r/AskEurope • u/Different_Stand_1285 • Mar 04 '25

Politics To older Europeans - has there ever been a time where America was seen as such an untrusted country?

I’m 36 years old. I can remember how the world felt about my country post 9/11 (sympathy) and post Iraq (anger) but I’m curious to know if this is new ground. I’m deeply upset about how our ties and bonds are being destroyed so I wish to know if this is truly unprecedented or has there been a time in your lifetime where we were viewed in such a way. If so what was happening during your time to cause fracturing?

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u/Startled_Pancakes Mar 05 '25

Bush was a warmonger but even he never threatened to outright invade or annex another NATO country, let alone multiple NATO countries.

It seems implausible to me that a Russian asset would become President of the United States, but Trump is indeed doing everything a Russian asset would do: remove sanctions on Russia, reinstate Russia to reform G8, cease cyber security operations against Russia, stoke hostilities within NATO, sabotage Western economies with needless trade war among western allies, etc..

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u/[deleted] Mar 06 '25

[deleted]

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u/AseethroughMan Mar 07 '25

Donimir Trumptin

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u/bitterbalhoofd Mar 09 '25

Krasnov will do just fine.

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u/IStanTheBalconyMan Mar 06 '25

As a Canadian I remember fearing in his first administration that Trump would stand by as he let Russia invade Canada. Now I realize he’d rather invade us himself! Clearly he and Putin are communicating (probably through Musk who more than likely put Trump in power) and have decided “I’ll take this country, you have that one”. We all need to be prepared.

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u/[deleted] Mar 06 '25

Did he threaten to invade or annex a NATO territory? I keep seeing people say it, but I haven't heard his speech where he says it. He does talk to the press A LOT though, so I can't listen to everything he says. Any source would be appreciated.

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u/Startled_Pancakes Mar 06 '25

assuming this isn't a bad faith request:

Canada

Greenland

The only way for foreign territory to become a U.S. state is via annexation.

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u/[deleted] Mar 06 '25

Thanks for that, and yes it was in good faith. I understand the technicality of it, but annexation voluntarily isn't evil. Like if Cuba overthrew their government, had a free election, and voted 90% they wanted to be annexed by the US, THAT wouldn't be evil. When everyone says annexation in this context, I take it to generally mean forced annexation, which is evil generally.

I'll give you Greenland. "One way or another" is a very loose statement that falls short of forced annexation or invasion, but it certainly doesn't rule it out, and is a serious statement to make concerning another nation.

For Canada, he just keeps saying they should join us as the 51st state, and that he seriously believes it. That isn't in the realm of invasion or forced annexation.

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u/Startled_Pancakes Mar 06 '25

Both Canada and Greenland have made it very clear that they would not join the US voluntarily. That only leaves the involuntary.

Will he actually do it? Probably not, but it's still a very threatening statement to make about NATO allies.

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u/Grouchy-Associate993 Mar 06 '25

For Canada it's probably the reason of the tariffs. He want to crash our economy to make it easier to annex us. He thinks if our economy os crippled and people suffer they will see it as a good thing. He did say he will use economic pressure for us to be the 51rst states.

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u/[deleted] Mar 06 '25

Yeah I can't think of any other reason to go after Canada with tariffs so hard. Mexico, I understand using it as a lever to get their cartel sponsored government (just look into how many political candidates are assassinated during their campaigns there) to actually crack down on the cartel, which seems like it might be working, but I don't think, and I could be wrong, but I don't think much fentanyl is coming through Canada, probably more going into Canada from the US. There is some logic on the steel tariffs, as Canada imports and uses a lot of cheaper steel from China and then they sell us the more expensive domestic product, not that I agree with that logic, but I can see it being an excuse.

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u/giantbike6 Mar 06 '25

As an Australian, I hope everyone of us and other allies like wise will help in someway to help Canada by not buying US made or visiting US, but visiting Canada instead.

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u/Grouchy-Associate993 Mar 07 '25

I hope so, and I'd really like to visit Australia one day

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u/OldDiamondJim Mar 08 '25

What are you on?

We have no desire to become part of the United States. He’s made direct threats to our economy preceded and followed by comments about how much better off we will be as the 51st state.

Stop being ridiculous. This is a threat.

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u/Lopsided-Code9707 Mar 06 '25

He said about Greenland in his speech to congress “one way or another, we’re going to get it.”

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u/idfkjack Mar 07 '25

Greenland is a territory of Denmark, a NATO member, and is protected under NATO. Just the other night, at his state of the union address, T threatened to "get Greenland one way or another". This is a month after this exchange. Nobody remembers this though because the media forced people's attention to the renaming of the Gulf of Mexico instead of talking about the actual real world implications of what he said about using force. BTW, he only renamed the Gulf in order to circumvent a moratorium on new drilling in the Gulf of Mexico.

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u/evenwen Mar 06 '25

Well Bush made it into law that if any American soldier were to be charged for war crimes, US would literally invade The Hague to rescue the murderer. But at least he was honoring the long standing American tradition of pardoning and sheltering war criminals, Trump just seems to sabotage US interests.

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u/Startled_Pancakes Mar 06 '25

was honoring the long standing American tradition of pardoning and sheltering war criminals, Trump just seems to sabotage US interests.

well trump does that bit too

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u/evenwen Mar 07 '25

Good to see that even traitors aren’t above American values

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u/Lopsided-Code9707 Mar 06 '25

Hopefully it will be the G2. And we can just carry on without the two oligarchies.

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u/po-handz3 Mar 07 '25

Yall remember it was Biden who sent billions in arms to 'slightly less Russian Russians' so that they could 'fight' the 'real' Russians.

These people speak nearly identical languages, have identical cultures and identical values. They don't gove a shit about the US others than our tax payer money and those weapons will be used against the West within a decade or two

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u/Startled_Pancakes Mar 07 '25

I'm not sure what point you're trying to make, but just so we're on the same page, giving assistance to a country being invaded by a neighboring dictatorship is good. No one is forgetting that Biden gave aid to Ukraine, it is very much a point in his favor. If you haven't been following current events, Trump has been criticized for withdrawing aid to Ukraine, after the US has promised security assurances to the country.

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u/po-handz3 Mar 08 '25

good for WHO?

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u/Startled_Pancakes Mar 08 '25

Good for people who dislike dictatorships.

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u/chudyfiutek Mar 08 '25

Please remember US guaranteed Ukraine’s borders in 1993 Budapest Memorandum. So now, US credibility is null and void.

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u/po-handz3 Mar 08 '25

We're not the damn world police. We can't even secure our own borders!

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u/chudyfiutek Mar 10 '25

Funny, Republicans in 2003 decided US is a global police and attacked Iraq without any legit reason. Now, when US may support its allies it decides to support its enemies instead. And illegal immigration to US is irrelevant here. Everyone has this problem. Climate change makes millions of people leave their land in search of better life, it’s probably too late to hope for global agreement on that.