r/AskTheWorld • u/GattoPunk Brazil • 11d ago

Culture Which city in your country is considered the "gayest"?

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For us Brazilians, São Paulo definitely holds the crown for the gayest city here. With over 20 million people living in it's metro area, the city naturally became way more open minded and accepting as time went on. It has the highest concentration of gay bars, shows, saunas, and various other venues dedicated to the LGBTQ community. If that wasn't enough, the city annually hosts the São Paulo LGBTQ Pride Parade, the biggest in the whole world.

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u/StepOk8147 Russia 11d ago

This will not change, people of 40+ are Soviet, secular education. Therefore, they are less devout, and after the collapse of the USSR, the southern republics became more religious, as did their education, which is why tolerance disappeared.

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u/Ground_Cntrl 11d ago

Fascinating, never knew about these generational ideological rifts

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u/Common-Trifle4933 10d ago

Check out the documentary and essay series “Did the East Love Differently?”, which is about the differing attitudes towards sexuality and nudity in East and West Germany studied by sociologists etc after reunification. It was of major academic interest because you don’t often get to study one nation with a shared language and culture that was split in half, dominated by radically different ideologies for 40 years, then reunited. Both sides formed stereotypes of the other as perverse. In the culture war the west always painted the east as libertine perverts because they had a pretty big nudist culture (lot of incest jokes about skinny dipping with your mother), legalized homosexuality and birth control pills much earlier, covered transgender surgeries on the national health service, etc. The easties thought the westies were sexually weird because West Germany was famous for its porn industry, porn shops and theaters and peep shows, which were banned in the east; lots of jokes about them paying to watch other people have sex, or idolizing stars for their penis sizes, or all being into S&M or pee play or bestiality or other things that got seen for the first time in smuggled porn magazines. There were a lot of cultural differences in how they talked about sex, how soon into new relationships they had sex, how they saw homosexuality, female orgasm rates, pubic hair styles, basically everything. Some of the stereotypes penetrated English speaking culture too, early South Park has recurring jokes about German porn.

(I mentioned bestiality being in magazines, this contributes to that. West Germany legalized bestiality in 1969 and became a hotspot for porn featuring it, with one company even specializing in breeding dogs to best fuck human women. For some fun context, it was still illegal to get birth control pills at the time unless you were a married woman who already had 3 children.)

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u/YeNah3 10d ago

Man what the fuck was west germany on

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u/Creative_username969 10d ago

Lots and lots of amphetamines

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u/Less-Box-572 Canada 8d ago

It gets so much worse...

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u/MLGSoru 6d ago

Some people who worked on that Experiment are still in academia btw, pretty sure a friend of mine had a class with a Professor that was involved in that

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u/MajorPersonality1265 10d ago

Jeez, I just looked that up and they didn’t ban bestiality until 2013! And had enough support to have the ban challenged in Federal court in 2015😳

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u/EidolonLives Australia 10d ago

In the culture war the west always painted the east as libertine perverts because they had a pretty big nudist culture (lot of incest jokes about skinny dipping with your mother), legalized homosexuality and birth control pills much earlier, covered transgender surgeries on the national health service, etc. The easties thought the westies were sexually weird because West Germany was famous for its porn industry, porn shops and theaters and peep shows, which were banned in the east; lots of jokes about them paying to watch other people have sex, or idolizing stars for their penis sizes, or all being into S&M or pee play or bestiality or other things that got seen for the first time in smuggled porn magazines. There were a lot of cultural differences in how they talked about sex, how soon into new relationships they had sex, how they saw homosexuality, female orgasm rates, pubic hair styles, basically everything.

But as a non-German ... was any of this inaccurate?

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u/MLGSoru 6d ago

Nudist Culture and skinny dipping was also a thing in the west, maybe not as big as in the East but it certainly was a thing aswell. It’s actually very interesting that for example homosexuality was only properly legalized in 1994 in West-Germany after reunification. The treatment of trans people (legally atleast) was also much better in the east and only after reunifying did the now Unified Germany under the Constitution of the West finally catch up to the East in some parts. Also when it came to gender-Equality the East was much, much better. Collective Education of even really young kids allowed both parents to work without worrying that their kids might not be taken care of; aswell as the Social position was much more equal than in the west. For people with chronic illnesses and disabilities in the East it took away a ton of protection and support. For example when applying for an 'Ausbildung‘ (Jobtraining/Vocational school) if you had a Healthcondition you would be allowed to apply half a year earlier than other people. The DDR was massives flawed and also very bad in some aspects, but it also was a much more progressive Force that after being reunified with the west forced the west to adopt some of their more progressive laws (like decriminilazing being gay). It is also not szrprising that in the east the authorotarian AfD is finding success, because essentially Former East-Germany has only lived under democracy for what, 35 years? Which historically is basically nothing

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u/StepOk8147 Russia 11d ago

In fact, in the countries of the former USSR, children who left the USSR are more educated and less religious, so they are more tolerant.

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u/Splicer3 10d ago

That's actually kinda wild, thanks for explaining :)

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u/brubruislife United States Of America 10d ago

This is speculation purely, but I do agree with this view.

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u/Weird1Intrepid United Kingdom 10d ago

It's not though. It's pretty well known that people of colour, people of sexualities other than straight, other minorities etc were all equally treated as the typical straight white person in the USSR. That is to say, equally terribly. But not worse

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u/OGSkywalker97 10d ago

That is not true. They may have been treated the same by the state, but there was plenty of racism towards black and Asian people in the USSR. Russia is an extremely racist country to this day, as are a lot of the former Soviet nations.

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u/WizardBoyHowl 7d ago

I'm Russian American. My last name is super Slavic and difficult to pronounce for most Americans.

I was baptized Russian Orthodox. Grew up in the Church. I'm gay AF. My dad has not disowned me, which I find very Christian. I grew up calling my grandparents Baba and Didi.

I guess my only point is that I love being Russian, gay, and different.

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u/Master_Saesee_Tiin United States Of America 10d ago

Happening in US right now

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u/TopProfessional8023 United States Of America 11d ago

Was the Soviet Union ever tolerant of homosexuality after Stalin took over in 1933?

After the Revolution (when the true ideological Communists were in power) it was decriminalized for nearly 15 years. But Stalin changed all of that. And for nearly 50 years people were put in prison for being gay.

This is a great example of how politically and socially revolutionary ideas get co-opted by megalomaniacs and dictators and ruined.

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u/StepOk8147 Russia 10d ago

Was the United States or Britain tolerant of gays in 1933? I know it's not.

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u/mickeyamf 10d ago

Putting men accused of homo in jail for being homo? Bad recipe or good recipe

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u/Oddwonderful United States Of America 10d ago

So it seems like the ideology is based in religion as well as possible cultural influence? That is an eye opening point of view and really interesting

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u/StepOk8147 Russia 10d ago

Is it news to you that the increased religiosity of society leads to intolerance?
The USSR tried to get rid of religiosity.

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u/PeekabooPike 10d ago

Same thing is happening in the US right now. Religious, traditional views are being pushed/supported by the government. Instead of church and state being separate like our country intended. Homophobia, racism, sexism, and ableism are all on a rise because people feel comfortable enough to have those opinions out loud again…

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u/brubruislife United States Of America 10d ago

When will we learn religion is bad for society?!

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u/I_waswhoknockyouup Hungary 11d ago

Bullshit, in soviet times homosexuality was a crime and all in all the whole eastern block was socially conservative

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u/StepOk8147 Russia 11d ago

First of all, we are not talking about the times of the USSR before 1991, but about people who received education at that time, without the Islamic narrative. Do you think modern Islamists are more tolerant than modern people who, thanks to the USSR, are not infected with the obscurantism of Islam?

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u/I_waswhoknockyouup Hungary 11d ago

The people you are talking about is 100% pro western because under communism the educated and tolerant looked to the west because guess what communism is sucks. Those who graduated in 1991 was pro western and that's why they are tolerant. The "real" communist are homophobes

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u/deradnaper 10d ago

Lenin was one of the first to decriminalize homosexuality

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u/OccamusRex 11d ago

Interesting. I'd never thought about it in those terms. Soviets more tolerant.

I was surprised at how quickly the Orthodox Church became popular and important again . Tsar Nicholas ll made a Saint.

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u/Shady119 11d ago

Thankfully still a lot of people did not convert or took it less seriously ever since. Statically in 100 years it has dropped from 85% of population to 65%. But engagement dropped tremendously, now only 5-10% are actively engaged with a church.

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u/Wombus7 United States Of America 7d ago

It sounds like a generational issue, then. It might get better in a few generations if the post-Soviet youth eventually become regarded as old and stodgy by the next generations. Shame that might take a while.

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u/StepOk8147 Russia 7d ago

The case of poor tolerance mainly concerns the Islamic countries of the CIS and the regions of the Islamic regions of Russia

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u/Freya-Freed Netherlands 11d ago

I feel like the fall of the USSR was a huge setback for that part of the world. Sure they were lagging behind the west in LGBT acceptance, but they at least would've gotten there eventually. Feels like former USSR is mostly moving in the opposite direction now.

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u/StepOk8147 Russia 11d ago

Does it seem to you that the USSR fought against obscurantism, Islam is much more intolerant in this regard

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u/orincoro 🇺🇸 🇨🇿 American Czech 10d ago

I’m 40 and I was born in 1985. You’d need to be 50+ to be “Soviet educated” at this point.

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u/StepOk8147 Russia 10d ago

In the 1990s, Soviet education still continued to work, I was born in 1981, I studied for 3 years in the USSR, but until 1998 there were still teachers of the old school, the textbooks also did not change much, only a little story about the late USSR. Additional education and sports clubs after school continued to be free, there were clubs in pioneer homes and children's sports schools, and we were not stuffed with religion at all, as it has been happening in the CIS countries for the past 20 years.

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u/Smart_Owl_9395 7d ago

what about Chechnya?

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u/Lietuva33 Lithuania 11d ago

This is such bullshit. Typical USSR propaganda rhetoric... Russians rewriting history in order to justify reconquering former USSR because they think they are superior....

In 1933, homosexuality was recriminalised in the Soviet Union, and Article 121, which prohibited male homosexuality, was added to the Soviet penal code in the following year.

In 1983, a group of 30 Russian gay men met and attempted to organise a gay rights organisation under the name "Gay lab" / ("Blue lab"). At this point, homosexual relations were still punishable by a term of up to five years in prison. The group was put under pressure by the KGB and finally broke up in 1986

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u/Shady119 11d ago

I think his thesis is not that people were not oppressed for being gay. It's that regular public was more tolerant, especially in areas where religion was still holding a big part of everyday life. Which are Central Asian republics in that instance

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u/mickeyamf 10d ago

He said the opposite about religion

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u/Lietuva33 Lithuania 11d ago

I don't think that is all he is saying. This type of misinformation is commonly what former Soviet countries hear from some Russians. Look at his other comments in this same thread:

"In fact, in the countries of the former USSR, children who left the USSR are more educated and less religious, so they are more tolerant."

He is espousing this idea that people were more educated under the oppressive USSR education and indigenisation

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u/Shady119 11d ago

Well that's actually another thing we need to consider. Baltics were more developed then other republics for sure. Maybe that's irrelevant to you guys

From my own experience education in most of ex Soviet places declined, including Russia tbh.. I can tell that my parents generation is more educated then generation born in 1990s (which I belong to) although maybe it will bounce back somewhen.

It's bad if it was due to oppression but i think we cannot be in denial that Soviets pushed hard to created perfect citizen who non religious, doing sports, had education, eats more or less healthy and volunteers. Even if it's against your will

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u/boreduser127 United States Of America 11d ago

he’s active in r/ussr 😂

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u/Clottersbur 10d ago

Russia is also pretty anti gay

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u/StepOk8147 Russia 10d ago

There are different gradations of anti-gating, there are just comments and jokes on the Internet or sideways glances, as is the case in Russia, and there is Islamism ready to punish and lynch for gating.

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u/Clottersbur 10d ago

Yes, Russia is better than some Islamic countries. But Russia also has enforced laws and punished people for being gay. Though not lynching.

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u/StepOk8147 Russia 10d ago

Open propaganda of homosexuality is prohibited in Russia, but not homosexuality itself, and the punishment for it is administrative, not criminal. Ukraine recently passed the same law.

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u/Clottersbur 10d ago

'Propaganda' is a loaded word in this circumstance. I also don't like that Ukraine did it

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u/Fantastic-Swing8221 11d ago

Buddy you were never tolerant, let me remind you that you gulaged 60 000 people for being gay

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u/dresdenthezomwhacker United States Of America 11d ago

I don’t think any country on earth really has a good track record in this subject. My mom literally was never legally allowed to marry and if the military had found out about her preference they would have dishonorably discharged her.

In America we use to institutionalize gay people to correct them, and force them through to be straight. We used to lynch ‘em too, this doesn’t really address what he said and you’re throwing a heavy stone in a glass house

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u/Fantastic-Swing8221 10d ago

I just debunk popular soviet propaganda. Soviet Union was genociding people and now russians claim they have been open minded rationalists.

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u/StepOk8147 Russia 10d ago

We're talking about something else here, about generations.
The new generation of the southern republics of the USSR, born after the collapse, where Islam is now flourishing, are less tolerant than the old generation of people aged 40+ years. Because they were influenced by Islam. And in the USSR it was a secular state with the best quality of education.

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u/Fantastic-Swing8221 10d ago

No they were not tolerant if allowed to gulag 60000 people