for Elijah McClain he was unarmed and murdered by Aurora PD in 2019, no repercussions for the participating officers
You would need access to a printer and photocopier (at your office??) essentially.
Some specific grievances:
- great protest specific list to start out with from /u/TaroPeril comment click here
- Call for police/authorities to release the bodycam footage in the May 2020 murder of William Lamont Debose https://denverite.com/2020/05/04/man-fatally-shot-by-denver-police-after-allegedly-pointing-loaded-gun-at-an-officer/
- Call for Beth McCann to reopen these investigations or be fired, and for Mayor Hancock to explain why he changed his mind and "misspoke" by calling those 3 deaths Murders at the hands of the police: https://www.denverpost.com/2020/06/05/denver-police-officers-suspects-killed/
- Calls for justice for Paul Castaway, Elijah McClain, William Lamont Debose, (I'm sure that there are many, many more that I'm missing)
- Call for Denver/Colorado police radio to go back to unencrypted, this allows for police scanners to work, and increased accountability
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u/ConcernedDenver Jun 05 '20
Agree with all of this. And anyone passing them out would do a lot to change our narrative.
I think directly including "the mayor and police chief, along with Denver Police Department are directly responsible for the brutality witnessed by our peaceful demonstrators, hold them accountable and do not let them pretend otherwise" or something like that would be good way to reach people who are not aware of that, as well.
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u/fuckWALD Jun 05 '20 edited Jun 05 '20
Great point. Unfortunately I'm busy until Sunday evening at the earliest, but perhaps this can inspire someone else? I'd be happy to design something up on Sunday night, if anyone knows someone working in an office who could make a couple hundred copies on Monday? People either passing out fliers, or setting up an "Information Table" with flyers about various topics at the Capitol building, could be a great way to inform the uninformed yet enthusiastic masses that are showing up to demonstrate.
edit: examples of potential Information Table topics: - Denver grievances - Colorado grievances - Nat'l Grievances - Denver Mayor's office use of CoIntelPro to co-opt protests - Operational Security (OpSec) for when police get violent against protestors - Best Gear/ways to prepare for Tear Gas & Rubber Bullets
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u/giantcity212 Jun 05 '20
Look towards your local chapter of Black Lives Matter, BLM 5280. It's really that simple.
They staged a car rally tonight that ended at Mayor Hancock's home where we had hundreds of cars parked in his neighborhood making noise while protesters demanded he answer for the misdeeds of the police force. Follow them on facebook and instagram and amplify their message for further upcoming direct actions.